6.0L Power Stroke Engine and DrivetrainDiscussion of the 6.0L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 2003-Up Super Duties and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 6.0L Power Stroke engine.
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Some history- Castrol & Mobil sued each other over the marketing rights of what makes a Systhetic "real".
Wekiwa
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Mobil sued Castrol over the definition of synthetic and lost. This enabled Castrol to market its non PAO oil as synthetic. Many other refiners followed Castrol and slapped "synthetic" on their previously non syntheic labels.
I called Shell to ask if Rotella synthetic was a PAO and the representative said he could not discuss Shell's oil formula. I told him I wasn't asking for the formula, but merely whether Shell Rotella was a PAO. He categorically refused to answer.
I went to the Mobil distributor and bought Mobil Delvac 1.
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Good choice.
__________________ 2007.5 Chevy 2500 HD (Dark Blue) - LMM Duramax & Allison - C/C S/B 4x4 Z71 - Sirius Sat Radio & iPod (thanks PIE Interface) - Oil Guard Bypass Filtration - 2 Micron Caterpillar Fuel Filtration - EGR Blocker Plate - PCV Reroute - MBRP 4" Turbo Back - EFI Live
Never argue with an idiot. They will bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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Wonderfull 1st post. Welcome, Amsoil dealer. Let us know when its fully legit. And save your anger and garbage reply for when its actually fully legit. You know, when its gone thru all the same testing as Rotella and Delvac.But no reply before, o.k.? Because it will be useless garbage. Like your 1st post. This crap means nothing to most of us until it has passed all the tests. And Amsoil has not. And you know it. Now post your crap elsewhere, poser.
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LOL [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img] what got your shorts in a bunch? I thought I missed a post but when I looked at the post you replied to, I laughed. Where does is say he's an Amsoil dealer?
As for passing tests, tests have nothing to do with it. Amsoil has it's tests and Mobil has it's and Shell has it's. It a API's certification that costs big $$$$$ that Amsoil has not gotten on some of it's oils. If they did, the cost would go up. I'm sure they counted the beans and made a financial decision that they are comfortable with.
I'm just surprised you flame someone like a little child over a post that was not aimed at any specific person and stated it's intention. I'm not saying I agree 100% wiht it's content or method, but that describes 99% of the posts on any forum. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img]
Relax, he's not sending out an Amsoil hit squad to secretly brain wash you and change your trucks oil. Become informed; it's healthy. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img]
__________________ 2004 EB Excursion, 4x4, 6.0, Magnaflow Exhaust, Isspro Gauges in an under cubby pod, Fumoto, V code front springs, Revo 285's and bubba lights
"Treat me good, I'll treat you better; treat me bad, I'll treat you worse." - Sonny Barger
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Personally, I would not want the potential warranty risk by using a non-API certified oil in an already oil sensitive engine.
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What warranty risk? Unless you have a different warrant book that I do, no where can it be found that the oil must carry API cert. If an oil that has the cert is what makes you feel more comfortable, I can understand that and that's your choice. However, to imply that a warranty claim is at risk is unfounded promotion of fear; misinformation. It is a recomendation by Ford in compliance with federal warranty regulations.
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You see truth, I see smoke and mirrors. I hope you have continued good luck with their product.
Safe trucking.
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I'm certainly not trying to call you out or belittle anyone as others obviously feel the same as you, but who is responsible for their comprehension of written material besides the person reading it? If you misunderstand what's written, or maybe some are even insecure and believe the company is playing on what they feel is a lack of knowledge or ability to read and comprehend the words, but the words are clear and do not misrepresent anything. Their claim is that the oil meets the specified API requirement. It's that simple and straight forward; there are no mirrors or smoke.
I'll repeat what I said earlier as well, I'm not saying Amsoil is the best oil for the 6.0. I'm currently using it, but based on my experience wiht shearing so far and the cost, I'm likely going to be using something else. I'm just trying to clear up misinformation or what could be called irresponsible commentary, which in it's presentation is in fact uninformed non-truth as opposed to the whole Amsoil API issue which is clear, truthful and in writing.
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It seems you fall prey to your own statement regarding "lack of knowledge or ability to read and comprehend the words, but the words are clear and do not misrepresent anything". What I stated was the potential warranty issue. Key word, potential.
