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3408 Cat

128K views 43 replies 31 participants last post by  wrrn73 
#1 ·
I was wondering if any of the trucks (over the road) came with these engines? I seen a old 1980 379 Pete show truck with one in it for sale in a truck paper. It had a old air shift 6x4....I think tranny. Can't remember what brand of tranny it had though. Tim
 
#27 ·
No one's made mention of the 3408 internals! The crankshaft had modified throws to provide 90 degree V performance, while fitted within its block which was narrowed well below the bulky 90 degree of traditional engines, resulting in better fit within frames rails amongst other things. Each crank throw or rod journal still held two rods, but they were offset. The appearance of this was that someone had cut each journal mid point and slid the two sides past each other, although forging and machining was the actual method.
I had a good look at a few we did out of frames on, kind of made you wonder how they held up with all the sharp edges and radiused surfaces to maintain.
 
#28 ·
[ QUOTE ]
A bit of history: In 1931, Clessie Cummins, founder of the Cummins Engine Company, drove across the United States to demonstrate off the viability of his new diesel engine. While descending Cajon pass in California (something that took real cajones in those days), the brakes failed on his truck and he and his pals barely survived the hairy ride. After that experience, Cummins devised the idea of an engine brake to supplement the use of wheel brakes on diesel trucks, especially for use on long downgrades.

Cummins developed the compression release engine brake in 1954 and shopped the idea around, but none of the major engine manufacturers were interested. His brother's son introduced him to the Jacobs Manufacturing Company, established in 1903 by A.I. Jacobs, makers of the world famous three jaw Jacobs Drill Chuck. The Jacobs company ran with the idea and marketed a successful line of compression release and other types of brakes. The firm split in 1986 and chuck manufacturing now takes place in Clemson, South Carolina, while engine brake producition remains in Bloomfield, Connecticut under the Jacobs Vehicle Systems name.


[/ QUOTE ]...stands to reason that a jake brake would work better with a Cummins engine.

[ QUOTE ]
All of the brake systems made by Jacobs Vehicle Systems can accurately be called "jake brakes," not just their compression release engine brakes. They also produce the Jacobs Exhaust Brakes and Jacobs Driveline Brakes, both of which are nearly silent. The engine brakes are the ones that make that distinctive staccato sound, and if I could make a WAV, I'd include my imitation of it here.

The Jacobs company blames the loud noise you hear from passing trucks on the use of engine brakes in vehicles with poorly muffled or unmuffled exhaust systems (straight pipes, for example), exhaust systems that have been illegally modified or are poorly maintained, and/or truckers who simply enjoy making noise. Because of this, the Jacobs company feels that it's inaccurate, unfair, and maybe illegal to use their trademarked name in the generic sounding "NO JAKE BRAKES" signs, especially since some of their other jake brakes are quiet and noisy compression release engine brakes are made by other companies, too. These signs are often seen in residential areas adjacent to a highway. The federal government has required all vehicles manufactured since 1978 to meet noise requirements.

[/ QUOTE ]


Now the old air-over-oil retarders on the CAT motors were great (About the only thing I liked about those motors). They would hold a 129,000lb set of doubles back better than the Jake on my Cummins would hold 82,000lbs back. They added a few extra pounds, and you had to watch the oil temps, but they did a pretty good job.
 
#29 ·
LOREN - So THAT'S why the 3408 crank is/was SO EXPENSIVE. I remember hearing it was $15,000 back in the mid-80's. "Installation was Extra" Bearing insert replacement on both mains & rods was frequent just to protect the crank.
People talk bad about the "903-cum-a-part" but like anything mechanical if properly cared for they lasted as long as anything else available at the time. They were a thirsty 320-350 HP engine however. That more than anything killed them off in O-t-R trucks. Company I drove for had five 903-powered Whites and Mine was the only one that had engine problems. I bent two con-rods when (very) loose intake manifold bolts let rain water fill two cylinders. We had WAY more problems with the Shiny 290 & 350 Cum-a-parts, but then they had a few more miles on them too. One I liked suffered a broken wrist pin. Only thing holding the front end of the block to the back end of the block was the blocks top deck. Rod almost sawed the engine in two!
 
#30 ·
We have a Cat 3408 in one of our tankers at the firehouse. It is a 1985 Ford Tandem Axle Cabover Chassis that we purchased from the government. It served 2 duties. It had a removable tank that was used to spray acid for something at Nasa and It also had a fifth wheel hitch and pintle hitch on the rear for a tow vehicle. That is the only thing that was listed on the paperwork. Said it was issued to Nasa and was an acid truck and towing vehicle. It was shipped from Ford with that engine.

Right now it lives it life out hauling 3,000 gallons of water. We can run out of gears before it runs out of power. It is only a 5 speed, needs to be more. There is a large gap in the gears between 3-4, but other than the gearing making it slow to gain speed, it will haul it at 65-70 easily, though we normally keep our speed under that.

It takes about 1/4 mile to go through all the gears because it revs up to the shift line so quick.
 
#39 ·
Yup, a late friend use to work for the Cat dealer back in the day. Said he had a customer who's truck was turned up. Engine maxed out the chassis dyno and it was either a 600 or 700HP unit too!

But, unfortunately, they did love their diesel.....didn't sip it, gulped it!
 
#33 ·
We've been using the 3400 series engines for years here in the Gulf. Usually on fire pumps or crane engines. We have two 3412s and two 3406s on this location. All are turboed. Of course the 3406s are inline and the 3412s are V-block. They do use a lot of fuel but are damn good engines.
 
#34 ·
Our '87 Chevy C-70 dumper has a 3208 non-turbocharged Cat in it. So far it has been a great engine to us. It's got a little over 200k on it and the only thing that has gone bad on it was a governor relay. It makes good power, pulls good, and gets fair mileage, usually 8mpg empty, and about 6 loaded. The truck is liscenced for 45k, and it has moved all of it without fail. Tops out at 65mph.
 
