6.0L Power Stroke Engine and DrivetrainDiscussion of the 6.0L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 2003-Up Super Duties and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 6.0L Power Stroke engine.
UPDATE: Sad to say that after oil cooler and egr cooler replacement at $1850....still a LACK OF POWER. Didn't notice anything different when I picked it up and drove it home...so I decided to hook up the camper and take it for a tow......same dead power as before. I left a message with the mechanic to find out if I can bring it back tomorrow again with the camper, and have him check temps while towing. This is driving me nuts....WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS TRUCK? Should I just give up and sell it? Towing up a hill on a back country road with the pedal kept on the floor...never got above 53 mph....and remember this camper only ways 7500lbs fully loaded.
Sorry that your repair did not fix the original problem! Did you (or did the dealership) pull the EGR valve? If not, that would be the place to start. Also, whenever pulling the EGR valve, it is a good idea to check the MAP sensor hose and EBP tube to make sure they are clear and not plugged.
Note - if you have a dirty EGR valve, cleaning it is a great thing to try .... however, many times the valve actuator fails and the valve needs to be replaced.
You might try unplugging the EGR valve (do so w/ the engine off) and see how it runs.
[quote=kraftchick;1779008]UPDATE: Sad to say that after oil cooler and egr cooler replacement at $1850....still a LACK OF POWER. Didn't notice anything different when I picked it up and drove it home...so I decided to hook up the camper and take it for a tow......same dead power as before. I left a message with the mechanic to find out if I can bring it back tomorrow again with the camper, and have him check temps while towing. This is driving me nuts....WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS TRUCK? Should I just give up and sell it? Towing up a hill on a back country road with the pedal kept on the floor...never got above 53 mph....and remember this camper only ways 7500lbs fully loaded.
See below where I wrote on another thread. If we have the same problem, the cetene boost helped me in the lose of power but not the squealing or whinning as I call it. I pull 11K and it only does it with the trailer in tow at times. After a EGR replacement I drove 1300 miles before it started. Ford replaced the EGR again and I drove 200 and it started. I don't think it is the EGR valve. Read my thread to the other squealing problem. Great thread, keep posting but I'd stop spending on all the ideas unless you have bottemless pockets. If it is dependable and gets you home, this all might just be part of the system as so many have the problem.
"All sounds too familar. I have a 04 6.0 that does the same thing but always in a tough boost need, up a steep grade or in a high headwind. Dealer cannot duplicate it on on dino. They have replaced the turbo, three EGR values, the fan clutch and nothing has done any good. For three years it did not do it. Then with the fuel change in sulfur, it started and I hear the high whinning sound and lose power. I started adding cetane boost to the fuel and now I get the whin but do not lose power. So I just give up and let it go. I just came off a 3,000 mile trip and it gets me to and from fine. I have read so many threads of heads going bad, fuel filters, bad fuel, cracked hoses, and more and more. Everyone has a similar problem with this engine. Good luck. If you find a permanent cure let us know. I got so frustrated I wrote the Ford Co CEO. His office actually replied, set up a appointment with my dealer, told the dealer what to look for per their 6.0 engineer, and still nothing."
Mark...with the EGR valve unplugged, what should I expect when I crank it up...what will this tell me? And I'm sorry to ask something that has been explained already, but if the EGR valve isn't functioning properly...what does this do to possibly cause what I experience...no load and with load....overall performance is horrible compared to other stocks.
Also...I'm really really feeling like this isn't an engine power issue...but maybe something else....I get plenty of RPM's, boost, etc.....but increased throttle just isn't translating that engine roar into a lower gear and forward acceleration...at least not until I go WOT....only then do you feel it push you in the seat and scoot down the road. This is exagerated when towing a load (7500lbs).....in that case, I have to go to the floor earlier to get accelerated response. Could this thing need a re-flash?