So you will be more informed, my opinion is derived from information gathered from other sites such as TDS. Where victims, as it were, have voiced displeasure and concern that Amsoil had turned a deaf ear to voided engine warranty due to oil. I am unaware if the warranty denials were reversed as the topics evolved around the lack of warranty support from Amsoil. In one case Amsoil would not even respond after the initial dialog was effected. In each case of course, we were only privy to the owner's side of the story. But, where's theres smoke, there is often fire.
And this comment..."I'm just trying to clear up misinformation or what could be called irresponsible commentary, which in it's presentation is in fact uninformed non-truth as opposed to the whole Amsoil API issue which is clear, truthful and in writing"...only bears witness to the fact that it is you, sir, that may be mis-informed as I do not present irresponsible commentary.
In regards to calling me out...it has been more than a few decades since I was in grade school. Calling me out never entered my mind. I do, however, encourage and support challenges to statements that are made in forums such as this, by me or anybody else. It is how we all gain knowledge and confirmation.
As I mentioned earlier, Amsoil may be a good product or bad. I have no personal experience with it. My opinions are based on what have had read from 6.0 diesel engine owners. Some have had great experience with it. Others have not and feel disenfranchised from their warranty statements and actions, or lack thereof.
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As for passing tests, tests have nothing to do with it. Amsoil has it's tests and Mobil has it's and Shell has it's. It a API's certification that costs big $$$$$ that Amsoil has not gotten on some of it's oils. If they did, the cost would go up. I'm sure they counted the beans and made a financial decision that they are comfortable with.
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Tests have everything to do with it. Serves as a benchmark as to whether a manufacturer has confidence in their own product against estabished industry standards. The costs of such industry standard testing are a part of doing business. They obviously want our business.
Curious as to what information you may have as to the depth of their financial decision making processes (since you stated that you are sure). Hmmm, I wonder if some might construe that as an uniformed, irresponsible commentary? Unless you have some supporting information for your statement, one could also guess that they don't pursue the certification process because they fear, or may even know, that it may not pass the established criteria. But, that would be just a guess, IMO, either way.
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that it may not pass the established criteria
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Seems I read somewhere that it wont pass. A certain additive they use which the API does not allow. Cant remember what that additive is but I think it had something to do with environmental impact, not actual oil performance.
Well Mr VIZARD, I've appearently struck a nerve with you. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] Your defensive comments say a lot, especially as you take some of what I posted out of context and/or adding a slight spin to it.
Since you're schooling me I must ask, will you please cite 1 case where Ford has denied a warranty claim for a 6.0 engine failure based on the type of oil used? Just one would help educate me on the warranty risk issue as I've appearently missed the threads/posts that you're referring to on several sites.
By the way, I appologize if my statement "What warranty risk" was missing the key word "potential". I didn't see that it changed the question but appearently it did. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
As for the rest, it was a general statement regarding the comments made by everyone that says Amsoil is tricking, lieing to, playing games, using smoke and mirrors etc. I mena marketing is marketing and all oil companies "market" but once you get past that, Amsoil makes factual claims about their products. They have to, it's the law.
Black is black, white is white and blue is blue.
From Amsoil.com:
<font color="blue">AMSOIL Synthetic Heavy Duty Diesel & Marine Motor Oil is recommended for use in diesel engines requiring any of the listed worldwide specifications and gasoline engines requiring API SL, SJ, SH… or ACEA A3.
* API CI-4+, CF, CF-2, SL
* (the list continues)</font>
That statement does not make any claim regarding being API certifed. As a matter of fact, to my surprise it doesn't even claim that it meets API test criteria.
If someone, hypotheticly so as not to offend anyone, posts here on TDS that Amsoil is tricking, using smoke and mirrors or are "not legit" eluding to Amsoil unscrupulous tactics to make them think it is API certified, I do consider that to be irresposible commentary as a result of misunderstanding or a reading comprehension problem. Some comments made, some by those tauting Amsoil as snake oil, might go as far as being considered slander.
I'll disclose once again, I am a dealer so that I can buy at the cheap prices but have never sold or even ordered for anyone else. I do use it now, and did use it in my boat. I may not use it in my truck again based on shearing, and I will not use it in my new motor in my boat. I will add, I was les than pleased when an Amsoil tech told me that I should still use the 15w-40 HD Marine and Diesel in my new motor even after providing details about the motor so they knew witout a doubt how much different it is from the stock 7.4 that I was running it was. That to me was irresponsible on their part and I'm continuing to run Valvoline 50W Racing oil.
I just want to make it clear that I am not some brain washed Amsoil-head that believes Amsoil has a product for every application and what Amsoil says is gospel. I understand they have a product to sell.......just like Mobil and Shell.
