Truck stumbles in reverse as rpm is slowly increased - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
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99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain Discussion of the 99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 1999-Up Super Duty trucks and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 7.3L Power Stroke engine.

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Old 01-22-2010, 11:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Truck stumbles in reverse as rpm is slowly increased

See if you've heard of this one. I put my truck in reverse and slowly backed it up my driveway. It's an incline and so I gave it a little gas. After about 5-6 seconds at 1000-1200 rpm, the engine stumbles. At the same time, I hear relays click and the "wait to start", "check engine" and "water in fuel" lights come on, then go back out. No codes show up in my code reader after this. I can repeat this event over and over.

As long as I slowly increase rpms in reverse while either backing up a hill or holding the brake, it will stumble or even stall. It restarts right away. It does not do this in forward gears. If I add power too quickly, it will run fine. It's just when I add power slowly over several seconds that I get this glitch. Any ideas what I should look for?
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper

Last edited by bwst; 01-23-2010 at 07:23 PM. Reason: more information
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Old 01-23-2010, 07:26 PM   #2 (permalink)
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See if you've heard of this one. I put my truck in reverse and slowly backed it up my driveway. It's an incline and so I gave it a little gas. After about 5-6 seconds at 1000-1200 rpm, the engine stumbles. At the same time, I hear relays click and the "wait to start", "check engine" and "water in fuel" lights come on, then go back out. No codes show up in my code reader after this. I can repeat this event over and over.

As long as I slowly increase rpms in reverse while either backing up a hill or holding the brake, it will stumble or even stall. It restarts right away. It does not do this in forward gears. If I add power too quickly, it will run fine. It's just when I add power slowly over several seconds that I get this glitch. Any ideas what I should look for?
It's stalling with light throttle in forward gear now. I wonder if I've got a short in the wiring on a bracket somewhere.
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 01-25-2010, 01:11 AM   #3 (permalink)
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It's stalling with light throttle in forward gear now. I wonder if I've got a short in the wiring on a bracket somewhere.
I pulled my Edge programmer to see if that was the cause. Still have the stumble. Fairly repeatable by powerbraking in reverse at low revs. Something else interesting about this. If I hold the throttle at the point of the stumble, it recovers and goes to idle, even though I still have the peddle down a bit. I can move the pedal to the floor and the engine stays at idle. It works again when I release the peddle and then press it again. So the PCM is ignoring the throttle pedal after this glitch.

What could cause this? I appreciate any guidance you have.
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper

Last edited by bwst; 01-25-2010 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 01-25-2010, 08:10 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I pulled my Edge programmer to see if that was the cause. Still have the stumble. Fairly repeatable by powerbraking in reverse at low revs. Something else interesting about this. If I hold the throttle at the point of the stumble, it recovers and goes to idle, even though I still have the peddle down a bit. I can move the pedal to the floor and the engine stays at idle. It works again when I release the peddle and then press it again. So the PCM is ignoring the throttle pedal after this glitch.

What could cause this? I appreciate any guidance you have.

I feel like I'm talking to myself. This problem must not be straightforward. This is what I tried today. Took it to the shop today and was able to demonstrate the stumble/drop to idle/stall while in reverse. They looked it over with the ford scanner and did not see any glitches from anything, including the CPS. The tech reflashed the PCM with the current calibration from Ford, and after that, could not repeat the stumble. I will drive it for a couple of weeks with the Edge disconnected and see if the symptoms repeat themselves. The working theory is the Edge somehow confused the PCM and it manifested itself in this glitch. It's hard to swallow because this shop recommends the Edge to their customers. They appear to be as anxious as I am to see how the truck responds over the next few weeks.
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 01-25-2010, 09:08 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I have a friend with an 97 auto 7.3 who had a similar problem where the truck would stall when in reverse. Seems that it was the torque convertor starting to act up. He was told by a mechanic friend to change out his transmission fluid to synthetic fluid. When he did it, it solved the problem...that was about 4 or more years ago.
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:54 AM   #6 (permalink)
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let me know when you find out your issues. I am having the exact issue today, i installed my gauges last night and am trying to see if that was the problem or something else.
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:15 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Thanks for the comments. I've driven it today, including backing up our driveway with no glitches. So far, so good. It would be something if the reflash was the solution. Kind of stinks that the Edge would cause this though. I'd like to sell it or otherwise get rid of it and look for gauges instead. I miss being able to monitor EGTs and Boost.

Not sure I can sell the Edge in good faith. I'd hate for someone to have a glitch like this caused by it. I guess we take a risk when we add chips and programmers to our rigs.
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:26 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Thanks for the comments. I've driven it today, including backing up our driveway with no glitches. So far, so good. It would be something if the reflash was the solution. Kind of stinks that the Edge would cause this though. I'd like to sell it or otherwise get rid of it and look for gauges instead. I miss being able to monitor EGTs and Boost.

