Third Dead Alternator in 3 Years!

[Gyro]

My wife and I live full-time I a fifth-wheel trailer, so we aren't always near the Ford dealer we bought our 2005 F-350 6.0 Diesel from.

In Williams, AZ, I had to get the truck jumped by a local garage. They tested both Motocraft batteries, and found them both bad. They gave me two big honkin' batteries that didn't even allow the shroud to fit over the left battery, but had none other.

A few days later, a few miles away in Flagstaff, AZ, in May of '07, the truck died in midtown traffic. I had no idea why, a little before the stall, that the radio's volume was way lower than normal.

During all the deaths, while attempting to crank it back to life, I noted that all the gages "bounced" a lot, (below the low marks,) after trying to start it. That went on for five or ten seconds after turning the key off. Then they'd go back to "zero" and stop "bouncing."

After sitting there for twenty minutes, I was able to start it, and drove it down the main drag to the Ford dealer. They told me the alternator was bad. (I have no idea why I didn't ask the garage to test that the few days earlier. But I didn't.) I got a new alternator, and they called that garage to ask if I couldn't return the two batteries, (I was able to, thankfully,) since the Ford dealer had Motocrafts for the truck, since I really wanted that shroud back on.

All was well until August of '08, when the left battery died. The local Ford dealer replaced it with another Motocraft. The right battery tested fine.

In December of '08, in Gulf Shores, Alabama, I had the same occurrence that went on in Arizona, with no starting and the "bouncing" gages. I charged the batteries for a day. The local Ford dealer couldn't find any trouble.

The next day, it died, with the usual symptoms, again. I brought it to a local auto-electric shop, where they ran the tests to find the right battery dead, along with the alternator.

We just arrived for the winter in Gulf Shores, again, and it's happened, again. The alternator had to be swapped. (Too bad I was 13 lousy days past the one year parts warranty the shop gives.)

I'd like to hear from experienced owners about what the heck the gages "bouncing" for five to ten seconds after trying to start, (when the batteries are either dead or drained due to a bad alternator,) might be.

I'd also like to hear what the heck I can do to get some gage installed to tell me when the alternator's not putting out teh proper juice. The electrical problem indication never glimmered, at any time other than when I turn the key ON.

I swear the truck's got some electrical bug in it, causing all this to happen.

I drive with my headlights on all the time. And we do pull a hefty 38' fifth-wheel when we travel. But it's not a 24/7 type of load.

If I can get this problem out of my hair, I'll post about the several EGR Valves and Coolers that I've had changed, along with the rumor about sand in the 6.0 blocks, causing oil galleries to plug up, blowing those vital parts.

Thanks In Advance,
Steve

[BTBBT]

Getting a alternator from anywhere but a Ford dealer or having it rebuilt my a reputable shop is iffy. First thing I would do is have them double and triple check all the connections and the wire about 4-6" back for any corrosion that will lead to a resistance in the wire causing the alternator to work harder than it has to thus leading to a shorter life. Second, I would install a heavier gauge wire (some suggest 4gauge) directly from the alternator to the battery(since they are tied together, the closest one will work just fine). Third thing, check all your grounds for good clean connections. Fourth, I would look seriously into getting a higher output alternator. My personal recommendation is dbelectrical.com but there are others out there.

Now, as for gauges I would recommend two. How and where you do this is totally up to you. You want to measure both the voltage at the batteries (and if possible, at various other points too, for troubleshooting, like the alternator, and the fuse box inside the truck). Because of the way volt meters work, running a few wires and a mulitposition switch will allow you to monitor different locations easily. The second gauge I'd run is an ammeter. You want to monitor the current going from the alternator to the batteries. You will be watching both voltage and current. This is like watching pressure and flow of a plumbing system. Same concept.

Here's why your dash gauges 'bounce' as you put it. When the batteries are dead and can no longer supply the needed current to run the truck the voltage will drop. Since these trucks are very electrical in nature, when the voltage drops, the system will sort of 'reset' and that's when the gauges will do a full sweep and possibly 'bounce'.

on a side note, have you seen the coolant filters that are available for these trucks? the casting sand is a well known issue and MANY have had numerous issues with sand destroying different parts of the engine. A coolant filter will work wonders.

[teamroper60]

It sounds to me like you need a bigger (more amps) alternator... This past Christmas, I towed my 5er down to my folks house. On the way home, for some reason, I decided to hit the "Charge Protect" button on my AIC (doing so while driving or with your foot on the brake will tell you voltage). It showed 12.9v. Since I had recently replaced both batteries, I suspected the alternator was about to give up on me. Once I got home and unhooked, I again hit the "Charge Protect" button and discovered by voltage was 13.6v. So I feel pretty certain the alternator is fine, just undersized for my application. Chances are, you are in the same predicament. I plan to replace mine with a bigger one before camping season starts.

I was part of a dbelectrical group buy on a 225 amp alternator on another site. The alts were shipped in boxes that said 200 amps. We called dbelectrical and they assured us the alts were 225 amp versions in the wrong box.. Well, we decided to take a random sample of the bunch and have them tested. The result was that the supposed 225 amp alternators turned out to be less than 160 amps. We again called dbelectrical who basically told us they were (at that time) unable to build a true 225 amp version. Needless to say, we shipped them back. As a result of that experience, I am gonna go with one of the so-called "large case" models being sold by a couple of different companies...

[444-4D]

My truck reads 14.4 when I push the charge protect button.