Be cool!! (ya, I just watched "Be Cool" so that's my schtict for a few days!) [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img]
__________________ 2004 EB Excursion, 4x4, 6.0, Magnaflow Exhaust, Isspro Gauges in an under cubby pod, Fumoto, V code front springs, Revo 285's and bubba lights
"Treat me good, I'll treat you better; treat me bad, I'll treat you worse." - Sonny Barger
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As for passing tests, tests have nothing to do with it. Amsoil has it's tests and Mobil has it's and Shell has it's. It a API's certification that costs big $$$$$ that Amsoil has not gotten on some of it's oils. If they did, the cost would go up. I'm sure they counted the beans and made a financial decision that they are comfortable with.
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Tests have everything to do with it. Serves as a benchmark as to whether a manufacturer has confidence in their own product against estabished industry standards. The costs of such industry standard testing are a part of doing business. They obviously want our business.
Curious as to what information you may have as to the depth of their financial decision making processes (since you stated that you are sure). Hmmm, I wonder if some might construe that as an uniformed, irresponsible commentary? Unless you have some supporting information for your statement, one could also guess that they don't pursue the certification process because they fear, or may even know, that it may not pass the established criteria. But, that would be just a guess, IMO, either way.
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About that spinning??? LOL [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img]
That comment is a comment made using rational and reasonable opinion. For all I know they start their day in their underwear sacrificing gray squirles to their alien leaders and throw darts at a board to make decisions. However a reasonable opinion would probably not. I might also be "sure" that McDonalds brings back a McRibb based on a finacial decision that they are comfortable with as a result of counting beans. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Again, that squirel thing could be happening. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
The rest, you're right. I agree that couldbe a possibility, but I lean towards believing that it's not, but that's my opinion and I respect yours. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
__________________ 2004 EB Excursion, 4x4, 6.0, Magnaflow Exhaust, Isspro Gauges in an under cubby pod, Fumoto, V code front springs, Revo 285's and bubba lights
"Treat me good, I'll treat you better; treat me bad, I'll treat you worse." - Sonny Barger
So passing the tests don't matter. Wow. Let me know when you become informed. O.K. Inform me. Which Amsoil oils are api certified? I'll buy those. The bean counters decided that it wasn't feasable to have the testing done? So, in other words a product that is already expensive would become much more expensive if it has to be api certified like its competition? I'll admit I've never used it. Don't actually dislike it because I have no experience with it. Just get real tired of the Amsoil pitch always cropping up. Would you buy food or dairy products that you were skeptical of? Or purchase something to eat without an expiration date? Purchase diesel that was bootleg or someone whipped up because they claim its the best? No cetane rating, just take that companies word? That truck your driving is pretty impressive. And I'll bet the ranch you take good care of it. I'll bet the .99 cent Fox Head oil from Wallyworld doesn't see the inside of your engine. I'm plenty informed and plenty healthy. And certainly not a child. Good day, Sir.
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If you can read this thank a teacher...thank a soldier it"s in English.
So, you are an Amsoil dealer. I believe that was the first mention of that little fact, in this thread anyway. I am shocked, stunned and amazed.
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...The rest, you're right. I agree that couldbe a possibility, but I lean towards believing that it's not, but that's my opinion and I respect yours. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
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If there had been any evidence of that, we wouldn't have had this little discussion. Would we?
I have learned, over the years, that having a discussion such as this with an Amsoil dealer is like trying to pick tics off a porcupine.
I am finished with this discussion. FamilyRide, you may now have the last word if you so desire.
I wonder if the original poster got the answer he was looking for? I honestly hope so. I apologize that this thread may have become personal. It certainly was not my intent. Good luck with your oil decision.
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So passing the tests don't matter. Wow. Let me know when you become informed. O.K. Inform me. Which Amsoil oils are api certified? I'll buy those. The bean counters decided that it wasn't feasable to have the testing done? So, in other words a product that is already expensive would become much more expensive if it has to be api certified like its competition? I'll admit I've never used it. Don't actually dislike it because I have no experience with it. Just get real tired of the Amsoil pitch always cropping up. Would you buy food or dairy products that you were skeptical of? Or purchase something to eat without an expiration date? Purchase diesel that was bootleg or someone whipped up because they claim its the best? No cetane rating, just take that companies word? That truck your driving is pretty impressive. And I'll bet the ranch you take good care of it. I'll bet the .99 cent Fox Head oil from Wallyworld doesn't see the inside of your engine. I'm plenty informed and plenty healthy. And certainly not a child. Good day, Sir.
