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Many guys have found our GPR's to wear out quickly, perhaps in less than a year. Some decent aftermarket alternatives are available from NAPA and Autozone, but they wear out, too. Recently there was a discussion about how we really ought to have a heavier-duty relay, the factory spec one is not rated high enough. See this thread for background. redbrand measured the current through the GPR at about 112A max and suggested a Stancor 586 type relay as a suitable replacement -- rated at 600A inrush and 200A continuous. I found a Stancor 586-902 relay at Gopher Electronics for about $36 including shipping and decided to try it out. I ordered one, and it arrived today. It is about 2-3x bigger than the Motorcraft relay, but the mounting bracket looks like it will work without mods. Click here for photos. I will install it in the next few days and report back on how it goes, also post some more pics of it installed. Of course, the real test is how long it lasts -- and unless it proves to be a total wimp, I don't expect to be able to report back on that for a very long time. 
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Shoebear, that's a huge relay! Do they give any specs for trigger amperage requirements? I wouldn't want to overload the glow plug trigger wire/PCM. I'm not sure what the trigger is rated at now. Or maybe you are installing a huge manual switch too!!  Just thinking out loud??? Cheers... |
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Here is a PDF with the specs. Coil resistance is listed at 21 ohms which would give a bit less than 1A of current. Redbrand measured about 2A on coil of the factory relay. So I doubt if coil current will be a problem. Edited by shoebear (01/08/03 12:33 AM) |
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What's the resistance of the factory relay coil? Cheers! |
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I don't know the resistance on the factory coil, but I did my math backwards on my reply to Big Bopper. Instead of just over 2A (21/12 - wrong!) as I originally posted, it's just under 1A (12/21). I have edited my reply to be correct now. Since redbrand measured 2A on the factory relay. I think the Stancor will work OK. |
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Big Bopper and Patrick, When I install the relay I will double check the coil current of the my current NAPA relay, then of the Stancor relay, and report back. |
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Wow thats one big relay !! I was just browsing some pics on the freeauto site & came across this pic from a 99 & up relays - I wonder if the air heater relay would be a good replacement for ours also? In the pic it looks physically bigger so i wondered if it may last longer. I wouldnt have a clue on price of the air heater relay or how well they work in their current application. Just thinking out loud Cheers |
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Good luck Shoebear......you beat me to it  . Thats just what I am going to do. I haven't done it yet because my GPR is still doing it's job in life, but I sure it's time is coming very soon. I just found that one of my GP's is out. SO it looks like the GP system will be in need of some work. I am sure I will put the Stancor in then  . I am more than confindent about the coil amp rating and the contact ratings of the Stancor. The only thing is how well will it hold up to the heat of the engine. I still think it should be good to go.Going off of memory but I think the GPR (Napa/Autozone) replacements draw more current to pull the relay in than the Stancor. Hard to beat less than 1 amp of coil current on the Stancor contactor. There was a discussion some time back here about that how much the coil current draw is of the replacment GPRs. Show us some good pics when you are done! Good Luck. . |
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Thanks, Redbrand! It was your idea. You did say (in the previous thread) that anyone was free to run with it.  Renegade, the heater relay **looks** the same as the GPR. I wonder if they are the same part number? Do the 99+ PSD's have problems with short GPR life also? I don't know if physical size really makes the difference, but the Stancor is rated at 600A inrush and 200A continuous -- that's what I was interested in, not the physical size (as long as it will still fit easily). I don't know if the Stancor would be a drop-fit for a 99+, the heater relay might get in the way. OK, I couldn't resist -- I installed the Stancor this morning before work. Physical mounting was no problem. The Stancor mounting bracket fits the existing studs just fine. I oriented it with the contacts toward the center of the engine, next to the fuel filter bowl. The big wires had to be bent a little, but they were long enough, and there were no problems with routing. Before I removed my existing NAPA relay, I measured the coil current at about 3.5A. Then I measured the Stancor after I installed it -- 0.5A. Therefore, I think there will be no problem with excessive coil current draw. The Stancor spec sheet says, "Note: Caution must be used in coil selection for use in 12 volt systems where battery charging may expose coil to continuous, higher-than-rated voltage." Based on that, you could make a case for using the 15V version of the relay. I chose the 12V version because
