6.0L Power Stroke Engine and DrivetrainDiscussion of the 6.0L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 2003-Up Super-Duties and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 6.0L Power Stroke engine.
I have a mystery for you Ford technician/ detectives out there. The pictures below are from my 2005 Ford F-350 6.0L Diesel Super Duty truck, running BONE STOCK.
Although I'm a retired ASE tech, I know very little about diesel topics and other than keeping the maintenance schedule current, I haven't laid a wrench on this engine myself.
A little history...My truck has had EGR Cooling problems like many. They've replaced the EGR cooler 2 times previously, and this time the EGR DTC's were present again. (they haven't replaced it, because it's still apart)
But THIS time, the engine felt like it was missing, then the coolant steam came out the back, and the engine started rattling on drivers side cyl bank, sounding like loud rocker noise, but when they pulled the heads, they found these indentations in the piston crown.
The filters (air/fuel/oil) were all OK...no dirt, water or plugged elements.
Please notice the impressions on the piston crown... It *looks* to me like the bottom half of a self-tapping sheet metal screw (with pointed tip) and missing the HEAD of the screw.
Ford is denying my warranty, saying it's my fault and they refuse to even disassemble further to find out where the part came from. How they can say it's my fault after 2 previous times of EGR symptoms and refusing to look for the cause, is beyond me.
Btw, there's about 80,000 miles on the engine and there's another cyl besides this one with low compression, but no visible damage. All other cyl. are free from metal transfer/ gouging and abnormal wear on thrust surfaces, so oil supply does not appear to be a cause.
I'd really like to know what that piece of wire in the blowup of the third picture might be.
The intake system was completely closed with air filter intact and this part came from somewhere inside. Any guesses what this might be and where it came from?
The second picture looks kind of like an injector tip to me. I have seen one embedding in a piston before. But if that were the case, the injector in that cylinder should be missing it's tip..
The wire, I have no ideas on.
What is Ford saying you did to cause this? If the truck is truly stock, I would make them put their reasons for denial in writing and then go up the food chain.
BTW, to my knowledge, there are no DTCs for a bad EGR cooler. There are DTCs for a malfunctioning EGR valve but not the cooler..
__________________ 2003 Toreador Red/Arizona Beige CC, DRW, Lariat, FX4, 6.0 PSD, Torqshift, born early Feb. 03, AIC, MBRP turbo-back exhaust, Tuning by Tony Wildman (Total Diesel Performance), ARP studs & some "other" work done by River City Diesel, AFE PG7, Fumoto valve, B&W hitch, Di-Pricol gauges, Voyager brake controller, DIESELSITE Coolant filter, Timbrens, Rancho RSXs, Michelin XPS Traction's, a whole bunch of "bling", Connex 4300hp, JL Audio 275w amp w/ 12" sub, Alpine door and rear seat speakers.
The second picture looks kind of like an injector tip to me. I have seen one embedding in a piston before. But if that were the case, the injector in that cylinder should be missing it's tip..
The wire, I have no ideas on.
What is Ford saying you did to cause this? If the truck is truly stock, I would make them put their reasons for denial in writing and then go up the food chain.
BTW, to my knowledge, there are no DTCs for a bad EGR cooler. There are DTCs for a malfunctioning EGR valve but not the cooler..
Hi teamroper, thanks for the reply. They told me the injector was still intact and I didn't take a picture of it. (Could it be another injector tip piece that was recirculated back from the exhaust? )
My Ford dealer has changed hands since my first EGR problem in May 2008, but with the same people employed. The TECH has been fired, apparently due to incompetence, and they tried to wash me out of my 100k mile warranty claim by saying "it's been over 3000 miles since the last time we replaced your EGR and cooler" and "you're too close to the end of the warranty to get a new engine"
I must have "STUPID" written on my forehead because I have never even HEARD of a customer being treated like I have been in this dealership.
The inspector from Ford came out, saw the piston crown damage, labeled it "foreign object---not warrantable" and left. The service manager told me that my warranty claim simply disappeared from his computer screen and there was nothing more to be done about it. When I asked, "so what did you find that caused the damage?" they told me they were not "allowed to go farther without authorization from Ford" so......believe it or not, I have been denied warranty coverage on the damage in the pictures below, before they have even STARTED to diagnose the problem that caused the damage.
