Any problems with F350 height for 5ver towing?

[Armypilot]

Anyone ran into problems with their F350 SRW being too high for their 5ver to sit level?

I have had a few people tell me I will have to remove my stock blocks and replace with F250 blocks.

The Pullrite Superglide doesnt have a height adjustment i'm pretty sure so that is not an option.

I would prefer not to have to switch blocks or do anything else.

[SmokeyWren]

It depends on exactly which 5er. Some of the newer, bigger 5ers have the overhang higher off the ground. Some don't.

F-350 SRW 4x4 is really up in the air. You want that trailer level with the world when on the road, so you may have to either raise the trailer on its suspension, or lower the truck.

One way to lower the back end of the truck about 2" is to change out the so-called 4" spacer blocks in the rear suspension to the so-called 2" spacer blocks from an F-350 DRW. Or maybe get rid of the spacer blocks altogether, like 4x2s come from the factory. But there is more to lowering the truck than just spacer blocks. You'll also need to change brake lines and shocks.

For the trailer, depending on type of suspension, you may be able to "flip the axles" to gain about 3" more clearance. You don't literally turn over the axles, but instead move the spring perchs from under the axles to over the axles. Or if you know a really-good welder/engineer/fabricator, you can lengthen the spring shackles a couple of inches.

Even with my F-250 4x2 with no spacers in the rear suspension, I had to flip the axles on the first small 5er I had. The raised 5er looked like somebody wearing high-water pants, but it towed fine from coast to coast. My current 5er is just about perfectly level with 6" clearance, without doing anything more than adjusting the hitch. But if you tried to tie onto my trailer with your pickup, you probably wouldn't have enough clearacne without raising the trailer or lowering the pickup. Or both. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Armypilot]

Well Smokey it is a new 06 Grand Junction, here is a website with a picture of a shorter model but the front is pretty much the same on all their models. Probably hard to tell looking at it though.

http://www.grandjunction-rv.com

[LeeChristianson]

[ QUOTE ]
Anyone ran into problems with their F350 SRW being too high for their 5ver to sit level?

I have had a few people tell me I will have to remove my stock blocks and replace with F250 blocks.

The Pullrite Superglide doesnt have a height adjustment i'm pretty sure so that is not an option.

I would prefer not to have to switch blocks or do anything else.

[/ QUOTE ]

I remove the trailer as soon as we get to the park.. Then use the jacks to level. Easiest, cheapest thing to do.. Then the truck's available for other runs.

[CaptRon]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Anyone ran into problems with their F350 SRW being too high for their 5ver to sit level?

I have had a few people tell me I will have to remove my stock blocks and replace with F250 blocks.

The Pullrite Superglide doesnt have a height adjustment i'm pretty sure so that is not an option.

I would prefer not to have to switch blocks or do anything else.

[/ QUOTE ]

I remove the trailer as soon as we get to the park.. Then use the jacks to level. Easiest, cheapest thing to do.. Then the truck's available for other runs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I do believe that we're talking about towing the 5ver, not parking it.
I do agree though that mine gets dropped as soon as I arrive at my destination.

Capt Ron

[Armypilot]

Yep, I was talking about level while attached to the truck. My pin weight will be around 2800 pounds loaded. So hopefully it squats the truck down to level.

[FatDog]

[ QUOTE ]
Yep, I was talking about level while attached to the truck. My pin weight will be around 2800 pounds loaded. So hopefully it squats the truck down to level.

[/ QUOTE ]
and that 'squatting back to level' also takes too much weight off the steer axle and dumps it all on the drive axle, so you'll fix that by putting bags on the rear, and now you're back to riding level or high, whatever you want to call it

I have a F350 SRW 4x4 and my 5'r with flipped axles rode perfect with 5 or 6 inches of gap

[jetskier]

[ QUOTE ]
and that 'squatting back to level' also takes too much weight off the steer axle and dumps it all on the drive axle, so you'll fix that by putting bags on the rear, and now you're back to riding level or high, whatever you want to call it

[/ QUOTE ]

How exactly does it remove any weight from the steering axle. A correctly installed 5th wheel hitch is about 2" in from of the center line of the rear axle. If anything you'd add weight to the front axle. If it were a tag trailer, I'd agree. With the rear end squatting, you are more than likely changing the effective caster on the steering axle which will affect handling a bit.