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I am not an electrical guru by any means (my disclaimer) but I did tear one apart & it looks like if they would only make the contact disc out of something a lil better quality that 99% of our ailments would be nonexistant. I hope the relay does well as I'll try one too
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I checked the coil current draw of my old Motorcraft GPR tonight -- 4A. This means the NAPA draws a bit LESS (3.5A) than the Motorcraft, and the Stancor is way less (0.5A). So we can put to rest the idea that the Stancor draws too much coil current. Since I installed the Stancor relay, I have noticed hard starts and a puff of white smoke when it does start. Tonight, with my wife's help at the ignition switch, I checked the relay voltages carefully to be sure it is working right. All the voltages look good. The relay definitely turns on the GP's, and the GP's pull current. The large post connected to the GP's goes from 0V (relay off) to about 10.5V (relay on), then after 5-10 secs, climbs up to about 11V. This is about what I would expect. I also tested the voltage drop across the large posts while the relay operates. When it first turns on, I see about 75mV (0.075V), then it drops to about 50mV after 5-10 secs. This seems reasonable, and in line with what I've seen in other posts about what this should be. So the Stancor GPR is working OK, but I may have a bad GP or two. I didn't have time to check that tonight, I had to help put the kids to bed. [Added on edit: While I was at it, I monitored the system voltage while my wife started the engine. Even with the engine running, it never got above about 12V. So I think the 12V version of this relay is the correct choice, not the 15V version.] Sorry I haven't been able to post pics of the install yet, it's dark when I get home from work and my digital camera does not have a flash. I will take pics this weekend during daylight. Edited by shoebear (01/10/03 06:12 AM) |
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I have now uploaded pics of the Stancor GPR installed in my truck. top view close up of terminals |
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Just placed my order for my Stancor DC contactor  . My GPs,GPR and batteries are starting to rear their ugly heads under this cold weather  . Time for reaction to the action
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Redbrand, Good luck, let us (or at least me) know what you think. I'll bite -- what are the petrified french fries mentioned in your sig? |
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In reply to: Having two kids and on the go we have to hit the fast food places alot. So kids being kids -even dad- drop the fries in the floor. A good few months later when cleaning the truck out - low and behold under the seats are fries that are rock hard! I don't clean out the truck as much as I should
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Last Sunday ( the 12th) my truck wouldn't start in the AM. Very little voltage draw on my volt meter. 2 tries, no-go. Soooo, I jumped the BIG terminals on my GPR with a jumper cable and got the engine to fire. After work I found this thread and ordered a relay from Gopher. I put it in today (the 17th)although my orig. relay started working again but for how long?????. Ahhhhh, like a new truck and a very substantial savings!! Thanks guys. Dieselmann says the Ford relay is nitrogen filled. I guess that's to reduce arcing. I guess that if they built them like the Stancor they wouldn't need nitrogen. I think the nitrogen is a bandaid to cover a cheap part instead of building a part right in the first place. Oh well, I'm up and running like new and saved lots of $$$$$ Thanks again guys
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You're welcome! Keep Redbrand or me posted if you have any problems with it. The Stancor is sealed and may be nitrogen filled also. The spec sheet doesn't say. |
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12 below this morning and she fired up like spring time. No block heater and outside in the cold. The volt meter goes lower than before telling me that a better contact is being made to the glowplugs. smoother idle too with full power on the plugs now. time will tell how long it lasts.I don't expect to change it. I got 152k on the old one.
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Very cool!
