DO's and DON'T's of WVO source-locating

[The Warden]

Hello!

Prior to converting my truck to burn WVO, I figure that I'd be best off finding a source for the oil, in order to make sure that this is feasible.

So, where should I be going? Are there specific restaurants that are particularly friendly (or unfriendly) on this matter, or is it strictly up to the individual managers?

Also, how does one approach the restaurants in order to ask fok the stuff?

Lastly, how do you all transport your "loot"? I imagine that a 55 gallon drum would be the most efficient, but where can a person get his hands on one of those? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Any thoughts would be appreciated...thanks in advance!

[ToTheWoods]

This web site has most of the answers you're looking for. Lots of good info:

http://greasel.com/

The drums can be found at this link (or search for plastic drums:

http://www.yankeecontainers.com/Plastic-Drums.html

Good luck!

[rockhead55]

I wandered into a local restaurant one day when I had twenty minutes to kill. The waitress looked at me funny and the cook emphatically said "yes come back at four" ... I negotiated a time I could do on a regular basis and that was that. I did haul a dozen beer in for the cook my second week, he became a strong ally at that point !

I have heard that the big national chains all have their oil spoken for, but I haven't confirmed it.

Non-hydrogenated = liquid, much easier to work with and produces bioD with lower gel point IIRC.

I am lucky in that both the restaurants I deal with put the oil back into the cubees they buy it in. That does leave me with the flattened empty plastic jugs to dispose of, however, and greasy cardboard too. The cardboard may just end up getting saturated with filtration leavings and packed into homemade firelogs.

I have read of a couple of americans getting harassed by the law for carting 45 gallon drums around in their pickups, although that was nearer the 911 hysteria than now.

Glenn

[Johnny96]

For barrels, hit either an Army-Navy store for 55 gallon drinking water barrels, or a coin-op car wash for 50 gallon soap barrels. The former will cost a few dollars, the latter they'll probably give to you, especially if you wash your truck or Benz while there.

I'll get my oil from an independent pizzaria. They & fried-chicken places have the most. Avoid chains.

Be aware: 50 gallons of oil weighs ~300lbs. You have to figure out how to get this in the truck.

[GraemeDiesel]

I think a person using 50 gallon barrels will pretty well need to get a pump for loading and unloading. I have loaded smaller barrels of oil which I think were 30 gallon into my truck by hand, and they were plenty heavy.

[jdkline]

Tim,
Around here all the recycle bins have the "Griffin Industries" label on them, so I don't know if I could take it even if the manager would let me, if it would be ethical I mean, because the owner probably gets paid for it, sometimes the manager could give a crap for the owner [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]. So I have no idea where to look, but I'm in the process of looking. As to the 55 gallon drums, go to your local hazardous waste recycling center. You'll probably be able to get them for nothing there, just make sure you get ones that were only used for fuel or oil or veggie oil, something not too scary. I have access to all of them I want but I think the homeowners' association might write my parents a letter if I had one of those in the yard. Some people say that Chinese resteraunts have the best oil.. I'll be keeping you all posted.
J.D.

[94_turbo]

jk----spoke to a person at a grcery store--the barrel was full--what a dizzy------anyway--called the co on the container--said take some out if want to see if it will work---soooo-asked more questions--after they filter it--they resell for chicken feed additive--for 1.38 per gallon!!!!! chumps--so am going to reapproach the grocery store again with these facts---also--the-groc store pays 40.000 a month for rent on the container, and 80.00 everytime they pick oil up--oil co making good money,no????????? and she says they sometimes give her maybe 20.00 for 300 gallons of used oil--and this is good stuff--sooo generous arent they!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/vomit.gif[/img]

[jdkline]

Hmmm,
Maybe its worth at least asking around some of these places. I'd even pay them something for it, just as long as I was still well cheaper the #2 diesel. I calculated that I could make biodiesel even using the expensive drain cleaner lye for .87 per gallon with free oil, I'd be willing to pay up to .25-.30/gallon on it, and I'd still come out way ahead of the pump price. This company around here virtually has a monopoly, so I'm sure they aren't too generous...

[yaric008]

Heard from dazednconfused the other day that cheesecake factory is really good for used oil.

[jdkline]

Hmmm, I have a couple of places I'm going to check. The local Publix makes a lot of burgers and fries, and I know quite a few people that work there, however, all Publix employees are treated like peons and probably can't make a decision like that [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]. Othe rplace is this local bar-b-q restaurant, I know the owner and 1 of the managers. They probably don't have enough oil to justify having it taking off, but maybe enough for my diesel fuel consumption. Cheesecake factory? WOnder if the local French bakery would have any? Also have to check on a couple of smaller joints. Eric, doesn't Dazednconfused work at Universal Studios? All of you all's theme parks would be a good source, but they are such ripoff artists, they probably have already found a way to make a few cents off that stuff. Thanks for any more input.

