ANYONE REPLACED LPOP - Diesel Forum

EXCAV8TER · 08-07-2005, 06:45 PM

Ok no dice on websites...anyone know how much the LPOP costs and where to get it???
TIA
Tom

any instructions on how to replace??? tools needed???
TIA
Tom

EXCAV8TER · 08-07-2005, 07:12 PM

TTT

BIGBEAN · 08-07-2005, 08:38 PM

Cant see any real reason to replace a lpop, its a really hefty gear pump and cant see how it could go out. It runs off the crank and you would have to pull the front cover to get at it.

I have no Idea what one costs either.

TheHammer69 · 08-07-2005, 08:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Ok no dice on websites...anyone know how much the LPOP costs and where to get it???
TIA
Tom

any instructions on how to replace??? tools needed???
TIA
Tom

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess I was kinda clear as mudd in my PM to you. I guess I should have said that poor LPOP performance is usually caused by a worn front cover. Since you apparently have decided to go the LPOP route, I'd just plan to chnage the cover and deal with the actual pump itself if you found something wrong with it.

Hammer

TheHammer69 · 08-07-2005, 08:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Cant see any real reason to replace a lpop, its a really hefty gear pump and cant see how it could go out. It runs off the crank and you would have to pull the front cover to get at it.

I have no Idea what one costs either.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bean, I can't remember how the pump is configured. Is it a driven gear meshed with an idler gear? Another question is how the driven gear is attached to the shaft that is driving it? The reason I mention that is because if it is press fit on it's driving shaft, their is potential for the "fit" to go bad and the shaft just spin inside the driven gear. I found first hand knowledge of this just recently on my Cummins N14 and it was a doozie to figure out. My N14 oil pump is configured just that way and it would have no oil pressure when first started then it would slowly come up to normal. Then running down the road it would be fine and then sometimes after stopping and idling it would suddenly drop from 18 to zero. finally it just went out driving across a parking lot, and the problem was discovered after extensive troubleshooting and dissassembly of the pump. You just shouldn't be able to remove a press fit gear off a shaft by whacking the shaft with your hand. I have no idea if the LPOP in the PSD has a similar press fit situation, but it is one way a heavy duty pump can fail.

Hammer

Dan V · 08-07-2005, 09:25 PM

I can't remember the exact term, but it ain't a gear pump. The driven "gear" runs inside the outer "gear". The "gears" are more lobes.

The driven gear is a close slip fit on the crank, a round hole with two flattened sides. For the driven gear to "slip" on the crank, you got bigger probalems than just a bad LPOP.

The pump housing is cast iron and it simply bolts to the front of the front cover, the seal is a square cut o-ring. Pull the harmonic balancer, remove 4 bolts pull the pump....easy.

About $50. try www.endurancepower.com

POWERSTROKE RACER · 08-07-2005, 09:35 PM

Tom call me at the shop in the AM,I have them on the shelf. Takes about 15 minutes once the harmonic balancer is removed.

Ran440 · 08-07-2005, 10:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Tom call me at the shop in the AM,I have them on the shelf. Takes about 15 minutes once the harmonic balancer is removed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dang. You can't do better than that. Wish I lived in in the lone star state. Only because of that though. I love Michigan.

Randy

BIGBEAN · 08-07-2005, 10:43 PM

Thats right it is on the out side and not under the front cover. For some reason I was thinkin it was under the fc, it all just blends together anymore. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

EXCAV8TER · 08-07-2005, 11:04 PM

ok guys...I just got an email from a fellow TDS'er and he said same problem and they pulled his motor and replaced front cover and LPOP...same issue came back on his truck...he got lucky and got a steal on a 500 mile test motor..It seems to be getting worse in my truck and has always been worse in the winter and with it coming I am not looking forward to it...I am just sick of it...always haveing to rev the motor on the first start and watch the mech. gauge..even in the afternoon I have to watch it if it has sat for a while...so nice to get in the EX and just crank it and watch the idiot gauge show pressure in 2 seconds flat...so if I pull everything apart and the front cover is scored then i still have to pull the motor.. and if its not the front cover then its the oil pickup tube right and then again it has to be pulled...well if it has to come out it'll damn well be a new one going back in...I'm not paying 48K for a new truck..I'd rather spend 4-5K and be done with it..

so its either the front cover, oil pickup or check valve which I have already replaced..can it be anything else?? The LPOP can't really get "weak" can it? it is what fills the HPOP reservoir right? and that being low will cause a "misstart" and have to fill it again and try to recrank. I already wore out the threads of the oil pressure sending unit in the top cover of the HPOP and had to replace it...This is getting old...

btw can the oil pickup tube be seam welded to the backside of the front cover??? just an idea...
Very frustrating... other than that it runs like a champ and still tows the hell outta 21K on a regular basis...
Tom

EXCAV8TER · 08-07-2005, 11:23 PM

Hey David why dont you just work me up a bid to sell me your $3500 long block and install in my truck and I'll leave it with you when I leave on vacation on the 17th...we're taking the ex and going to Baltimore MD, Savannah Georgia, Daytona Beach and Ft. Walton Beach...I was gonna have a Suncoast installed in the EX when we passed through but hell its shifting like a charm..I could wait on that and have the motor done in mine first...I'll call you in the AM...
Tom

EXCAV8TER · 08-07-2005, 11:25 PM

oh and one more thing on this oil issue....right after an oil change it starts MUCH better and pressure comes right up where as if the oil has 2000 or more miles on it...its harder to start? any clue??? is the oil losing its viscosity and becomming thinner?

MrPlowJr_EZ_V · 08-08-2005, 12:18 AM

What kind of oil ya usin'? Might try a synthetic. or maybe somthing with a good anti-foam additive.

Have you sent any samples out, maybe fuel in the oil? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shrug.gif[/img]

reinerguy · 08-08-2005, 12:19 AM

Just did replace one.

The LPOP in a PSD is a gearotor type. It mounts to the $500 front cover and includes a housing, two geared elements and shaft. Those parts can be purchased at a Ford dealer for about $100. As stated in an earlier post, the front surface of the front cover forms the rear of the pump, so if it is too damaged the pump's efficiency will be affected.

The specs I have for the pump say you should have .001 to .003 axial play from the gear to the housing mounting surface. A gearotor has a center gear that spins an outer geared ring. The space between the outer ring and the housing (radial play) should be between .028 and .032.

My pump was a little out of spec on both measurements.

My source has no spec for the wear of the teeth of the gear, but when we compared the new pump to the old one, there was about .015 difference.

As critical as engine oil is to the PSD, I can't help but believe that it is important to make sure the LPOP is working as it should. I have been having hard start problems and a reservoir leak down problem. A more effective pump won't solve the leak down, but it will at least refill the reservoir faster!

I can't tell you how much good the new LPOP did because when we tried to start the engine after R&R, one of the high pressure hoses burst. (435,000 miles on the hoses) If I can find new hoses in stock, we'll know tomorrow...

EXCAV8TER · 08-08-2005, 08:06 AM

please let me know what you find out!!

and plow...I am using rotella 15w40 and have been for 200K...
TIA
Tom