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Hey guys, Wassupp!!! Me thinks my GPR is goin t/u. Where did ya find about this wonder GPR... I'm from Wa. State and iffin I don't plug her in she does'nt want to wake up.Probably need GP's to 
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Stancor heavy-duty GPR replacement in my opinion is a waste of money for the 2 seconds to install and 22.00 the NAPA one cost BAZ... |
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Blu-Oval, take a look at the first post in this thread, it has a link to the original thread that got me thinking about this. Originally it was Redbrand's idea, I just followed up and reported what I found. You should do some diagnostic work to find out what's really wrong, however -- it could be the GP's, wiring (fusible link), or batteries starting to get weak. Baz, it's not the install time or the cost -- but at $35, the Stancor pays for itself with the second regular GPR you have to replace -- it's the aggrevation of putting up with cold start problems until you finally get pissed enough to do something about it. Granted, there are several things that can cause cold start problems, GPR is only one of them -- but it goes bad fairly often and the Stancor has a high enough load rating that I expect and hope that it will take the GPR out of the cold start trouble picture. By the way, thanks for all your help on this board and your great web site! |
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You do have a point. i don't like having to fix something the first time and I hate having to do it more than once. 
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Steve, I had a heart attack when my NAPA guy tells me that a GPR was way over $100.00. I said no way but he insisted that that's what is shows. Dieselmann sells them for $75(Ford). $33. and change is more to my liking especially for a heavier duty unit. Auto Zone and Advance Auto had none listed. Auto Zone said "Dealer only". I'd like to buy one off of Dieselmann but budget doesn't allow it. I have to get raped at the pump(and other places) like every one else. I only have so much to go around. Time will tell if this part is superior to another part. I didn't bother to call a Dealer. Cheers |
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Mike, Your NAPA guy was wrong. Here is the NAPA GPR for 21.49 + S&H. I bought one locally a few months back and I think with tax it was around $24. The whole point of the Stancor is to have a relay that will last much longer -- hopefully for the life of the engine. To me, that is worth the extra $11 or so. |
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Howdy Just a reminder if you choose a Napa or Advance relay - Never ask for the part by the trucks year,make,model etc.. Just ask for the part # such as MR 99 or GPR 109 - it will save you a lot of grief Cheers |
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I have a question on the new relay. I just bisected my oll original one and the only problem was on the glowplug post side. It finaly arced enough that there was a bead of metal (molten at one time) that was preventing it from making a compleat contact to pass the amperage needed to fire the plugs. This post was the normal 1/4 or 5/16. What size is the one on the stancore, and what is it made of to prevent this beading of metal again. If I could only had been able to replace the post my original would still be flying in the truck. Thanks Jim |
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The external posts on the Stancor are the same size as the original GPR, and the large posts appear to be made of copper. Internally, the Stancor uses silver alloy contacts. I have not taken one apart, so I can't say how big the internal contacts are. Tha Stancore is rated for 600A inrush and 200A continuous, which is about double what our glowplugs should pull. This is what led Redbrand and me to think it would be a good fit as a GPR for our trucks. |
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Hi Renegade, I thought about that after I ordered the Stancor. I was so bent-out-a-shape by the local parts "experts" I didn't want anything to do with them. $33.00 for a heavier duty unit? I'm not sorry I bought it. I'm glad I wasn't a SUCKER  for buying that NAPA job. How many SUCKERS did they get on this part? Not me anyway. 
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Some people like to replace a part with what the parts houses have. Nothing wrong with that - they feel like they have done the right thing by buying the "replacement part". The OEM GP RELAY is just that - a RELAY that has a high current rating. The Stancor is a CONTACTOR which is is made to handle the big jobs in life. In the world of DC current you need a contactor to handle the DC current. You never see a relay in a high power DC circuit in the electrical world - they don't last. Ford uses a CONTACTOR to apply power to the starter on our trucks - ------ how many of those have you had to replace  as compaired to the GP relay. The Stancor is constructed the same way the starter sol. is made.The Stancor is only $11 bucks more and should out last the OEM gpr by about 2 to 1 or even maybe 3 to 1. . |
