Wont start when cold

[Bassman4461]

Last winter started having cold start issues.Acted like it was starting on 5 or 6 cylinders then would clean up and run fine.when it would start it had bluish white smoke out tail pipe.Replaced all injector o rings and found one melted connector at valve cover gasket.Replaced all injector/glow plug harnesses and bad gasket.Replaced all glow plugs.Also replaced glow plug relay.Motor still wont fire without ether when cold.After first start motor fires and runs well until the next morning, then wont start again without ether.Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

[speeddemon31176]

How long have you been using ether to start it with? The smoke is normal on cold start up on these trucks. Sounds like you might need to do a compression check. you may want to also run a diagnostic scan on it to get the current data and to see if there are any codes stored in the PCM.

[94strokerace]

Have you put a meter across the large lugs of the relay (to verify operation), or tried to jump the large lugs? You may have a bad relay out of the box.

[Bassman4461]

Thank you speeddemon and strokerace for your replies.I have not tried jumping out the gp relay yet but will do that tonight. (had to wait until the truck sat all day and cooled off)I'm not leaning towards low compression as it runs to well after initial start and you can shut it down immediately after initial cold start and it will fire back up and run well.I noticed an oil leak that appears to be coming from the top of the motor and running down the bell housing area.Could my problem be related to low oil pressure at the injectors?Ive been a car mechanic all my life but only worked on gas rigs.Ive driven big rigs for a while for a living but didn't have to work on them,so Im new to the diesel thing as far as turning wrenches.I love the truck,nothin pulls like a diesel.I just dont want to use starting fluid and ruin it.Thanks for your help.I'm headed out to jump the gp relay rite now.Ill let you know what happens.
Randy

[Griz]

Originally Posted by Bassman4461

Thank you speeddemon and strokerace for your replies.I have not tried jumping out the gp relay yet but will do that tonight. (had to wait until the truck sat all day and cooled off)I'm not leaning towards low compression as it runs to well after initial start and you can shut it down immediately after initial cold start and it will fire back up and run well.I noticed an oil leak that appears to be coming from the top of the motor and running down the bell housing area.Could my problem be related to low oil pressure at the injectors?Ive been a car mechanic all my life but only worked on gas rigs.Ive driven big rigs for a while for a living but didn't have to work on them,so Im new to the diesel thing as far as turning wrenches.I love the truck,nothin pulls like a diesel.I just dont want to use starting fluid and ruin it.Thanks for your help.I'm headed out to jump the gp relay rite now.Ill let you know what happens.
Randy

Randy...have you tried plugging it in for a couple of hours and seeing if it'll start? If it does that pretty much points to a problem with the GP system...either GP's, GP relay or harness. Weak batteries or starter motor can also cause your type of problem.

Griz

[Bassman4461]

Good thought Griz,batteries and starter were replaced with Napa brand approximately 2years ago,but this truck doesn't get driven all the time.(I drive a company brand X 1 ton van for work)So it sits with the clock and such draining the batteries till i need the truck.But when i use it it gets used.So after putting 100 miles or so on it you would think the batteries would be charged up.I believe all the terminals are clean but I will have to check them to make sure.All the glow plugs have been changed and the harnesses under the valve covers.Just tried jumping the large terminals at the glow plug relay but had no luck getting it to fire.After about five attempts the starter started to crank slow and the truck had only been sitting for 24 hours,so maybe i have a bad terminal, or bad battery, or the alternator I put in last month is not charging properly.I will try to plug it in and see what happens but when this problem started, plugging it in would not help.That was before the injector o rings ,glow plugs, harnesses,glow plug relay,and valve cover gaskets.Anyway sorry if Im rattling on, or thinking in type its just got me stumped

[4stroke]

My truck was acting like that. The injectors had worn the poppet so bad that the armature was too far from the solenoid. Compounding the problem was the thick cold oil. I had to plug my truck in for at least four hours and then it would start on five and as it warmed up it would pick up the others and run pretty good. It would always restart warm but if it sat for more than 6 hours it would not start. I replaced the injectors with some used ones with good clearances and now the truck starts up 32 degrees F no problem.

After the problem was fixed I found this . If you look at page 6 it describes my exact proplem .

The indicator for me was there was no smoke at all coming out of my truck when I tried to start it cold.