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I'll go out of character on this one and admit, I didn't even read past the first couple of sentences; it was that ridiculous, that quick. The subject you guys made so hot is API Certification. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]
It's not even worthy of a response so I'm moving on from that one. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/phoney.gif[/img]
__________________ 2004 EB Excursion, 4x4, 6.0, Magnaflow Exhaust, Isspro Gauges in an under cubby pod, Fumoto, V code front springs, Revo 285's and bubba lights
"Treat me good, I'll treat you better; treat me bad, I'll treat you worse." - Sonny Barger
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So, you are an Amsoil dealer. I believe that was the first mention of that little fact, in this thread anyway. I am shocked, stunned and amazed.
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I need to correct myself, I was wrong, I'm not a dealer (which wouldn't matter anyway, anyone can become a dealer in a few minutes and few bucks) I have what they call "Prefered Customer Status" which simply means I pay $20 a year so that I can buy products at dealer pricing. If I'm not mistaken, it's a additional nominal charge and maybe some other form to fill out to become a "dealer". Maybe that's when they make you drink the blood. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img] I thought I'd mentioned it as I always try to do as I'm sensitive to the fears people have that we who use Amsoil are really out to suck people into a secret society much like Amway clowns. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
It's funny how that appearently intimidates or scares some folks as if an "Amsoil Dealer" is going to sprinkle some voodoo dust on them and make them Amsoil zombies and they'll wake up to have giant Amsoil signs permently attached to their trucks. LOL [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img] It is quite humorous. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
And ya, unfortunatly I think we would have still had this conversation because emotions got involved and you to directed personal comments to me because I questioned what I believed to be unfounded claims about Amsoil.
Oh, I almost forgot, can you point me in the direction of one of those warranty claim denials based on oil type? It doesn't have to be specificly the Amsoil case you cited earlier, just any case. If you're still searching for one, no problem, I'll wait. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
Enough said on this one. I think we did a good job of keeping just enough "on topic" content that it may not get poofed. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif[/img] Reply as you wish as that will truly give you the last word. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
__________________ 2004 EB Excursion, 4x4, 6.0, Magnaflow Exhaust, Isspro Gauges in an under cubby pod, Fumoto, V code front springs, Revo 285's and bubba lights
"Treat me good, I'll treat you better; treat me bad, I'll treat you worse." - Sonny Barger
No sense in trying to defend yourself against hardheads. Amsoil IS one of the quality oils on the market. I'm not running it in my truck, but I'm familiar with their oils and other oils on the market. There isn't a thing wrong with Amsoil. Go drink a cold one and forget about the haters.
__________________ 2007.5 Chevy 2500 HD (Dark Blue) - LMM Duramax & Allison - C/C S/B 4x4 Z71 - Sirius Sat Radio & iPod (thanks PIE Interface) - Oil Guard Bypass Filtration - 2 Micron Caterpillar Fuel Filtration - EGR Blocker Plate - PCV Reroute - MBRP 4" Turbo Back - EFI Live
Never argue with an idiot. They will bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
lets see....nomax suite on and sealed...ok here we go.
Ford or any other OEM supplier of engines isn't looking for people using non Ford oil and the dealer base certainly isn't going to purchase the mult-million lab & equipment to test and analyze what oil may have been used that COULD have caused a failure.
They "Ford" have many, many much easier targets like programmers and drag racing adds that they CAN easily prove produced said failure.
As to API and its certification, well I've stated it before and most here know my view of that little group. Page 36 of your Powerstock Supplement manual RECOMMENDS oils meet FS # WSS-M2C171-D OR API categories of which CI-4+ is not mentioned. Ford does not state you the owner must do anything. They can't for several reasons of which I won't go into. Please read the manual.
All these oil rumors and statements of "a friend said" are a waste of bandwidth.
Wekiwa
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2005 F250 CC SB 4x4 6.0 auto
Banks Big Hoss & K&N air kit & Xcal2 tuned.
Reg Return system with slighty larger injectors
A little turbo tweaking
Modified V-pipe and up-pipe assemble
Ceramic coated most stuff
Bypass oil filter kit
Black on Black
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2004 EB Excursion, 4x4, 6.0, Magnaflow Exhaust, Isspro Gauges in an under cubby pod, Fumoto, V code front springs, Revo 285's and bubba lights
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