Factory Aluminum wheel question? - Diesel Forum

ddog · 07-14-2004, 06:14 PM

I searched the forums and read the little secrets wheel section and maybe I missed it [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shrug.gif[/img]. Was it ever determined if the factory E-series aluminum wheel from Alcoa is hub piloted/centered or lug(stud)piloted/centered? I had the dealer swap my Ultra Pacer aluminum wheels from my 93 E-350 Chateau Gasser when I traded up to the 03 E-350 Chateau PSD. I am think of upgrading this wheel as I don't believe it has sufficient load carrying ability (rim is marked 65psi max inflation, likely indicating not suitable for Load range E tires?)and still have some minor vibration even after a 100 dollar balance job at goodyear.They match mounted the tires and rims which was a vast improvement over the balance job by the dealer but still not quite perfect. Dealer had also used incorrect style weights on the rim. From comparison to specs in the other posts, this WHEEL for the E-350 has the same specifications as the factory wheel.I see from the posts that everyone out there with the factory aluminum wheels seem real happy with them, I just like the style of this one better and the price(with caps,lugs and all) is not much more than they are getting for factory take offs. According to southwestwheel this wheel is stud piloted(centered).My current wheels are stud centered and tightening and torquing by hand is crucial to minimizing vibration.If the factory aluminum wheels are also stud/lug piloted,given the specs this Alcoa wheel should be ok right? I realize the Alcoa wheel is forged and higher quality versus my current Ultra wheel which I believe is cast. Thanks in advance for any input and apologize for the long windedness. BTW LarryM as you can see from my use of terminology I have read all the posts on the lug v. hub centric(piloted) debates [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img].I too prefer safety related items to meet or exceed factory specs. Any PSD vanners in Southwest Florida or any where in Florida or L.A.(that's Lower Alabama for the west coasters)for that matter since I occassionally travel to Pensacola where I grew up.

Larry M · 07-14-2004, 06:36 PM

All OEM wheels such as the factory al. are "hub piloted" just as the 99+ F-series that are called hub-centric are ... the only difference is the fastening systems that are used "flat washer" vs. the "beveled seat/conical nut". This lug-centric or lug nut centered is only something used in the aftermarket jargon when they open up the hub pilot on the wheel so it will "fit" (more or less) on more than one OEM system.

Larry
keeper of the <font color="blue">"little secrets" </font> CLICK HERE [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

ddog · 07-14-2004, 08:34 PM

I understand the "jargon" [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].As you can see from the specifications page for the Alcoa "aftermarket" wheels they use the correct "jargon" as I understand it from the prior posts including those from the wheel designer although I dont remember his sig with out looking back.The "pilot" type is listed as "stud" or "hub" and most if not all of the Alcoa "aftermarket" wheels for 99and up Ford SD and X's are in fact Hub piloted and some of those require you to use the oem fastening system. Not to belabor this issue or that I doubtyour reply, but have you or any else seen the OEM aluminum wheel and confirmed that is in fact hub piloted and/or is the hub pilot size of the OEM aluminum wheel published somewhere? I haven't seen the vanners that own these wheels specify which system it is.Just trying to determine the suitability of the aftermarket Alcoa compared to the Factory alcoa and if any differences exist [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shrug.gif[/img].My guess is either is an improvement over my current wheel. Thanks

XRACER · 07-14-2004, 09:37 PM

I bought a set of Alcoa wheels from Southwest Wheel. Then I started reading about hub centricity and the 4.89" vs. the 5.15" bore. And then I researched the balance issues and looked for a place that could balance the wheels while still on the van. Then I got worried about run out, and vibration, and harmonics, and bearings, and before I knew it, nearly three months had gone by and I was still scared to put them on the van.

So I bought a set of tires and mounted them.

Everything's fine.

flcracker · 07-15-2004, 06:24 AM

Hey ddog i'm in Naples work up in Ft. Myers. I have a 2000 PSD Chateau.
Great to see some body else from this area. Pete

bork · 07-15-2004, 09:55 AM

Newbe wannabe. I live in Ftlauderdale and Sebastian.Looking for e350 psd xtended xlt 15 pass. Hoping to find 2000 for around $9,000-11,000.
Getting discouraged. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

ddog · 07-15-2004, 11:20 AM

Bork, Can I assume you have done a search on Auto Trader? When I was looking there seemed to be more Extended diesels than regular ones. You'll have an easier time finding an Extended passenger van w a PSD than a cargo van. Also you may want to contact Jose Melendez jose@brandonford.comat Brandon Ford in Tampa, Fl. They are a large dealership and may be able to locate one for you.I bought my 03 from him June 12 of this year. Found it searching Autotrader. Great dealership, easy negotiations (none of that back and forth to the sales manager crap)worth the drive.He even e-mailed me pics and pulled the ford oasis report for me and faxed it over before I went up to look at it.He also offered the Carfax report but I had pulled it already.Plus if you buy one from him and tell him I sent you I get $50 bucks [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img]. Just so we keep this on topic, if you find one with Factory aluminum wheels let me if they are Hub piloted?