#35 ·
Judging from the comments, I'd say most of you guys weren't around in the days of the "Large Cars". True, the 3408 sucked the fuel, but at $0.75 a gallon, so what? They did come "turbo-ed", some of em even twin, and since they were mechanical pumps you could turn em way up, and they would take it too, so the sky was the limit. Mine was putting out 660 horses on the dyno. Of course the black smoke would hide the trailer when you really got on it. Had to be careful about that though, it would snap an input shaft or twist a drive shaft right into. I miss my 3408 but times have changed. I'm still doin cats, but it's now a single turbo c-15 550, and it'll more than do the job.

There's nothing this side of heaven
that can chase away my ills
like twin stacks, blowing black
over 18 screaming wheels

Keep on trucking
 
#37 ·
The 3408 Cat was an AWESOME engine!

This was possibly the most under-rated engine ever produced. I honestly think it was Caterpillar's 427 Big Block Chevy so to speak. Same firing order too! The stock 450 HP V-8 used a 380 hp 3406 A model injector nozzle from the factory. A 400 hp 3406 A model injector would bring the V-8 to life without touching a thing and there was plenty more you could do to it! A few turns of the screw and a set of 400 A model injectors would make this engine walk up a hill like a car! The pre-combustion chamber V-8's were the ones to give it a bad rap on fuel mileage....the DI (direct injection) V-8's were much better. A 3408 V-8 would easily out do a 400 hp 3406 A model Cat on economy with way more power. Not to dispute anyone's post but a good mechanic who could perform a top-shelf over-head valve adjustment would make them run smooooth as silk. Very impressive engine in the right hands. There were a few good hot-rod mechanics around in the good old days that could really make them "walk the dog" and make them run like a raped-ape. A true luxury engine to say the least. 1099 C.I.D. and extremely reliable. "You won't be late with a 3408" I ran coast-to-coast for years mostly from the northeast to the northwest but they were very hard on the drive train especially with a heavy loads on steep grades in the southwest during the extreme summer temperatures. I split an auxiliary transmission diagonally in half one day passing another truck in Montana where I was running out of at the time. Another good mechanic that I got to know over time had replaced an axillary that a KTA 600 broke a few weeks before but said he had never seen such an "air-conditioned box" like the one on my extended hood 359 that the V-8 destroyed....you could easily see the gears in it before taking it out of the truck. My last truck (KW-900L) had a 3406 E 550HP with 1.770,000 on the original transmission when I sold it....which was only taken out of the truck one time at 1,050,000 to replace the original clutch. It was overhauled for the first and only time at 1.200,000 before I sold it. There were only 18,000 3408's put in the frame rails of on-highway use trucks. They had a 28V**** serial number if I recall. Most were Caterpillar yellow but the one I had was white which I kinda liked especially in a black truck with chrome and polished aluminum. . I think November 1985 was the last on-highway truck to come with a 3408 from the factory. The following year a 503 HP 3408 B model was available in off-highway trucks. The 3408 B was even better on fuel than the DI version with more torque. Remember this was 503 HP at the fly-wheel without air-to-air compared to the 500 HP 998 C.I.D. Mack V-8 with air-to-air. Big difference! Never seen a naturally aspirated V-8 Cat in an on-highway truck (large car) but there were a few top-shelf mechanics who would twin turbo the V-8 as far back as 1979. A stock factory 450 would put about 510 HP to the ground by adding an air-to-air cooler/set-up without any other modifications. There were a few air-to-air 3408 B models around that were putting a reliable 650 HP to the ground. The old twin-overhead cam 1693 was the bulldozer engine of the highway before the V-8 back when the left lane was called the "Monfort Lane" named after the meat hauling company than ran out of Greeley Colorado. The 1693's had a unique sound and some would call them a clatter-cat (in a good way) and a hot-rodded 3406 was called an 0dd-Six like the .30-06 rifle cartridge. Some of the folks in the NW (logging country) would call the V-8 a "wildcat" and they were quite popular in the high country. A good friend from the old school said my V-8 with 6" straight pipes sounded like an old 55 Ford. The stories are countless and very memorable! And remember when Roadway drivers would get on their radio (side channels) and tell their buddy's up the road to wait for me to pass them and listen to my engine as I went by. Back when the speed limit was 55 nationwide I actually had people in cars that drove for a living pull in behind me to ask what kind of engine I had because it pulled so strong. I've heard it all over the years. The 3408 was a very fun and enjoyable engine that always made the trip that much better! The 3408 Cat and KTA 600 Cummins were the Ali vs Frazier - Thrilla in Manila of their day. The BIG Blocks of the highway! Other than the old narrow-hoods the extended hood 359's & 900 A models were the 55 Chevy's of their day too!!! Sad to think those days are long gone an will never return. Sorry, and no offense but todays' generation has no idea of the freedoms they are willing to give up and our shameless politicians are working day and night to take away.

But none-the-less best of luck to you....

Be safe!!!

NRA Benefactor Life Member
 
#41 ·
I would love to have a 3408. I am trying to figure if I could make it work in a 2018 peterbilt 389? Or what would it take to make it happen. Does anyone know of a really good mechanic to rebuild it the right way. And how could I make it driving around the US. I don't know if I could drive it in California but I was hoping someone on hear could give me advice on how to get one built and what would the restrictions would be on where I could drive. Any advice and help would be greatly appreciated. I am just starting in the truck world. Have always wanted to drive my whole life. I was in the Army for 11 years and what I put my body through, driving a truck is something that will keep the surgery's down and I can't sit behind a desk. So thank you for your help.
 
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