Looking for trailer buying advice (car hauler)

[Blk88GT]

I'm looking to buy an enclosed trailer to haul my racecar, parts and gear.

I will go no smaller or larger than a 24' tag with a 30" V nose, or 32' gooseneck.

The trailer will be standard height and will have 5200lb torsion axles. The trailer will have cabinets, a winch, batteries/inverter, 4800w Yamaha generator, air compressor and possibly a small 110v welder.

My family and I (wife and 2 kids) will be sleeping in the trailer when I go to the racetrack to avoid tenting.

My questions are:

1. Gooseneck or conventional?

1a. If gooseneck, what are the benefits other than space? The weight of the goose (unloaded) is 1200lbs more than the tag and obviously carries more weight on the rear axle than the tag.

1b. If tag, why?

2. Should I be concerned about the GVW of my truck either way? Being that the GVW is 8800 and the truck weighs 8k with a full load of fuel and just me, I don't see any way I can even put groceries in the truck with my family in it, nevermind a trailer! Some super duty I have here.

The gooseneck is a 2-5k upgrade over the tag. I love the idea of the extra space for sleeping and the "You can't borrow my trailer because you don't have a hitch" problem. But what are the benefits? Any fuel mileage benefits to either one of these?

I'm going trailer shopping tomorrow and would like to be informed of the "right" choice by those in the know. Changing trucks at this point is not really an option.

Thanks in advance.

[SmokeyWren]

Originally Posted by Blk88GT

I'm looking to buy an enclosed trailer to haul my racecar, parts and gear.
...

Changing trucks at this point is not really an option.

Then you're probably going to be overloaded with either type of trailer. However, you will be a lot more overloaded with the gooseneck than with a tag, so you should probably go with a tag plus a Hensley Arrow hitch.

1. Gooseneck or conventional?

You'll be too much overloaded over the GVWR of the tow vehicle with the goose, so the tag is your only logical choice if you can't trade for more truck.

1a. If gooseneck, what are the benefits other than space?

Tows like a dream. In order to make a tag trailer tow as good as a gooseneck, you have to spend the big bucks for a Hensley Arrow hitch. But with a tag and a Hensley Arrow hitch, there is not enough difference between it and a gooseneck to argue about.

Click on this link for more info on the Hensley Arrow:
Hensley® the ONLY trailer hitch guaranteed to totally eliminate trailer sway.

The gooseneck will probably cost more than a similar quality tag with the same interior dimensions, until you factor in the cost of the hitch installed for both trailers. The gooseneck ball installed in your truck is a lot less expensive than a Hensley Arrow, so by the time you factor in the cost of a good hitch the two trailers will probably cost about the same.

1b. If tag, why?

Hitch weight.

A properly-loaded gooseneck will probably have 18 to 20 percent of the trailer's gross weight as hitch weight. Some have as high as 24 percent hitch weight. A properly-loaded tag trailer will have only 10 to 12 percent hitch weight.

So if the wet and loaded trailer grosses 10,000, a gooseneck will probably have a hitch weight of around 1,800 to 2,000 pounds while the tag will have a hitch weight of around 1,000 to 1,200. You'll be over the GVWR of the tow vehicle with the tag trailer, but overloaded an additional 600 to 1,000 pounds or more with the goose.

2. Should I be concerned about the GVW of my truck either way?

Of course. But assume that your "real" GVWR is 9,900 pounds, not the 8,800 Ford downrated your F-250. And with either trailer you'll probably need to install rear airbags in the truck to prevent the headlights from aiming at the stars at night.

The gooseneck is a 2-5k upgrade over the tag. I love the idea of the extra space for sleeping and the "You can't borrow my trailer because you don't have a hitch" problem. But what are the benefits? Any fuel mileage benefits to either one of these?

No, not unless one is taller or wider than the other. Frontal area, not hitch design, affects fuel mileage.