Not sure I can sell the Edge in good faith. I'd hate for someone to have a glitch like this caused by it. I guess we take a risk when we add chips and programmers to our rigs.
How old is your edge. I had the first version which lasted to 05. It was causing similar problems, but was none repairalble. But Edge gave me a great deal to replace it with the new version, which works great, and is servicable. Call them, they have great customer service. They also have the new cts programmer with a touch screen controller and gauges. Real nice unit.
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Old 01-28-2010, 11:06 PM   #9 (permalink)
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My edge juice was made in March 07. I spoke with tech support over there and they said no way could the edge juice affect the PCM, since it just reads what the PCM is putting out and adds it's own output - different from a programmer apparently. Given that, I really do not know what the root cause of this reverse stumble/stall was. But so far, the reflash of the PCM has fixed the problem. Three days now with no issues.

I think I'll go ahead and sell the edge juice and finish working on getting the truck reliable and up to date on maintenance. I will be changing the tranny fluid and transfercase fluid this weekend. Also just noticed the ABS connectors at the fenders have been disconnected. Have to start another thread on that one.
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 02-07-2010, 09:45 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Well, the stumble/hesitation in reverse is back. Brief stumble as I was backing up the driveway, but no dash lights as last time. Then I backed my travel trailer into its spot and it stumbled like it did before, with the dash lights briefly on (check engine, wait to start, water in fuel).

I just got this truck a month ago, and the previous owner confirmed its on the recall CPS from Ford, replaced 1 year ago. I'm tempted to change it out for the IH CPS and see what happens. I still dont see how the CPS could cause the dash lights I spoke of to go on. They seem unrelated.

I've seen threads on the PCM causing this or engine wiring shorting on the drivers side. The latter seems like a possiblity since it happens in reverse mostly (engine rocking one direction in reverse vs the other). The wiring looks pretty well protected around the valve covers though - in plastic sleeving.

What would you do next?
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 02-08-2010, 12:10 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I believe that is in fact a torque convertor issue. Mine started doing that and a few months later my tranny went. GET IT LOOKED AT NOW, I didnt and because I didnt I spent thousands on a whole tranny rebuild when I could have solved it earlier just getting a new torque convertor. When my converter went it sent metal through my whole tranny.
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Old 02-08-2010, 12:36 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Browning01, If the converter is the problem, why do I get check engine, water in fuel and wait to start lights on briefly during the stumble? And wouldn't I feel the converter locking up, as I'm slowing rolling in reverse, jerking the truck backward as it tries to lock up? The stall/stumble is like a loss of power, with no jerking.

Can you tell me more about the symtoms leading up to your converter failure?
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 02-13-2010, 12:55 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I've been digging around more on this site, and found a suggestion from F350_6 that seems to fit what's been going on. I checked the engine wire harness on the driver's side where it passes through a connector and bracket and over the valve cover. Found two spots on the cover rubbed shiny under the harness where the wires come out of the connector, but are not taped up yet. Suprised Ford did not tape these wires up better. I taped them up. Hope that's it, but it makes the most sense to me, given the three dash lights I get during the stumble (maybe a PCM reset occuring), and also just happening primarily in reverse.
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 04-12-2010, 06:43 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Replaced my drivers side UVC harness today due to injector #4 quitting (harness had pulled loose under valve cover). While pulling things off to get at the valve cover, I was able to get a better look at the wire that had shorted on the cover. Definately worn through. It was a pink (salmon?) colored wire with a yellow stripe. I taped it up again and proceeded with the UVC repair.
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2000 F350 XLT 7.3L 4x4 CC LB SRW, Auto, 3.73, 4" turbo back exhaust, S&B intake, Warn manual hubs, Ride Right Air bags, Torklift Stableloads, Roll-a-long package, leveled, Michelin LTX M/S2 285's in winter, Toyo 19.5's on Vision 81 wheels when carrying camper, Edge w/ Attitude, Isspro EV2 trans gauge, ATS turbo housing, EBPV delete, foil delete, AIH delete, Riffraff FRx, HPx, Hutch and Harpoon, Rancho rs9000 shocks, Rawhide canopy, Superhitch, 173K

Repairs so far: front hub bearings, ball joints, UVCH, chafing harness on valve cover, injector cups, degas tank, ICP sensor, normal maintenance items.

2008 Host Everest 11.5 Camper
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Old 04-13-2010, 07:08 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Thanks for posting. I've been fighting the UVHC problem as well, but noticed at times it would stumble or die when backing up. I thought it was caused when I was turning the steering wheel possibly. I'll look at the harness again.

Now I think I've got a fuel problem and going to do the Hutch mod. Now it only happens when I'm below 1/4 tank.

CC
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