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This message is for shoebear, denden9 & redbrand. My name is JimMac, from Boston MA. I recently tried installing a new gpr on my 1996 7.3 liter powerstroke Ford f350. Please bear with me as I'm a rooky at this diesal repair stuff. The new gpr is an aftermarket $23.00 part number RY175. The part looked identical to the one that came out of the truck except for one thing- New part has 2 large copper posts and 2 small steel posts. The old part has 2 large copper posts but only 1 small steel post. I was told by the parts store that sometimes the newer gpr's have less posts on them, so just hook up the wires on the new part the same way as they were on the old part and to just disregard the extra smaller steel post. Well I put it all together and the glow plugs made a clicking noise like usual, but the engine didn't turn over at all-no starter/engine spin. No power. I'm wondering if there is some kind of circuit breaker that I tripped in the process of repairing it. I know there are circuit breakers in the main power box consol. I also used a coating of dielectric grease on all parts, posts,wire connectors, even the batterries. Could this dielectric grease be causing bad connections? The connections on the old part were as follows: Standing on the passenger side wheel well, the gpr is attached to the wheel well. Looking downward, 5 wires are connected to the right side larger copper post. 1 wire is connected to the left side larger copper post. 1 small wire is connected to the top little steel post (this connector is a boot style slip on connector much like a spark plug, only smaller) That's it for the wiring-nothing on the bottom, because there is no bottom post. But the new part has 4 posts total. I tried the last boot style connector on the bottom small steel post after the original hookup failed, but with the same results- the glow plugs click, but there is no further power to the system. I'm sure this sounds like simple stuff to you guys and I appreciate your patience with me, after all this should've been a simple job, but I'm having trouble with it. It's amazing how the new part is exactly the same as the old part - except for the extra post. That little small boot type connector that I talked about goes to some sort of small rectangular capacitor or something right next to the gpr on the left. Maybee I should just send away for the stancor 586-902 upgrade, but that also has 4 posts. Perhaps the circuit is not complete when that 4'th post was not used, so maybee it should be grounded to the truck frame? This is just me thinking out loud-I don't know. Please help if you can. Of course I had to pick the coldest winter in years to screw with this, and now I need the truck for sanding. Thanks for your help guys. |
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It sounds to me like you thought you were replacing the GPR, but you actually replaced the starter relay. The GPR is located under the decorative engine cover on top of the engine. Most of the GPRs will have 4 terminals (2 large, 2 small). Some of the early GPR's on the PSDs (mine included) had a GPR with the 2 large terminals and a single two-wire weatherpack connection for the small ones. I hope you kept your old starter relay! Cheers! |
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mr. feeley is right, you have to undo what you did and start over. do you know where the fuel filter is? |
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Yes, you replaced the starter relay, not the GPR. The starter relay is grounded through the base (the base is, in effect, the second small post), whereas the GPR is not grounded through the base. Click here for a pic showing GPR location. The pic shows the Stancor, but it is the correct location. |
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Wow, do I feel like a piece of dung!!! Like I said, I'm a rookie at this stuff. I'm not afraid to try, but definately need guidance. I went to the parts store with the original motocraft 3-pronged starter relay switch in hand, and they found a match, so they gave it to me on exchange, I came home and checked with you guys on line here and then found out I need a book on my powerstroke to help me find out where exactly these parts are located. I can't thank you guys enough for the help. I needed the truck to sand tommorrow and was worried if I'd make it. It took about 1 hour to change the part back to square one, but I used the brand new one I had unknowingly picked up. Truck started right up since it was plugged in. So now over the weekend I'll change the gpr (thanks for the pictures shoebear) with greater confidence this time around. By the way, where would be a good place to purchase a shop manual for the 7.3 liter powerstroke diesal engine? Thanks again for your help. JimMac. |
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I was in the electronic parts store yesterday picking up parts to build a homemade AIC, and I found these gprs on a shelf. I had to do a double take and then I picked one up and looked it over carefully and it's the exact same one pictured on the first thread of this post. I can remember the name but I was going to write down some specs from what I read on this post and see if it is the exact one. It sure looked the same. The thing I liked was the price of it...$12.50. I will let you know. Peace from Tejas, Todd |
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Gopher has raised the price on the Stancor 586-902 DC contactor so that it's no longer competitive. One good place to get it now is Allied Electronics. As of now, they have them for $41 plus shipping. The link will take you to their main page, then you have to do a search. Do a mfr# search on 586-902, or an Allied Stock number search for 576-1078. If you find a better price somewhere, please post it here. |
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Stancor heavy-duty GPR replacement ??
Re: Stancor heavy-duty GPR replacement ??
Re: Stancor heavy-duty GPR replacement ??
