6.0 and B100 problems? - Diesel Forum

girlmark · 11-11-2008, 11:00 AM

I don't have a 6.0, but now that most of them are out of warranty, a lot more people are running them on biodesel, so I'm interested in the subject.

It REALLY seems to me that people have trouble with these on 100% biodiesel. They seem to develop this weird goo after some number of miles (sometimes 20,000 miles, sometimes less, it seems to be unpredictable how long it takes) that comes out of no where and seems to just keep on coming.

What seems to happen is that something disintegrates in the fuel system, and destroys (extremely expensive) injectors. It doesn't seem to be related to fuel quality as far as I can tell. It seems to be related to using a biodiesel/diesel blend over 75%.

Also, the goo is not caused by petroleum residue in the tank being cleaned out by biodiesel, as it happens to very new vehicles with no history of residue (and this doens't happen to any other vehicle that I know of).

Usually 6.0 drivers seem to have no problems at B50 (50% biodiesel, 50% diesel). I think I've heard pretty consistently that B70 or so is fine as well.

I have heard a rumor that it was finally tracked to the stock filter, and that the element dissolves in 100% biodiesel. I'd like to know if there is an aftermarket replacement for the stock filter or if anyone knows for sure that the original filter is the cause of this problem (anyone want to send me an old stock 6.0 filter that I can soak-test in biodiesel- I don't feel like going out to buy one just for this test).

There was a lot of misinformation about what caused this when the 6.0's first came out and people started seeing this problem for the first time.

At first people thought the goo problem was due to the fuel being destroyed by the high pressure fuel system, so this led to a persistent rumor that all common rail injection systems would have problems on biodiesel. This has been completely disproven.

You might still run into someone on the net saying that it's fuel 'polymerization' due to high pressure. However, no other vehicles with a high-pressure fuel system seems to experience this issue.

I have heard a couple of times now that it's the fuel filter in the 6.0, and I'm trying to track down whether anyone knows for sure that this is the case.

I haven't been able to find positive confirmation that changing from the stock filter to an aftermarket filter gets rid of the problem permanently. The clogging goo problem may recur 20,000 miles later (I've heard from couple of users that this happened to) or may recur sooner, so it's hard to tell whether a change has helped or not unless you follow a user's experience for a long time.

Also, I don't think the same set of problems happen on SVO or solvent blending with these trucks.

wdwkr · 11-12-2008, 12:23 PM

So after reading this I went out and checked my used filters. They are still soaked with b100. They were used for around 5000 miles and 2 1/2 months. I then checked the new unused filters that I keep for future changes. The glue that hold the filter to the plastic is probably what you are talking about. After comparing the new and used they seem to be about the same soft consistency. Maybe if the filter was in service longer it might degrade. I have been using b100 since April and just started mixing to b75 and soon to b50. I have a little over 20k since I started using biodiesel. I have never had that gue problem but I also change my filters around every 5k miles. So my thought is that maybe the gue problem would be from not changing the filters often enough. But I would like to know more about this gue problem.

girlmark · 11-12-2008, 04:51 PM

The weird thing is that if it's a filter problem, you'd think that drivers of new trucks, that were still under warranty and were getting regular service, wouldn't have problems. I've informally tracked the mileage on these stories and some of them are 20,000 miles apart. Maybe that just means that once in a while a filter fails, and most of them don't- so even though a 20,000 mile user was fine through 4 filter changes the 5th one gave out and caused the problem. The other issue is that sometimes the problem recurs at very short intervals- so if it's a filter issue, there could be an explanation along the lines of 'it was a whole lot of bad filters that their dealer stocked' or something like that. It still doesn't quite make sense to me.

I guess I'll have to go track down one or two people who've actually had this problem in person and try to get more info.

Do these trucks have lined tanks?

wdwkr · 11-12-2008, 06:43 PM

I am not sure if the tanks are lined. My tank is made of plastic so I wouldn't think it was lined. Maybe there could be some fuel line that is degrading. It makes more sense to me that it is a fuel problem. Maybe alge growth from using biodiesel long term?

RACERXF250 · 11-12-2008, 07:10 PM

I Am On My Third.the First Was Not Ran On Bio, Because It Was In The Ford Garage More Than Mine. I Ran 35,000 Miles On My 05 B100 Every Mile. I Have 10123.00 Miles On My 06 6.0. I Have Only Ran One Tank Of Diesel. I Have A 60 Gal. In The Bed. I Have Three Others Who Run B100 In A 6.0. I Think Ford Recommends 10% In The 6.0. We Make Our Own Bio-diesel. I Just Don't Think This Is A Filter Problem.

expertrider · 11-12-2008, 08:01 PM

I was running B100 in my truck. I only put the Bio in the Aux tank, and let it fill up the main tank. I knew that the Bio would clean out the system after the first couple of tanks, so I replaced the filters after 500 miles; they were pretty dirty looking!

I have a small filter between the aux tank and the main tank. After about 10k miles, the small filter clogged up and I needed the fuel from the aux, so I removed the filter.

