Heating B100 for winter use?

[sv52]

I am in the bio making to save money and what the vegy people do is of no concern to me if that is what they want. They heat the vegy oil to make it work. I am wanting to make the bio work in cold weather so I can save thousands of dollars this winter by not stoping at the pump.
Do not mean to conflick with any purists but saving money is why I am in this.
Do I save money? Sure do, last winter I saved $3,000 on shop and house heating oil and $1,077.00 on my truck fuel bill this summer alone. I would very much like to continue saving all winter.
I feel as I have been slightly repremanded for the thought and for that I am sorry if it offends you but again I want to save money. Thus I will continue hoping to get some one that has did the heating for BIOO winter use.
Thanks for taking part however and I mean no disrespect to anyone, just seeking some answers.
Steve

[hheynow]

If you'd just blend 10-20% kerosene you'd be surprised at how much it will lower the gel point and heat won't be necessary.

I've already mentioned installing a Hot Fox in the tank.

Heck, why don't you just spend your winters in southern Florida? [img]/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img]

[Halitosis]

I am not saying you offended anyone... I just saw that you wrote this:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bybyopec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Wow, I realy thought we would be getting tons of interest and hopefully someone that has did the bio fuel heating system for B100 winter use...I was wrong. Maybe it would be a good idea to make a system to sell if it is still an undone deal......? </div></div>

So I decided to post my little diddy.

What you are seeking has been done (and re-done) on a multitude of systems that run WVO. Do some searches and reading, and you'll find a TON of information on folks that have heated their WVO systems to accomodate low winter temps. (I have gotten my WVO system running in the wintertime from a low of 8* F in the middle of Wyoming.... using a variety of heating solutions ranging from HIH, HOH, and aquarium heaters...)

Halitosis

[sv52]

Yes I know about the WVO heating deals but they are usauly running a seperate tank that they heat and then have to do purgings at startup and shut down with reg diesel fuel. I am wanting to just have a normal tank of B100 and just heat the entire system to run when it gets cold so no additives nor extra tanks are needed.
I see that the fuel lines would be the biggest problem as they go very tight to the frame but then maybe new lines made up with both 110 volt heater tapes/cords with water/tranny lines and wraped with ins. Heating the fuel tank I think would be an easy thing to do with a heating pad and circulating water/tranny lines then ins. Simple line valves to shut down the water/tranny lines for summer use.
The box in front of the fuel filter on the engine may need to be done as well but then I was told that the block heater will keep the injectors warm? This has not been varified as of yet however and is one reason I am starting this topic to see if anyone has the know how/experience on the issue.
I know it would take some real work to get a system made up but man, the savings to just keep running B100 all winter would be well worth the effort.
Thank you for keeping this going. Wyoming is not the warmest place in the winter either for you. It is down now here in the high 30's at night but my truck still is running with highs in 40's and up with no trouble. I do have an additive to give me a bit more leeway but I am closing in on slowly droping my bio ratio.
I can work on my truck all winter as my shop ( heated with bio) is nice and toasty. By the way, fuel oil furnaces running on bio are the best and burn so clean and good that you would never go back to stinky fuel oil. Just some tweeking and you are off an runnning. Its a real good feeling to have a 275 gal tank full for my shop start and the house tank the same. NO MORE do I worry about the temp setting in either place due to keeping my cost down.....just turn it on and make more....ya.
Steve

[JOAT]

FWIW I run B100 year round (to start on) in a warm climate, but have been thinkning of ways to keep it going in colder areas too. I have ran the bio in a heated veggie system to test and it works well, but you have that first several miles to get the engine and fuel system up to temp, and in below freeezing conditions you'd clog a filter or even solidify the fuel in the lines...

One option I've see available for big rigs is fuel line with a heating element running through it. I don't have a link handy but as I recall it was a little pricy.

Another thought is a Veggie type coolant heated fuel system, and use a pump to circulate coolant and keep everything warm. Of course if you get stranded somewhere w/o being plugged in, eventually the fuel system is going to freeze up.