The big deal is that hitch. Folks hate to spend $3,000 for a hitch, even though it's worth it. So suck it up and assume that if you want a tag trailer so you don't overload your F-250 too much, you have to have the right hitch to make is safe and pleasant to tow when your family is involved.

[Blk88GT]

Smokey, I appreciate the advice.

However, please don't take this the wrong way.There is not a snowman's chance in hell I'd EVER spend 3k US on a hitch. I will be upgrading my truck in the next 2-3 years to something with a GVW as close to 10k without going over. Otherwise I need to get a yearly safety inspection to the tune of ~$100.

With that said, does the gooseneck tow that much better than a tag using a simple weight distributing hitch? I already have a gooseneck hitch in my truck (came with it), so there is no added expense there. The only added expense is the option on the trailer itself. I have no problem installing airbags or Timbrens should I require them.

[NickKent]

If you're looking at a 32' gooseneck you should look at something with at least 6k axles. Even better 7k axles. The goose will always tow better. If your trailer weighs 10k loaded which is probably light, you'll have a tongue weight of at least 1800 lbs with the goose. I would load your truck up with stuff and the family and go weigh just the truck to see what the rear axle weight is. I would not worry about going over the GVWR of the truck but I do worry about the GAWR's. The goose is always going to be better, but your truck will have a hard time handling that weight legally. If you go with the tag upgrade to 6k or 7k axles.

[xcr8oo151]

i cannot see that you'r truck's curb wheight is 8000# when my ccf-350 shorty 7.3 is 7500# full of fuel and a tool box full of junk.i would get that pig on a scale agian.then go from there.

[Blk88GT]

I cannot tow a trailer with a GVW over 10k without a different class license where I am. All trailers over 10k GVW also need a yearly safety inspection (~$100) so I would prefer to avoid it all together. As long as the GVW is 9900lbs, I'm in good shape.

I can hit the CAT scale instead of the one at the dump. It was 7800 without me in it last time I weighed it.

I'm heading out to look at trailers in the morning. The gooseneck option depends how much extra they want for it. I'm pretty sure I'll end up with a tag, unfortunately.

[durantdiesel]

I run into this all the time. When you build trailers you are constantly getting this. The brass tax is if you are buying a trailer that is not rated for what you are going to put in it or on it just because you don't want to get the appropriate licence to be legal with said trailer than you are putting the people around you at risk. The DOT are not stupid they can look at your tires while you are driving and see that you are overloaded. Then there is the overload ticket, if there is an accident you will be at fault regardless because you are running illegal then the ambulance chasers get involved. This I have seen personally, so its up to you, but in my opinion its not worth the $100 year inspection. Not trying to stir anything up but I have seen what can happen because of this scenario first hand so Im just trying to save everyone some greif.

[SmokeyWren]

Originally Posted by Blk88GT

With that said, does the gooseneck tow that much better than a tag using a simple weight distributing hitch?

Yes. A gooseneck and a fifth-wheel trailer have the same advantage over a tag trailer: No sway.

A tag trailer connected with even the best of the Reese/Drawtite/Equal-I-Zer-type weight-distributing hitchs with dual sway controls can still sway. Sway is a killer. I will not tow a tag trailer that grosses more than about 5,000 pounds without a Hensley Arrow hitch. If you ever experience a swaying trailer, you'll agree.

I have three tag trailers, but none of them ever grosses over 5,000 pounds. For over 5,000 pounds, I use my fifth-wheel trailer.

[Blk88GT]

Originally Posted by durantdiesel

I run into this all the time. When you build trailers you are constantly getting this. The brass tax is if you are buying a trailer that is not rated for what you are going to put in it or on it just because you don't want to get the appropriate licence to be legal with said trailer than you are putting the people around you at risk. The DOT are not stupid they can look at your tires while you are driving and see that you are overloaded. Then there is the overload ticket, if there is an accident you will be at fault regardless because you are running illegal then the ambulance chasers get involved. This I have seen personally, so its up to you, but in my opinion its not worth the $100 year inspection. Not trying to stir anything up but I have seen what can happen because of this scenario first hand so Im just trying to save everyone some greif.

