Question Once and For All

[underpsi]

Ford can be picky about their warranty issuse. They can put the WDS on the truck and see if any chip or module has been used.

[McRat]

From what I understand, the 6.0 uses a PCM (Programmable Control Module). You should download your stock tune first and store it (AKA SuperChips or HyperTech) then upload new parameters. When it's time to take it to the dealer, you reload your stock tune.

On ANY engine that uses a PCM, you can REALLY F'K UP an engine with a lousy program. FoMoCo as a corporate policy has never endorsed re-programming their engines. Neither does any other mfr. Ford has voided the driveline warranties on a least 5 2003 Cobra's that I'm personally aware of due to chipping the ECU to make more boost. One of my good friends blew the motor up (shrapnel) and let the bank repo the car because the it would cost him $10,000 to get a new motor.

So speed-demons, get a well done tune by a company with extensive experience in your model of engine, but leave the "tune" in your toolbox when you visit your dealer.

<--- Has 12 different "tunes" for Z06 Corvette. Self-taught tuner. 11.92@116 stock with tires and tune. What the dealer don't know, won't hurt them. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

P.S. - When I get my 6.0 I'm leaving it bone stock. Nose grows 1 foot

[THEBUNDO]

[ QUOTE ]
From what I understand, the 6.0 uses a PCM (Programmable Control Module). You should download your stock tune first and store it (AKA SuperChips or HyperTech) then upload new parameters. When it's time to take it to the dealer, you reload your stock tune.

[/ QUOTE ]
It doesn't work that way on the 6.0. Plus, they can have other "untouchable" areas to store an ongoing record of changes. "Caveat emptor"

[rickibrat2]

i was told the others day that dodge now has a program that will detect if an engine has had a chip installed, and the coding has been altered even if it was returned back to stock before going to a dealer
rick

[QuadBoenker]

OK first off if you have read some of my other posts, I won't tell you Ford won't void or can't void your warranty. I am also not going to say if you install performance products (mine or others) that it will void your warranty. I never have and never will refer anyone to the M&M act. That is bogus.

Here is what I will say. If you un-plug and remove our module, it is NOT traceable, not even with a WDS. If your truck sets a code, it was supposed to to help the tech diagnose your problems. I will give an example.

WE had a gentlemen in Canada take his truck in because it was running poorly, with the module on or off. He removed everything and took it to his local dealer. He called me worried because he had some sort of Turbo boost code (I don't recall which one). He was used to the 7.3L's where they set overboost. This was not the case and the tech diagnosed the truck to have a faulty actuator valve. I believe the just replaced the turbo. This seems to be a somewhat common problem, it set the proper code, and then they fixed it. In all of this they never had a clue he had done anything. Nor did the module have anything to do with probolem he had, as it is somewhat common. This was some time ago and he is problem free to this date as I know.

Over time they may incorporate some sort of way to try and trace any aftermarket items, but then we will change the way we do things as well. I agree that there have been problems that aren't Ford's, but it would be ridiculous to blame everything on the aftermarket guys. Most of the aftermarket companies do enough research and testing to release a reliable product. Almost all of us also offer extreme products, when you buy these you must be careful, and know what you are dealing with. There is nothing wrong with high hp vehicles, you just can't abuse them. If you have a 500hp truck and all you care to do is run through mud bogs on the weekend, expect some tranny problems, or other problems. Likewise if you are towing 15k-20k you need to carefully monitor egt's as well as tranny temps. If you do these things you will be fine.

My worst nightmare are the guys that want all the power they can get, but refuse to buy gauges or exhaust systems. I tell them from the start, if you melt something, don't call me! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img]

So far out of all the 6.0L module we have sold which is in the thousands now, we are not aware of any mechanical failures. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] As for the other companies, I can't say for sure, but I am sure eventually you would hear about them on here.

If you have other questions or concerns message me or call me!

[GTO_TT]

I have had the same problen before with the turbo actuator. I just took Quad's box off before I took it in. Never had any problems with that.

I have a mechanical failure though..................

My back tires have been losing a lot of tread and there is not a whole lot left. It seemed to happen after I put on the box though......hmmmmm [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img]

[teamroper60]

Wanna know whether Ford can tell if you've put a chip/module on your truck or not? How about those who want to use your hopped up truck for racing? (I seem to remember someone chipped and propaned their truck, then blew it up drag racing. The poster was saying something about trying to remove the chip/propane before taking it to the dealer, hoping they wouldn't know)

Well, the answer to those questions is in your owners manual (not the supplement, the actual manual):

Data Recording

Computers in your vehicle are capable of recording detailed data
potentially including but not limited to information such as:
• the use of restraint systems including seat belts by the driver and
passengers,
• information about the performance of various systems and modules in
the vehicle, and
• information related to engine, throttle, steering, brake or other system
status.
Any of this information could potentially include information regarding
how the driver operates the vehicle, potentially including but not limited
to information regarding vehicle speed, brake or accelerator application,
or steering input. This information may be stored during regular
operation or in a crash or near crash event.
This stored information may be read out and used by:
• Ford Motor Company.
• service and repair facilities.
• law enforcement or government agencies.
• others who may assert a right or obtain your consent to know such
information.