They asked me leading questions about the foreign object as if I had intentionally sabotaged my own truck!
And yes, this is dead bone stock, without so much as a Temp gauge installed. When I was a tech, I hated working on non-oem stuff because I could never predict the interaction with oem equipment, particularly in the electronics, so I haven't touched this motor with a wrench, except to change oil, filters, etc.
I was RELUCTANTLY given the EMAIL ADDRESS (absolutely refused to give me a phone number) of the South Texas area Ford rep, but he echoed the dealership and (through a parts rep) denied me coverage again...WITHOUT ANY FURTHER INSPECTION. I called the 800 Ford customer service number and the lady took my name, then called back later to tell me that the decision "was final" and they wouldn't be calling me back!
My truck has been laying on their shop floor for almost a MONTH now, and I'm told that I'm waiting for a field service engineer to review my case.
DTC's for EGR valve makes sense... EGR cooler isn't connected electrically...lol....I'm just parroting what they said to me at this point. I've never felt so powerless.
I just want to point out clearly....I have not been able to talk to ANY FORD Motor Co. employee who is technically competent to answer the simple question, "On what TECHNICAL basis are you denying my legitimate warranty coverage" ....(other than they are simply tired of paying for 6.0L warranty repairs.)
This is MY FOURTH CONSECUTIVE TIME IN THE SHOP FOR COOLING SYSTEM PROBLEMS, with "catastophic damage" this time.
Boy I wish I had something to say to help you but I just don't understand the reasoning behind their stance. Good luck and I am sure when some of the techs on this site see this you will get some more help.
Bill
__________________
2007 F350 Lariat CC SWB 4X4 SRW Torque Shift. True Blue with Medium Flint. 20 inch wheels, FX4, Moonroof, sliding rear window, Tow Command, dual alt's.
Boy I wish I had something to say to help you but I just don't understand the reasoning behind their stance. Good luck and I am sure when some of the techs on this site see this you will get some more help.
Bill
Thanks for the reply, Bill. I'm equally baffled because although it's been a while since I worked at a dealership, I don't recall ever having trouble getting a warranty authorization for something so flagrantly common and well discussed as cooling system problems with the 6.0L's!
What really gets me though, is being a MONTH down the road and so far, not being able to even TALK to someone on the FoMoCo end who has the technical expertise and the power to deny/approve my warranty repairs. I mean, if it were LOGICALLY my fault somehow, I could understand their reluctance, but they haven't even taken the pieces apart yet (the intake, egr cooler, turbo, exhaust system, etc.) to find out what broke and why!
I drove into the dealership with it making noise, and they (actually told me this) took it to a bay and let it run until it stopped!
This wouldn't be so bad except I feel like the dealership isn't being honest with me and with my truck apart on their floor, there doesn't seem to be many options for me. I'm not exactly in a position to "demand" anything.
I love how some of the "techs" on this site never chime in when it is obvious that someone is getting scre*ed by ford and their lousy customer service.
Feel bad for your troubles 4X8.
__________________
2003 F350 6.0L 4X4 CC LB
Sirius Satellite Radio
Helicopter Squadron sticker on back window.
So Stock you could sell it on Wall Street.
Just a thought here, but when I had multiple problems with my bone stock 07, culminating in a head gasket replacement at just 30000 miles, I called and sent a letter to the corporate office, addressed to the CEO. Low and behold I got a call about 5 days later and gave me one of the 7 year, 200000, 21pt warranties for my trouble. Sometimes you just have to go over the head of the customer service. I just wrote a real concise letter with chronological details of my problems and kept my emotions out of the letter. Might be worth a try, or I would agree that a lawyer would be in order.
__________________
2007 F350 Lariat CC SWB 4X4 SRW Torque Shift. True Blue with Medium Flint. 20 inch wheels, FX4, Moonroof, sliding rear window, Tow Command, dual alt's.
And if that letter to the CEO doesn't work, that's when I would just have to cut my nose off to spite my face....I would leave the truck and refuse to pay for anything....no repair fee, no more car payment, no more nothing....sometimes you have to stand up for the priciples you believe in, no matter the consequence. I really wouldn't care if it dinged my credit.