[sv52]

Yes the sytem would have to be heated via 110 volt, lines and tank as it sits but you could then start the engine, let it warm up then unplug for driving. You would have to plug it in on long stops but then leave it running for a time if needed also.
Been doing some checking and heat tape/cord with set temps and even adjustable temps settings can be purchased along with same heated pads of many sizes. All a guy would need to do is heat bio to around 60 degr's and it would be fine to run.
I expect this winter to have to purchase at least $2,000 of diesel at the pump till I can use my bio again, so cost to use all winter would rapidy be repaid with money we will spend anyway.
Steve

[VD350]

If thats the way you want to do it one way is to get a larger alternator and a High wattage inverter so you can plug your heated strips in once the truck is running

[JOAT]

Found the name of the commercial 12v heated feul line, "hotline". Did a search and some of the veggie kit places are selling it now.

Check out page 5 in this arctic fox pdf: http://www.greentechvt.com/about+con...oxBrochure.pdf

Expensive stuff tho...

[Atmus]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bybyopec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I can work on my truck all winter as my shop ( heated with bio) is nice and toasty. By the way, fuel oil furnaces running on bio are the best and burn so clean and good that you would never go back to stinky fuel oil. Just some tweeking and you are off an runnning. Its a real good feeling to have a 275 gal tank full for my shop start and the house tank the same. NO MORE do I worry about the temp setting in either place due to keeping my cost down.....just turn it on and make more....ya.
Steve
</div></div>

Are you able to park your truck overnight in your shop? that would solve half your problem.

How much of your truck bed do you need? I've come up with a few systems for my older truck that I figured would work for WVO (and if they did, would easily work for BioD) but won't get around to implementing them until my WVO fuel savings pay for the extra equipment.

Nothing wrong with using economics as your motivation for running homemade fuel. It's why I bought this truck, and why I run WVO over BioD.

Re-reading your posts, it sounds like you want to avoid modifying your truck too much? I'm not sure what you could do to modify the chemical makeup of your fuel to lower its gelling point, other that mixing it with fuel line antifreeze. I was told that wasn't a good idea because it is pretty much just isopropynol, which leeches moisture from the air. This is why I have 35 gallons of it in my garage instead of in my fuel tank :P

[drcampbell]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: VegieDiesel250</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If that's the way you want to do it, one way is to get a larger alternator and a high wattage inverter so you can plug your heated strips in once the truck is running. </div></div>

Once that's done, you could also install enough deep-cycle battery power to provide a couple hours' preheat. Then you could park anywhere, let everything gel up overnight, and fire up the electric heaters a couple hours before you're ready to leave.

One source:
http://www.rollsbattery.com/
(an interesting & useful source of general battery info)

Note that a battery's 2-hour capacity is typically about half its 20-hour capacity.

[sv52]

Not a bad idea with the inverter and maybe extra battery. I do have a shop to set the truck in when it is not in use making cabinets for my master carpentry bus. My truck is full of tools and has no room for extra tanks. Will check out the fuel line from Hotline and see what is what there.
I will use some additives now till I get to cold. Testing some diff one's right now as the temps are high 30's at night so a good real test for outside jars with reg bio and additive bio.
steve

[Atmus]

You could cut down on what you need to heat via electricity/batteries if you could install a very small tank (less than 5 gallons) somewhere, have your heater heat that and your fuel lines up while your engine warms up, and use engine coolant to heat your main tank.

That way you would only need to heat your small tank of fuel to get going or whatever, and the engine should be able to un-gel the BioD before that got spent. It may get annoying having to fill your small tank up too often, but you could probably rig something so that your fuel return goes to that tank before the main one.

[hheynow]

Arctic Fox items with price$

[davidpa28140]

I have thought about doing this as well. It would seem that an electric means would be required for the fuel line as a minimum, maybe an electric heating pad under the tank(like one for oil pans) and a means of heating fuel tank with hot engine coolant(artic fox?). A coolant loop of about the size of fuel line wraped around the fuel filter. A small heating pad under the coolant lines for the fuel filter. All would need to be insulated. I am not sure it would be required to run coolant down the fuel line if it were insulated as the tank should be warm and the fuel filter will be warm. It may also be required to heat lines by electric from fuel filter to IP(assuming you have old stuff like me) After putting it in print a two tank system with coolant heat to your main tank and fuel filter may look easier. I will be watching in hopes this works out for you. I ran no less than a 50/50 mix (BD/kero) last year(PA state) with just the homemade fuel filter heat, but mine sits in a heated garage overnight.

[davidpa28140]

I wonder if anyone has tried putting an electric water heating element in their fuel tank for this purpose, one of the 110V kind. After seeing the prices for the artic fox items I would think it maybe worth while to have a tank built with a coolant loop and an electric element built in.