[Bassman4461]

Hey 4stroke thanks for the info.You refer to page 6 as describing your problem but what Im seeing on page 6 is oil pump gears with to much side clearance.are you sure its not page 7 your refering to.The starting problems your describing sound the same as mine when my problem started last winter.Mine would fire on 5 or 6 then pick up the rest shortly after.the problem eventually got worse and now it seems to only try to fire on one.So did the injectors fix your problem or was it the oil pump having to much clearence

[4stroke]

The injectors were not opening their poppets because the solenoids could no longer pick them up.
The last page on that link should read this

6.) FOR HARD START LONG CRANK OR NO START WHERE THE
INJECTORS WILL NOT BUZZ LOUDLY (HAS BACKGROUND BUZZ
ONLY) WHEN COLD

Some engines have a no start/or long crank to start and the injector have a low background buzz, not a
strong normal buzz. After performing the buzz test multiple times the injector may start to buzz and the
engine may start and run fine the rest of the day until the next cold start. Typically, we find that this is a
high mileage vehicle with poor maintenance as far as oil changes are concerned. What is occurring is that
the poppet inside the injector is not able to move freely because of the thick old oil. If an oil change is
performed after driving the vehicle and then driven again with new oil the next cold start the engine may
improve.

Note: This concern is related to poor maintenance and extended oil change intervals. If poor
maintenance is the cause, then all 8 injectors will be affected. For additional information,
refer to Section 3 of the Warranty & Policy Manual under "Damage Caused by Improper
Maintenance."

If you have axcess to a scan tool with injector buzz test capability you can run the buzz test cold.
On my buzz test the engine fires all eight at once in a three to four second buzzzzzzzz. then it fires one at a time. When mine did the one at a time you could hear some nice and loud while there was 3-4 that were muffled. It is my understanding that the muffled ones are not getting the armature picked up and no oil is flowing and therefore no fuel. After my engine was warm I could run the buzz test and they all sounded the same

[Bassman4461]

Thanks 4stroke.Great info. Will have to check them this weekend ,as soon as i get a chance.I guess at this point its a good thing I don't use the truck for work rite now.May need it soon tho, If the snow flies in Washington like it did last year.Will post again when I get time to work on the truck.

[Larry S.]

I fought a similar problem for two years. I found bad injector "O" rings, burned UVC harness connector, and a few bad glow plugs in the process but the starting problem continued. I finally tracked it down to a bad cable from the starter relay to the GP relay. I was getting a full volt drop across that short wire. Replaced the wire with a 2 ga. cable that I made. Starting has been very good since replacing that wire. I'm sure all the other repairs were necessary for getting a good starting engine again but it is very apparent the glow plugs need full voltage. Any excessive drop in voltage will make the glow plugs not work. One symptom I had that pointed to a lack of voltage to the glow plugs was it would fire on a couple cylinders on initial cranking then stop firing when temps were in the 30s. Check the complete glow plug electrical system.

[Bassman4461]

.Unfortunately it doesn't matter what temp it is outside,my truck wont start.when the problem first started months ago plugging the heater in would help,but as time as gone on while ive been chasing my problem things have gotten worse,and now it wont start at all.I will take a closer look at the glow plug wiring,and do some voltage drop tests with my main tool i use at work,my faithful digital meter.I also located a scan tool i can use to pull codes.I don't believe it will do a buzz test on the injectors,but may give me a little more insight towards the cause of my woes.Thanks for the info. All of you have given me very good info.This site seems to have a vast wealth of knowledge through its members.If the rest of the world would help out others like they do here, the world would be a much better place.
Randy

[4stroke]

Let us know what codes you pull.

[Bassman4461]

Definitely will keep in touch as things progress.It may be a day or two before I can get back to the truck.Its heating season up hear in the northwest and I'm busy fixing boilers, furnaces, heat pumps and such but as soon as I get anything worth posting I,ll let you all know.
Randy

[Bassman4461]

Hey guys,
Its Saturday and i had to use the truck to haul some things.I borrowed a Actron CP9135 scanner and tried to pull codes but could not get the scanner to work after plugging it in to the connector under the dash below the glove box.I know the scanner is ok,we plugged it in to a Ford service van at work so my friend could give me a quick run down on how to use it.I tried it with the key on and off and got no response from the scanner,just a blank screen.Am i doing some thing wrong ?,or is this not the rite scanner.The info I found on the web says that this scanner will work on all OBDII Any Ideas?
Randy