Lazyl...thanks for the input and I agree on the being cautious throwing tons of money at this without knowing exactly what the problem is....I don't have bottomless pockets. The problem with accepting it running good for the most part is that I cannot tow my camper (7500lbs) with any performance at all...and a month ago when attempting to tow up into the Appalachians....I had the pedal on the floor, truck was wound out, and I was going 38 mph.....not acceptable with a lighter trailer. That's why I'm so gung ho on figuring out what is wrong with this truck...what is causing it to perform so differently then all the others I've driven.
Mark...with the EGR valve unplugged, what should I expect when I crank it up...what will this tell me? And I'm sorry to ask something that has been explained already, but if the EGR valve isn't functioning properly...what does this do to possibly cause what I experience...no load and with load....overall performance is horrible compared to other stocks.
Also...I'm really really feeling like this isn't an engine power issue...but maybe something else....I get plenty of RPM's, boost, etc.....but increased throttle just isn't translating that engine roar into a lower gear and forward acceleration...at least not until I go WOT....only then do you feel it push you in the seat and scoot down the road. This is exagerated when towing a load (7500lbs).....in that case, I have to go to the floor earlier to get accelerated response. Could this thing need a re-flash?
When you shut off your engine, the EGR valve should be closed (unless it is stuck open). Assuming it is closed and you unplug it, in most cases it will stay closed. This can help w/ the power issue if the valve is malfunctioning. If performance is better with the EGR valve unplugged, you have identified a potential cause. The EGR valve is a common source of "low power" issues. Also, a failed EGR and oil cooler usually means that your EGR valve saw excessivey high temperatures. This decreases its life.
Are you thinking that it is transmission related? Your PCM, ECM, TCM (processors) are all interconnected. They all talk to each other and depend on each other. The Torqshift is a VERY reliable transmission, but it is not infallible by any means.
It is very possible that it is a failing sensor and the PCM is limiting power. Finding this without codes is hard to do.
I highly recommend the new flash, but mainly for cold starts. It is not really geared to restore power, unless something w/ your current programming has been corrupted.
These 6.0's have plenty of power and 7500 lbs is nothing to one that is running properly. Most of my suggestions are to identify FREE things to try before you start parts replacement. One other thing that can mess w/ the power is a restricted air inlet.
I agree w/ cetane boost, but not really seen too many cases where it provided and real noticeable performance improvements. I am glad for Lazyl, but it is uncommon. The U.S. fuel is certainly marginal in meeting the minimum Ford cetane spec of 45 (U.S. cetane can get down to 38). I boost the cetane to avoid building carbon in the system.
When you shut off your engine, the EGR valve should be closed (unless it is stuck open). Assuming it is closed and you unplug it, in most cases it will stay closed. This can help w/ the power issue if the valve is malfunctioning. If performance is better with the EGR valve unplugged, you have identified a potential cause. The EGR valve is a common source of "low power" issues. Also, a failed EGR and oil cooler usually means that your EGR valve saw excessivey high temperatures. This decreases its life.
Are you thinking that it is transmission related? Your PCM, ECM, TCM (processors) are all interconnected. They all talk to each other and depend on each other. The Torqshift is a VERY reliable transmission, but it is not infallible by any means.
It is very possible that it is a failing sensor and the PCM is limiting power. Finding this without codes is hard to do.
I highly recommend the new flash, but mainly for cold starts. It is not really geared to restore power, unless something w/ your current programming has been corrupted.
These 6.0's have plenty of power and 7500 lbs is nothing to one that is running properly. Most of my suggestions are to identify FREE things to try before you start parts replacement. One other thing that can mess w/ the power is a restricted air inlet.
I agree w/ cetane boost, but not really seen too many cases where it provided and real noticeable performance improvements. I am glad for Lazyl, but it is uncommon. The U.S. fuel is certainly marginal in meeting the minimum Ford cetane spec of 45 (U.S. cetane can get down to 38). I boost the cetane to avoid building carbon in the system.
I tested unplugging the EGR valve, and drove it awhile...no significant change in performance.