About 150 miles later, the stock filters completely clogged! The truck wouldn't go over 35 MPH. I replaced the filters (AND the small filter for the aux tank) and everything worked fine again.

I buy the Bio from a large truck-stop fuel dealer near me. He moves large amounts of the BIo, and has all the regular filters at the pumps.

So, I think the problem has to do with filtering.

I don't think that any of the major Bio producers filter to a small enough micron level. I think this causes the 6.0's filters to clog up.

The little aux tank filter that I used was just enough to filter out the goo from the bio.

I LOVE running Bio Diesel, but I've had to cut back to B20 because of the clogged fuel filter problems.
SInce switching, I still see the aux tank filter cogging up, but it seems to last a lot longer.

I think the guys that make it themselves filter the Bio a lot better, so they never have any issue.

robertwoodling · 11-13-2008, 11:28 AM

I have been running B100 in my '05 6.0 since it had 5,000 miles on the clock. It now has 37,500 miles on it. I have not had any issues whatsoever. The last time I changed the fuel filter there was some black crud in it. I think that came from the one tank of petro diesel I had to buy to get me home once becasue I had neglected to fill up before I left.

yaric008 · 11-13-2008, 01:41 PM

Running B100 for about 10,000 miles. Zero problems so far in the 6L. Goo, doesn't sound good....

**VegasDiesel** · 11-17-2008, 06:29 AM

Check these bio compatible filters. Then maybe filter with a centrifuge. They filter down to .5 micron. Better than any other filtering and a lot less messy I would think.

Biodiesel Filters (Cim-Tek)

robertwoodling · 11-25-2008, 10:40 AM

Just did the oil, fuel, tranny filter change thing.
The fuel filters were very clean. I probably did not really need to change them. 38,000 miles with 32,000+ on B100.

PGreenSVT · 11-25-2008, 04:28 PM

I have run a bunch of B100 through my 05 and the only filter issues I have had were cold weather related.

my red-rocket · 01-23-2009, 08:07 PM

I have a 06' 6.0 and my dad has a 08' 6.4, we have been making our own homebrew for a few months now. We both use the same B100 fuel but i have been having issues with my filters clogging. We both had our filters clog after the first couple of tanks, which is normal of course, while it cleaned out the systems. My dad hasn't had any issues since changing his original filter with a motorcraft filter. I changed my original filter with a NAPA gold filter and within 500-600 miles the filter was clogged. I removed it and noticed a layer of dark film on the filter. So, I replaced it again with another NAPA gold filter and again within 600-700 miles the filter clogged. Again there was a film present on the filter. Now I replaced with a Motorcraft filter and it seems like it might be starting to clog up again... Meanwhile my dad has had no trouble what so ever. I've attached pictures of the second NAPA gold filter after removing from my truck. I wouldn't think it is the fuel while my dad hasn't had any issues, not sure if it is the fuel eating at my fuel tank maybe. Thoughts? Thanks.

mrmedic · 01-30-2009, 12:15 PM

Man! That is some nasty looking crap! I hope someone can answer what the stuff is. I've homegrown for about 20k, 14 months, and only had one plugged filter. And it looked fine, just wouldn't run. I didn't cut my filter apart, but I will from now on to see if I'm harboring the blob that you have.

yaric008 · 01-30-2009, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my red-rocket

I have a 06' 6.0 and my dad has a 08' 6.4, we have been making our own homebrew for a few months now. We both use the same B100 fuel but i have been having issues with my filters clogging. We both had our filters clog after the first couple of tanks, which is normal of course, while it cleaned out the systems. My dad hasn't had any issues since changing his original filter with a motorcraft filter. I changed my original filter with a NAPA gold filter and within 500-600 miles the filter was clogged. I removed it and noticed a layer of dark film on the filter. So, I replaced it again with another NAPA gold filter and again within 600-700 miles the filter clogged. Again there was a film present on the filter. Now I replaced with a Motorcraft filter and it seems like it might be starting to clog up again... Meanwhile my dad has had no trouble what so ever. I've attached pictures of the second NAPA gold filter after removing from my truck. I wouldn't think it is the fuel while my dad hasn't had any issues, not sure if it is the fuel eating at my fuel tank maybe. Thoughts? Thanks.

How is your quality control for fuel making? Are you sure you are making good fuel? How do you wash your fuel, water or dry media? What temperatures was the weather when this goo formed? Are your tanks plastic or metal?

my red-rocket · 01-31-2009, 12:51 AM

Quality is pretty good i think. Passes the 3/27 test no problem plus my dad runs the same fuel in his truck no problem. We dry wash with magnesol, filter with a 1 micron nominal sock to remove the magnesol, then centrigue, and finish up with a racor 2 micron filter. We are located in southern New Mexico and get down to 20F at night but never any lower normally. My truck is always in the garage. I have a plastic tank, but so does my dad. The only thing that is different from my dad's truck and mine, except for the fact his is an 08', is that when he replaced his filter he used a motorcraft filter and i used napa gold. The last filter change i did i replace with a motorcraft just to see if that would make a difference.....if it doesn't help i really don't know what else the issue could be.