Larry M · 07-15-2004, 11:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Not to belabor this issue or that I doubtyour reply, but have you or any else seen the OEM aluminum wheel and confirmed that is in fact hub piloted and/or is the hub pilot size of the OEM aluminum wheel published somewhere?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you read all those threads in the Wheels section of the "little secrets" and pay close attention to the posts by Popeye who designs them and FMTRVT who lives and breathes wheels and brakes professionally their word is all that I need and their comments are in there somewhere ... I'm just too lazy to look for them since I made my decision a long time ago that only OEM wheels will go on my Van. I'm not positive of exact hub pilot size, but based on my decision it's not an issue.

Larry
keeper of the <font color="blue">"little secrets" </font> CLICK HERE [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

DieselDeaf · 07-15-2004, 12:28 PM

What exactly was the question??

The van wheels are exactly the same as the F-series wheels and still are, that being F-series 250's and 350's thru model year 1997.

ddog · 07-16-2004, 12:46 PM

"What exactly was the question??"

The simple version without my long windedness:Is the Ford OEM wheel that fits the vans hub piloted(centered, centric)or stud piloted (centered,centric).After reviewing the previous posts by Popeye and FMTRV? as suggested by LarryM, they both state all Ford OEM wheels are hub piloted.Sounds like they both work for Ford or a Ford supplier/vendor but their bios don't state it as such.I was justlooking for confirmation from someone here that owns a set. I have posed this question to the folks at Alcoa to get an answer and perhaps some input straight from the horses mouth so to speak since they manufacture the OEM wheel as well as a strikingly similar version aftermarket.The Alcoa aftermarket wheel has great specs but is stud piloted. As a side note, If you try to build a van at Ford's website,you can only get the E-350 with aluminum wheels in the 5.4L gas engine NOT the diesel.Also the aluminum wheels get 225-75R16E not the 245's.Has it always been this way? Anyone know why?

toalpi · 07-16-2004, 10:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is the Ford OEM wheel that fits the vans hub piloted(centered, centric)or stud piloted (centered,centric).

[/ QUOTE ]Both the aluminum and the steel wheels are technically hub piloted. I couldn't get the aluminum wheels on the 94 but I was able to on the 97. [ QUOTE ]
If you try to build a van at Ford's website,you can only get the E-350 with aluminum wheels in the 5.4L gas engine NOT the diesel.Also the aluminum wheels get 225-75R16E not the 245's.Has it always been this way? Anyone know why?

[/ QUOTE ] Are you sure that you were not building a wagon (5 or more seats and windows all around) at some point. The wagons have a lower GVWR and that is the only way an E350 can have 225 tires. I'm pretty sure that the wagons and the RV Prep Package can still get the aluminum wheels. Both of mine had the RV P/P. You can't order the RV P/P unless the van is going to a Ford authorized bodybuider.

whd507 · 07-17-2004, 01:30 AM

my alcoas from my 95 F-350, are hub-centric, and they fit my 96 E-350 which is also hub-centric. the bolt holes are over-sized, so lug-centric apps would wobble, as they do not have tapered holes.

(all non-tapered rims would have to be hub-centric)

toalpi · 07-17-2004, 02:04 AM

[ QUOTE ]
my alcoas from my 95 F-350, are hub-centric, and they fit my 96 E-350 which is also hub-centric. the bolt holes are over-sized, so lug-centric apps would wobble, as they do not have tapered holes.

(all non-tapered rims would have to be hub-centric)

[/ QUOTE ] It sounds like you are saying that your wheels don't have tapered holes??? And don't use a conical lug nut???? If that is the case then they are not the stock wheels.

ddog · 07-17-2004, 09:58 AM

[ QUOTE ]
my alcoas from my 95 F-350, are hub-centric, and they fit my 96 E-350 which is also hub-centric. the bolt holes are over-sized, so lug-centric apps would wobble, as they do not have tapered holes.

(all non-tapered rims would have to be hub-centric)

[/ QUOTE ]

This sounds like a Unilug wheel. Are the holes slightly oval and do you use a long lug nut that goes partially(about75%) into the hole for centering? This is how they used to make multiapplication wheels and its not done this way anymore as I am aware.A true Hub piloted wheel will be automatically centered when installed before you even put the lug nuts on and can on occasion be difficult to remove since the tolerance between the hub and the wheel is close.Ever had a rear brake drum difficult to remove because the center hole of the drum sticks to the lip on the hub? The system they use for centering a brake drum is the same system a Hub pilot wheel employs as I understand stand it.With a hub piloted wheel it shoud be centered and run straight with as few as two lug nuts installed(Just as an example, NOT advocating this!)

ddog · 07-17-2004, 10:15 AM

"Are you sure that you were not building a wagon (5 or more seats and windows all around) at some point. The wagons have a lower GVWR and that is the only way an E350 can have 225 tires. I'm pretty sure that the wagons and the RV Prep Package can still get the aluminum wheels. Both of mine had the RV P/P. You can't order the RV P/P unless the van is going to a Ford authorized bodybuider."

Iwas building a E-350 SD Club Wagon(not that i can afford one). Added the diesel engine which automatically checks off the Steel wheels with "sport" covers and the 245 Tires. If you then try to change the wheel to the Aluminum wheel it deletes the diesel, switches it to 5.4 gas and specs the 225 tire but still a load range E tire and still a E-350 Wagon.Didnt try a cargo or 15 pass extended to see if you can get the Aluminum wheel with the diesel.Still waiting for a reply from Alcoa. Any one with the Factory OEM wheel put an end to this thread?