As far as the it being transmission related, I'm really beginning to wonder. The engine is doing a lot of work...lots of RPM's once if finally responds to the increased throttle....but it feels as if all that power and wleork just isn't getting translated to the rear end. I know this thing is not a dragster, but I'm not a high performance addict either. It's just significantly lacking in liveliness, and responsiveness to throttle input. I can get it to run 70mph, but only after I've been in it WOT for awhile. Another observation in comparison to other F250's I've tested against, is what the transmission seems to be not doing in my truck. In order to get it to drop a gear, I practically have to put the pedal through the firewall. In others, only slight increase in throttle position, and it quickly gears down and takes off....not mine. I can be running say 45 mph, put the pedal on the floor, count 1000-1, 10002...then it decides to drop one gear and start pulling, the turbo comes up to 25 psi, and yes there is acceleration, but I sure wouldn't put it up against any other stock F250's. If I'm cruising down the highway at 60mph in overdrive, I can put the pedal on the floor and it's as if it never does decide to drop a gear...the turbo spools up and I get acceleration, but it seems to do it in the same gear I was cruising at. All of this is only more exagerated if I've got the camper hooked up. Everything requires much more throttle. I get next to nothing in acceleration until the pedal is 3/4 to WOT. Tested again on a back country hill tonight with camper in tow...pedal on the floor and I couldn't get above 50 mph....yet RPM's were well around 3500 and turbo was at 25 psi. This wasn't a mountain grade hill...just a normal NC country road.
Not sure if they are related, but ultimately I feel like I might have multiple issues (maybe they are related though). One, throttle response is horrible...it takes 3/4's of the throttle travel or more to get it to gear down...and two, when and if it gears down, what the engine appears to be producing just isn't translating to forward acceleration (as if the rear end is geared like an 18-wheeler). Someone asked me if I could spin the tires from a dead stop and hammering the throttle.....absolutely not....not even close!
The transmission doesn't feel at all like it's slipping (if that's even possible with a torqshift transmission)...at least not like a manual transmission with a slipping clutch, which I've felt before. When you push throttle, you want to ask the truck "what are you waiting for"....when I've got that 7500 lbs in tow, it makes you feel like you might have 15000 lbs. back there.
I'm going to take it and have it re-flashed tomorrow...dealer quoted me $38...I'll happily pay that just to rule that out.
Oops...forgot to respond to the air intake restriction. I tested this last week by temporarily removing the air filer completely. You could sure hear it sucking the wind in....but again, not significant change is responsiveness or acceleration/quick power.
Have you checked to see if the cat is pluged up or maybe coming apart and pluging up the exhaust. Or if the charge air cooler is not leaking. I have had both of these problems and no codes.
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2003 f 250 6. oooh no - Lariat FX4 Off-Road Crew Cab, Short Bed
UPDATE: Took the truck by the local Ford dealer today and had them re-flash the PCM, etc.. In addition to that and from my mentioning the lack of power issue, they pulled and cleaned the EGR valve, and did low power diagnostics (whatever that means). NO CHANGE! What next?
ZRed...I meant to reply to your post as well. The mechanic that did the oil cooler/egr cooler replacement has mentioned that a clogged up catalytic converter could be the issue as well, and since it's now out of warranty that just removing it might help.
That may be the next step...or at least considered as an option after I do some research into whether or not this issue is transmission related.
Towed the camper to a campground this weekend 1 hr. 20 mins. away from home....I think the problem is now worse. On the highway, I could eventually get up to 65 or so, but it took a very very long time on flat grade and I had absolutely no reserve power left....pedal was on the floor. This particular campground is in the foothills of NC...at times I had the pedal on the floor and couldn't get above 50 mph....and most of this time it wouldn't even gear down anymore. I would have to go WOT in the valleys in hopes of keeping it to at least 45-50 to climb minor hills....if the hill was very long at all, I would be decreasing mph with the pedal on the floor. Yet, the engine appears to be running smooth, no codes......just no power!!
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