[Gyro]

BTBBT,

You give loads of ideas to go through. The reason I ended up with this last non-Ford alternator, (in Flagstaff, it was a Ford dealer who installed it,) was because the dang Ford dealer came up with "no trouble found," when I knew there was a problem. Since the auto-electric people's work would have to go through my extended warranty people, I just got lazy and let them do the alternator, too.

I would hope to be somewhere where I could get a larger alternator, next time...And hope the warranty people cover it. Money's getting increasingly difficult to cough up.

I suppose the wiring may have corrosion, since we have spent some time along the southern areas, near the coastlines. I'll have to see what I can do to check all that out, without making a mess of the wiring.

Due to the problems this particular truck's given us over the past three years, (the electrical and the EGR stuff,) we're planning on getting it traded in for one with the 6.7 Diesel in it. I don't know why, but I have a mental block against the 6.4.

Thanks!
Steve

[Gyro]

teamroper60,

You mention the "Charge Protect" button. Where is that on a 2005? I haven't seen anything that does that...But bear in mind my memory, and any compulsion to push buttons when things are going well aren't too strong.

I'm seriously considering getting at LEAST one gage for telling me if/when the alternator starts to drop off. I still have no idea why there's a battery-looking idiot light, but no apparent failure brings it to the point of working to warn this idiot of any approaching problem.

And that problem of the alleged 225A alternators causes some concern, since I have absolutely no way to test such a thing, myself.

Due to in-law problems, we're likely to be heading back to the place we bought the truck. Those Ford mechanics are decent people who haven't led me astray, so far. I'm going to ask them several questions on the two problems, and see if they start to shirk from being open about what I can do. I know the mechanic who did a head gasket job on this truck is into diesels, big time. I'll buy him lunch and pick his brain about alternators. I'd also like to hear his take on the sand issue. I just feel there's gotta be more damage to my engine from the sand then a couple EGR coolers, and an oil cooler. I'd like to get Ford to give me a compression check, at least.

Thanks,
Steve

[2004fx4]

I would like to suggest that you get something like I have. I have a ScanGauge 2. I had a problem new years eve where I noticed my lights seemed dim. On a ScanGauge 2 it easily plugs into the plug the dealer uses under the dash. I run it all the time, you can see a lot of different readings. I had mine set for air temp, fuel milage, trans temp, and water temp. I switched one to read volts and seen I was at 11.5 volts. I went to the dealer the first day they were open. I ended up with a new alternator and two batteries. Besides the lights being dim I would have never know there was a problem. I, like you, did not have any warning lights on. I was told that the truck will not show a battery light until it is below 10 volts.

[jcameron]

I went trough a couple but I have a Boss V Plow and when it's taken power my lights dim, so I bought my last one through a dealer, had it about a year tried to find 130 amp, but it had same part number? But power drains can push the alternator to fail.

[BTBBT]

The charge protect button is on the Auxiliary Idle/PTO Control unit. It's an option you had to get when you got the truck. It is a separate box that usually mounts down below the "bag hook" on it's own bracket. For simple monitoring of the voltage, I've seen but never looked into, a small digital volt meter on the end of a cigarette plug. Plug it in and the digital display reads the voltage. They can't be all that expensive and are quite easy to use.

[my3wags]

. As a result of that experience, I am gonna go with one of the so-called "large case" models being sold by a couple of different companies...[/quote]

If your looking for a H/O unit that is going to last, take a look at these guys Ford Truck & SUV Alternators

I run their 190 unit on my truck with zero problems. Very high quality part !!

[Gyro]

2004fx4,

ScanGauge2 sounds like something good. I'm guessing it would have helped us NOT burn out some tranny discs when we first started full-timing, and had the 2002 7.3 overloaded by some 3000 pounds. I had heard that once the tranny temp gage moves, it's too late, and the damage is done. Thats' just what happened with us. Only a little slipping warned me, but I failed to pay attention. Then I saw the tranny temp gage move.

Had to spend five days in Dawson Creek, Canada, while the dealer fixed the tranny, warning me to NOT use OD until we hit Kansas, and he explained why. (The torque converter locks in the old OD, keeping the tranny fluid from circulating adequately through the cooler.)

It'd be great to get to see the actual information as it's happening, rather than to wait until something throws a code, and then read it with the Bully Dog programmer/Code Reader....

Best thing about it is that it's very affordable! Just a bit over the extended warranty's $100 deductible. (I might even dare buy it without awaiting approval from the Mrs!)

Thanks!

Steve

[Gyro]

jcameron,

I'm guessing that my habit of forever keeping my headlights on, (especially when towing,) does load the system down more than the various Ford mechanics I've asked about whether that attributed to the failures.

I'm leaning toward the ScanGauge, as it seems to be able to let me catch the problem before the truck's completely dead.

I'm also going to double check what alternator they installed, again, to see what its output is, and whether it meets with even Ford's suggested rating...Which I just learned isn't even in my manual.

Thanks!
Steve

[Gyro]

BTBBT,

Once again, thanks for the info.

I opted to get the Brake Controller, without the added switches, and never even gave a thought to anything to do with a PTO. When I see "PTO," I think 'Snow Plow." And once we sold our home in Fairbanks, (as well as the snow shovels, and snow blower,) I didn't even want to think about snow, or anything that goes along with it, any more.

I'll see if one of those cheap indicators is available, but would tend to prefer that ScanGauge, because it does so much else, along with reading the real time happenings for the alternator.


Steve

[lone_star_dsl]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned it yet but batteries should be changed as a pair, not one at a time.

[SIC-E]

towing heavy, you should have guages installed anyway. i too use the scan gauge II but have isspro gauges to monitor vitals. $300 seems like cheap insurance for 3 primary ones.