This really ticks me off.
__________________ SFC Fred Lynes
2004 F-350 CC DRW LB FX4 4x4
Oxford White/Arizona Beige
King Ranch Package
Herrin Hauler Package
5R110 Torqshift
4.10:1 Dana 80 Trac-Lok
9,200lbs GVW
Reman'd 6.0L @43,956 miles
Reman'd Turbo @54,814 miles Wishin' I still had my '05 2500HD CTD Ram
Just a thought here, but when I had multiple problems with my bone stock 07, culminating in a head gasket replacement at just 30000 miles, I called and sent a letter to the corporate office, addressed to the CEO. Low and behold I got a call about 5 days later and gave me one of the 7 year, 200000, 21pt warranties for my trouble. Sometimes you just have to go over the head of the customer service. I just wrote a real concise letter with chronological details of my problems and kept my emotions out of the letter. Might be worth a try, or I would agree that a lawyer would be in order.
Hi again Bill,
That's a good idea about writing the corporate office. I dislike getting lawyers involved because they don't work for free and I seldom get paid for my problems as well as they get paid for my problems.
But I'm still trying to digest the fact that I'm sitting here with my truck in the shop for a month, and I still haven't even gotten a diagnosis based on taking the unit apart and looking to see what went wrong.
Man, have things changed since I was a tech. It used to be a badge of honor to figure out problems that were out of the ordinary. Now I feel like I'm asking for "special favors" just to be able to get the field manager out to consider honoring my warranty....not a great feeling...
And if that letter to the CEO doesn't work, that's when I would just have to cut my nose off to spite my face....I would leave the truck and refuse to pay for anything....no repair fee, no more car payment, no more nothing....sometimes you have to stand up for the priciples you believe in, no matter the consequence. I really wouldn't care if it dinged my credit.
This really ticks me off.
Hi Strokin', thanks for the empathy! Unfortunately, (used to be "fortunately") my truck is paid off and I'm having to pay for a rental car while I watch my warranty run out.
It's amazing how straining against an immovable object (my warranty probs) can wear a person down.
Well, it probably won't be a diesel! I think the emissions controls and trying to make these high tech diesel engines eat their own soot, is the reason that there's so many late model diesel problems.....sort of like trying to run while choking yourself....somethings gotta give!
The newest ones are even worse (read: cleaner) than the 6.0L's! And they keep saying they're getting better, but I don't think I want to try to defy physics any more than I already am. I would like to keep mine though, now that it's paid for.
I love how some of the "techs" on this site never chime in when it is obvious that someone is getting scre*ed by ford and their lousy customer service.
Feel bad for your troubles 4X8.
Hi Skidkid, I'm hoping that some diesel tech here will have seen this movie before and be able to tell me, "Oh yeah - that always happens when the --fill in the blank-- breaks off and goes through the intake again." ....or some such explanation.
I KNOW this has happened to other people. I can't be the only one this unlucky! (i hope)
The AutoGuide.com network consists of the largest network of enthusiast-owned enthusiast-operated automotive communities.
AutoGuide.com provides the latest car reviews, auto show coverage, new car prices, and automotive news. The AutoGuide network operates more than 100 automotive forums where our users consult peers for shopping information and advice, and share opinions as a community.
2003 Toreador Red/Arizona Beige CC, DRW, Lariat, FX4, 6.0 PSD, Torqshift, born early Feb. 03, AIC, MBRP turbo-back exhaust, Tuning by Tony Wildman (Total Diesel Performance), ARP studs & some "other" work done by River City Diesel, AFE PG7, Fumoto valve, B&W hitch, Di-Pricol gauges, Voyager brake controller, DIESELSITE Coolant filter, Timbrens, Rancho RSXs, Michelin XPS Traction's, a whole bunch of "bling", Connex 4300hp, JL Audio 275w amp w/ 12" sub, Alpine door and rear seat speakers. 
I think the emissions controls and trying to make these high tech diesel engines eat their own soot, is the reason that there's so many late model diesel problems.....sort of like trying to run while choking yourself....somethings gotta give!
Linear Mode