[QuadBoenker]

I agree that they can monitor their modules. But they can't monitor ours.

[teamroper60]

Admittedly, I know nothing about your module, or any others for that matter, but are you telling me that yours changes nothing?? If so, how do you get more performance without changing the amount of fuel and/or air being fed in, or the timing or something? You just about have to change something, or there would be no gains.

IMHO, I don't think they would have to monitor your module to know one was added. All they'd have to do is monitor the engine (which they do) and they would know that the amount of fuel/air/whatever you change with your module is different than stock. That would set off bells and whistles that something had been added/changed.

I'm not knocking your product, or anybody elses either, I'm just applying what I read in the owner's manual and a little common sense.

[George C]

There is just no way I would own this vehicle, or any diesel without ordering a performance module.

First, I have a nearly perfect 6.0L with a DPPI exhaust.
With Quad's module, I am king of the road. There isn't much that can take me at a light, and I still can't find anything that can out-tow it either.
Combine all of that performance with very manageable EGTs and great fuel mileage.

How do other modules compare? We are still waiting for many to come on the market.
Time will tell.

As of today, my truck has not lit the Check Engine Light..

[teamroper60]

I'm not trying to pick a fight with the manufacturers of them, just pointing out that even if you remove them, the evidence that you had 'em will still be there for Ford to find.

I think that if you want to mod your truck, you should do it. Heck, if Ford tried to deny a claim because of them, I'd make 'em pull the info from that data recorder and show me just how the mods caused the failure. If they can't then IMHO, they'd have a hard time denying the claim. That kind of sword can cut both ways!

[QuadBoenker]

Think of it as a stand alone computer. I watch what is happening and modify it as needed. I don't tell the IDM or the PCM to change anything.


George,

I am getting to my messages I have been out for a while.

Quad

[teamroper60]

[ QUOTE ]
Think of it as a stand alone computer. I watch what is happening and modify it as needed. I don't tell the IDM or the PCM to change anything

[/ QUOTE ]

Without giving away the inner workings of your system, can you explain this to me? (again, not trying to pick a fight here. I'd just like to understand this a little better)

Since the throttle, timing and air/fuel mixture amongst other things are all controlled by the trucks onboard computer (all of which are being monitored by the data recorder), how are you not telling it to at least momentarily change anything? It almost has to change something, even if it's only for an instant while the desired response is achieved, for anything to happen.

I'd think that once that change takes place, the data would be captured by the recorder and would be available to Ford for recall. (Kind of like a record of what sites you've visited is still recorded on your hard drive even after you erase the history and cookies, to use your computer analogy.)

Those momentary changes are what I think would "give away" the chip/module.

Just my opinion.

[frobozz]

[ QUOTE ]
Admittedly, I know nothing about your module, or any others for that matter, but are you telling me that yours changes nothing?? If so, how do you get more performance without changing the amount of fuel and/or air being fed in, or the timing or something? You just about have to change something, or there would be no gains.

IMHO, I don't think they would have to monitor your module to know one was added. All they'd have to do is monitor the engine (which they do) and they would know that the amount of fuel/air/whatever you change with your module is different than stock. That would set off bells and whistles that something had been added/changed.

I'm not knocking your product, or anybody elses either, I'm just applying what I read in the owner's manual and a little common sense.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the Ford PCM tells the injector to squirt X amount of fuel in, and an external module intercepts that signal and tells the injector to squirt Y amount of fuel in instead, how would the Ford PCM know? There is no direct feedback for the kinds of things I imagine the 6.0L modules are doing. If Ford got really clever they could somehow monitor rate of RPM increase vs current speed and gear, or they could log changes in how the transmission behaves once it's handling more power, etc. I have no doubt it will come to that someday, but for now with them not even able to make it idle in a stable manner under all conditions, I doubt they're getting that esoteric yet.

Duncan

[teamroper60]

[ QUOTE ]
...If Ford got really clever they could somehow monitor rate of RPM increase vs current speed and gear, or they could log changes in how the transmission behaves once it's handling more power, etc....

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, but they already are! Re-read what they tell you they're monitoring! It's right there, they're monitoring the engine, throttle, speed, etc.. etc...

Maybe they haven't gotten their programming down pat, but they are monitoring what the truck is doing!