[girlmark]

Most restaurants in most places have to pay to get rid of their oil, and they're required to do this by the health department or someone (ie they're not supposed to just throw it in the landfill).

so they're usually very happy if someone wants to come and take it for free.

The bigger problem is how good is the oil, and how do you test for this?

I usually come and take a sample from their barrel, take it home, and test it. Take samples from several restaurants at once so you know what the differences look like.

The tests I do are:

water content: (water messes up biodiesel reactions badly, and if you're using it as an SVO converted vehicle instead, it's not going to be removed by your water separator in this form)

to test for water, put some oil in a small pot, put in a candy thermometer from the grocery store, and heat it to the boiling point of water (ie 212 Fahrenheit). Watch the pot and see if there are any bubbles or popping. A couple of small ones is normal, but if it's really boiling then you don't want that oil if you have a better choice. People get confused on how to interpret this test- because often there is SOME bubbling- the best way to learn is to test several different oils. Try this with oil from some fancy expensive restaurants who change their oil more often, and try also some burger fast food oil (usually much nastier!)

The oil should also still smell like food, at least somewhat. High free fatty acid oil (ie REALLY REALLY high in FFA) smells a little like sewage. Blech!

2. test for free fatty acids:
this is what biodieselers call titration. It's really simple, but sounds complicated in writing. YOu basically are looking to see how heavily used the oil is. Heavily used oil contains free fatty acids, which in a biodiesel reaction make soap instead of biodiesel. For SVO use, free fatty acids are probably not good for your fuel system either.

The test uses pH (don't buy a pH meter- waste of money), but it's a bit more complicated sounding than just dipping a pH strip into oil- because oil by definition does not have pH. So you have to do a mini-reaction to form soap, and then test the pH of the soap (that's how I understand it anyway). The mini-reaction is with a tiny amount of lye (measured) and the free fatty acids (unknown) in a tiny amount of oil (also measured).

again, it's simpler than it sounds.
Here's the journeytoforever instructions on titration- except that unlike their instructions, most of us usually use Phenol Red (instead of phenolpthaleine)from pool and hot tub stores (or the hardware store) because it's 'good enough' and it's so cheap and available locally.
http://www.journeytoforever.org/biod...2.html#titrate


again, once you start looking into this stuff more heavily, go pay a visit to http://biodiesel.infopop.cc . There's a 'SVO' section (the peopl ewith converted cars) and there's a 'biodiesel' section (the peopel who make fuel and don't convert their cars) and you;ll learn a lot more AND get multiple experienced people's responses.

Mark

[girlmark]

A general rule of thumb is that more expensive restaurants usually change their oil more often, so it's usually higher quality. Also, people around the world report that Chinese restaurants or Japanese tempura/sushi places usually have higher quality oil than burger places or other restaurants.
and if a friend tells you they'd like to give you their turkey fryer oil- take it! it's usually barely used at all.


Mark

[jdkline]

Another guy I know runs a sort of rotary club type thing where he caters fish frys and the like. I'd like to get his oil because its probably in fairly good shape. I know that you are right, that most restaurants need to pay for waste oil removal, but around here, we have a company that collects it and actually makes useful stuff out of it. They pay their clients something for the oil, although not much. Thanks for your advice.

[Alaska Ranger]

[ QUOTE ]
jk----spoke to a person at a grcery storeafter they filter it--they resell for chicken feed additive--for 1.38 per gallon!!!!! chumps

[/ QUOTE ]

If I read this correctly, someone is buying used foodstuffs for further use in chickenfeed. Now, you want to handle this situation carefully, because you aren't going to make any allies by becoming a whistleblower (besides, as far as I'm concerned this new law is patooey), but:

in the past year, because of increased BSE (Mad Cow) concerms, the FDA made it ILLEGAL for any restaurant waste to be given to poultry. You might want to check my facts before storming around, but I am 99.44% sure of them.

At any rate, if you play your cards right, you could become their Best Buddy because you saved their necks, it seems to me......

[edselman]

I peeked at a dairy queen oil container (I dumpster dive also, that's why I was near the container) and took a look at the waste oil for the hell of it. If I remember correctly, I remembered reading the best kind was a amber color, and very clear looking. Well, this matched that profile! It was clear, and you could see to the bottom. I think all the particles floated to the bottom, and the pure oil was at the top. Baker Commidities is the popular one here, even at the local college I work at:

Baker Commodities is a rendering company that produces animal fats and oils, blood and bone meal, and tallow. Established in 1937, Baker Commodities is one of the nation's largest rendering companies with more than 20 plants in a dozen states, including four in California.

I have thought about setting up a refinery, but I live at home, so I would be pissing alot of people off under my roof! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]


What is the "shelf life" of this oil?

Dane