[Armypilot]

Well I do have bags installed so I will be able to tune the ride height.

[barrelhorses]

I'm sure you still take weight off the front axle. Just measure the height of the front bumper before you lower the trailer onto the truck. Then measure after lowering the trailer. On mine, the front bumper is raised about 1/2" when the trailer is hooked up. So I'd say there is definitely some weight taken off the front axle. I guess you could run across a set of scales to check for sure. In fact I recall someone recently posting their scale slip and seems to me that the front axle was lighter when the trailer was hooked up.

[jetskier]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm sure you still take weight off the front axle. Just measure the height of the front bumper before you lower the trailer onto the truck. Then measure after lowering the trailer. On mine, the front bumper is raised about 1/2" when the trailer is hooked up. So I'd say there is definitely some weight taken off the front axle. I guess you could run across a set of scales to check for sure. In fact I recall someone recently posting their scale slip and seems to me that the front axle was lighter when the trailer was hooked up.

[/ QUOTE ]

You correct in that it raises, but the that's simple geometry. If you lower the rear end, the front bumper will rise because it is pivoting off the front axle.

Here's an example:
Assumptions: CC Long bed 172.4 WB. Front bumper is 36" forward of the front axle center line (estimate, I did not measure)

the front axle will raise 36/172.4 or approximately 20% of the rear squat measured at the rear axle centerline. So if the rear squats 3", the front bumper raises .6" or so. The front axle wouldn't displace at all.


Also simple engineering statics proves that if the load is placed between the two axles, you will just add load to both axles if the load is behind the rear axle it will reduce the load to the front axle (tag trailer). Fifth wheels always load at or slightly in front of the rear axle. Therefore it will add and not take away load from the front end.

Take a look at my link in my signature. The front end of my truck as measure from the ground to the top edge of the fender doesn't change when I have this trailer hooked up. Sure the bumper moves up slightly because of the pivot action.

You're right, the only way to prove it is to take it to the scales.

[barrelhorses]

I knew I should have paid more attention in geometry class [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Does anyone have any scale slips to help us figure out how the front axle is affected by trailer pin weight of a 5er or GN?

[PerryB]

If the pin is directly over the rear axle, the front axle weight is not affected. If the pin is ahead of the rear axle then the front axle weight is going to increase as load is applied to the hitch. Most 5th & GN's are set up 1 to 2" ahead of the axle, so the front axle load will increase (very slightly) when hitched up to a trailer. My front axle weight goes up about 25 lbs. with the trailer hooked up. This was on a certified scale at our grain co-op. Here is a way to calculate the axle weights without a scale, assuming you already know the pin weight. Divide the wheelbase (in inches) by the distance from the front axle to the kingpin. If the pin is ahead of the axle you will end up with a number slightly greater than 1.0 --- if behind, then the number will be just below 1.0 For accuracy, go 3 or 4 places right of the decimal when doing these calcs. Divide your known pin weight by this number to find out how much you've actually put on the rear axle. If this new number is less than the pin weight(which it will be if your hitch is ahead of center), the difference between this number and the actual pin weight is how much has gone to the front axle. If the new number is greater than actual pin weight, the difference is how much you've taken off the front axle (and put on the rear).This will be the case when the pin is behind center - which is rare and not recommended.

[jetskier]

FWIW, for the sake of the original topic, my 5er sits nose down about an inch when coupled to the truck. The truck still sits a taste higher than level in the rear. With this arrangement, I have about 7-8 inches clear between the bed rail and trailer body.

The cool thing with my trailer is that you can raise the trailer using the adjustable spring hanger. It came from the factory with predrilled holes with three different settings. The only downside is that a standard triple step is not tall enough beyond the lowest setting. If they could only come up with a quad step. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shrug.gif[/img] I've only seen one and I didn't like the construction and functionality. I ended up with a folding bottom step that I picked up from Camping World. On level ground I don't really need it, but at the lake when park on the beach, it is mandatory.

[barrelhorses]

O.K. After a little bit of sleep, I'm finally with you on the idea that a 5er or GN will not reduce front axle weight if the hitch is installed right at or in front of the rear axle.