Depends on what you want from your X, what your driving and towing needs are, and what your comfort level is. A chip requires a litle mechanical ability and higher risk tolerance. Your Ford engine warranty is in all probability non-existant after installing a high performance chip. A PPIII is a brain dead install and is not as likely to lead to warranty problems. Also you do not need to install guages with the PPIII which you do need to do with a chip install. I like my PPIII's ( I have 2) but would like the Western Diesel chip for laughs and giggles. Since I tow with my Mack truck rather than my CC, I can't justify the WD chip and the warranty concerns are not worth the hassle. Others will choose a different path which makes the world an interesting place.
PolarBear,
Correct me if you know something I don't but if you install a ppiii or any type of performance chip you will get a code that shows there was some communication change in the truck.
If all you are doing in a PSD is running around and having fun you also won't need a set of gauges with a Turbo Chip unless you want to see how fast the truck will run on a regular basis. If you tow or are a real pedal to the metal guy then I would reccomend gauges wuith any performance modification etc.
Mark Western Diesel
Firstly, the language I used was "not as likely to lead to warranty problems". By this I meant to convey that there are warranty concerns with the PPIII as there are with any PCM modification. I am aware that the PPIII sets a traceable code that can trigger warranty issues.
Secondly, a chip leaves obvious physical evidence of its installation. From numerous posts on this board, it appears that some technicians at some dealerships look for the telltale signs and use the information to void the engine warranty. A programmer does not leave behind obvious eveidence of PCM modifications. Anyone using due diligence will take these risk factors into consideration.
Thirdly, I think you will agree with me that your WD chip is not a casual performance install. Most users who purchase the WD chip do so because it is the premium chip optimized for towing performance. This is not to say that the chip does not also provide serious non towing performance enhancement; it clearly does. But the fact is that for most users, towing is part of the reason for the WD install and it follows that guages are also required. In contrast, the PPIII is a modest performance upgrade that does not inherently require a guage install as well. As I pointed out in my initial post, it is a matter of what type of performance gain one is seeking, and how comfortable one is with a small degree of risk.
PB-
Thought your post was pretty clear first time around----sometimes hype and salesmanship can really muck up an issue
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Y2K X Limited, 4x4, PSD, 3.73LS, , All Alpine with 3 Amps-8 speakers-and 2 10 subs, Movie Vision , Fumoto, Bilsteins, Helwig rear bar, K&N, Rancho SS , 550 X code springs, Air Ride rear bags, Remote start, , PPIII, and the roof rack OFF
Polar Bear,
Sorry if I offended you it was not meant that way at all. I read your post as a ppiii wouldn't leave a trace of the install which as you confirmed isn't true. The first thing a dealer is going to do for any driveability issue is pull codes and the communication code will show up on a ppiii just like anything else.
As far as gauges you would be real surprised at the egts we produce vs a ppiii. Their max hp is at 3100 rpm, ours is at 2600 rpm. That alone is a a good 150 plus degrees of lower egt. Put a trailer behind it and you'll even see more. The ppiii max torque is at 2500 rpm and we're at 2000, again much lower egts.That was the point of my telling Riflescopes that if all he's doing is empty running etc he wouldn't need gauges for our Turbo Chip. Actually the selesman in me wants to tell him he needs the gauges, but that's not how we operate here. Sell them what they need, don't load their boat with unnecessary items. Have a good one and again I apoligize if you were offended, it wasn't meant that way at all!
Mark Western Diesel
Polar Bear,
Sorry if I offended you it was not meant that way at all. I read your post as a ppiii wouldn't leave a trace of the install which as you confirmed isn't true. The first thing a dealer is going to do for any driveability issue is pull codes and the communication code will show up on a ppiii just like anything else.
As far as gauges you would be real surprised at the egts we produce vs a ppiii. Their max hp is at 3100 rpm, ours is at 2600 rpm. That alone is a a good 150 plus degrees of lower egt. Put a trailer behind it and you'll even see more. The ppiii max torque is at 2500 rpm and we're at 2000, again much lower egts.That was the point of my telling Riflescopes that if all he's doing is empty running etc he wouldn't need gauges for our Turbo Chip. Actually the salesman in me wants to tell him he needs the gauges, but that's not how we operate here. Sell them what they need, don't load their boat with unnecessary items. Have a good one and again I apoligize if you were offended, it wasn't meant that way at all!
Mark Western Diesel
It never crossed my mind to take offence. Living in a family of academics and lawyers, it is an everyday occurence to have ones ideas challenged and tested.Such challenges are hardly personal attacks justifying personal offence. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Now being called a salesman might warrant taking umbrance. [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]
With the PPIII installed without any other modifications I could easily peg my EGT gauge at above 1,500 degrees.
With the PPIII installed, an Amsoil two stage foam filter and a 4" exhaust from the down pipe back I can still if not paying attention on a steep long grade under load reach 1,400 degrees. I have to constantly monitor the temp and back off the engine to maintain a below 1,300 operating condition.
I have a dealer who made it very clear from the start after noticing my upgraded gauges, and exhaust that I had better not run any "chips" as he would make sure it voided my warranty. I always remove the programming at least a week ahead of taking it in and have not had any problems. Just replaced my turbo for what the dealer considered excessive oil in the intercooler due to my complaint of a very small oil leak. They tightened the hose, which stopped the leak, but they insisted on the turbo change.
I had read from a former post on the same topic that after some 40 or so on and off engine cycles that the memory would clear. It also makes sense that when I have contacted the dealer about reading a code from a service engine light that has come on and gone off that I need to bring it in right away as they can not read it later.
Food for thought?
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2004 Ford Excursion 4x4 Eddie Bauer 04 6.0L B/D 10/24/03
2001 TrailBay 31BHSS W/Slideout
1964 Karmann Ghia Coupe
Polar Bear, Being an attorney, as you are, I would think sales is a step up, reputationwise, [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]
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Ferraris do not break down, They just sometimes stop to be admired [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
1970 Brabham BT29 Formula B Race Car Blue/black
1999 Ferrari 355 F1 Berlinetta Red/Tan
2000 Excursion Limited 7.3 2X4 White/Grey
2002 Excursion Limited Ultra 7.3 2X4 White/Tan
2002 Mercedes CLK 320 Blue/Grey (wife's car)
POLAR BR - I agree with Ferraridriver. A step up. [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img] Have a great weekend.
John
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2000 Excursion Limited PSD 4X4 Dark Satin Green/Medium Parchmant Born 7/00 In-Service 10/00 All Factory Options except Transfer Skid Plate
Morning PSDer's,
Wheeeeeew you guys are tough sometimes. I missed this post the last couple of days and then I saw the lawyer comments, later after I got off of the floor from laughing I had to respond how much I enjoy some of the humor I see here on occassion.
Mark Western Diesel
The first chip i would put in your x would be a Power Force chip. I have been using there chips before some of these companies jumped on the ban wagon/ Had know problems with them.
Both the PPIII and the WD chip state that they improve transmission shifting on the automatic. Can anyone speak pros or cons about the WD's shifting? I have a PPIII, and the shifting is better, but I think that folks could do better than what the PPIII offers. Is the WD the answer there?
I haven't towed yet, with 18k miles in 6 months. I'm an occasional pedal to the medal guy, but I do enjoy the huge grin when I exercise my ankle.
My wife likes the benefit that the PPIII gives, but is a more timid driver. I had planned on getting a WD chip eventually, and putting the PPIII in her truck (until she beats me over the head for her own WD chip...). It's a little rude of me, but I usually test everything in my truck, then put the leftovers into hers. [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]
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