I don't plan on grossing over 10k in the trailer, so it's not an issue. Trailer weight is around 4000-4500, the car is 3000 and then add tools/gear. It'll be close to 9k all said and done which puts me under the 10k GVW of the trailer.

I appreciate all the advice guys, I'm headed out now to look at them!

[SmokeyWren]

A bit of web surfing turned up the trailer you say you want.

Pace American model SCXF8530TA3
30' inside length (including bed over gooseneck)
Two 5,000-pound axles = GVWR 10,000 pounds
15" tires and wheels
Rear ramp door 5,500# capacity

But empty trailer weighs 6,064 pounds, leaving only 3,936# for the race car and "stuff"

Pace American - Shadow GT Racing Trailers

I would move up one notch to the same trailer but with two 6,000 pound axles and 16" tires. That adds a coupla hundred pounds to the empty weight, but increases the payload to around 5,700 pounds. So that gives you some wiggle room if you decide to throw a coupla extra tires/wheels into the trailer.

CM trailers is big around here. Tough. Strong. Last "forever". They have a 30' gooseneck enclosed trailer too, but not with those wimpy 5,000 pound axles.

AL AUTO EXPRESS GN

Available Sizes
Gooseneck, 30' x 8' width, w/2-7000# axle, 8-hole 16" tires and wheels

Dimensions
6'-6" body height
8' body width (96" outside body width,
102" overall width at wheel well),
80" inside wheel well width,
83" rear entrance width,
75" rear entrance height (varies with optional inside height)
7' gooseneck length

I have a small Pace American enclosed trailer. Good stuff. Most of the CM trailers around here are horse trailers. Good stuff also.

[NickKent]

You need the weight of the whole truck and the Rear Axle weight. That is what you should really be concerned with. Weigh your rear axle and you will know what kind of tongue weight you can take. Don't worry about your GVWR worry about the RGAWR. (Rear Gross Axle Weight Rating). Example- the truck in my sig has a Ford GVWR of 8800. I have the truck registered at 10k though. The front has a FGAWR of 4600 and the rear RGAWR is 6084. I run a snow plow and pull a trailer at the same time sometimes. Way over my 8800 rating but not over the axle ratings. You should get a tag trailer and put the reese dual cam sway setup on it. Use the 12k trunnion bars. I have owned a 24' enclosed haulmark trailer before. 8.5' wide. The GVWR of the trailer was 7k which was a joke. Weighed more than it could haul. If it is possible I would get a trailer with the heavier axles and just have the manufacturer sticker the trailer at your 9900 GVWR. Those 15" tires suck. Good luck with your purchase.

[Blk88GT]

I went and checked out the trailers today. I'm going to be ordering an H+H Flat top car hauler (CL series for those interested) H & H Trailer Company - CL101x24

Smokey, the PACE Shadow GT is one of the higher rated trailers. There is nowhere for me to look at them locally and I hate buying things sight unseen.

I'm going to go with the 24ft tag model + small V nose. Trailer weight is ~4600lbs. It's a heavy trailer, but it's the best quality trailer I could find. Unfortunately I can't afford the gooseneck (20k with tax!) .

I'll weigh my truck when I get a chance and report back on the total weight and the rear axle weight. Unfortunatley the trailer is only available in 15" wheels with the 5200lb axles. I'll cover my &#% by getting two spares, just in case.

I'll inquire if they'll put the larger axles on and sticker it lower, that's a great idea. I would be willing to pay extra for that, no doubt.

I really appreciate all the feedback guys!

[olddieseldude]

I think you'll find the H&H to be a well built trailer. I've had their 10K-20ft tilt bed for a few years now and am very happy with it.

[Al Mighty]

Something to keep in mind...I'm pulling my 24' car hauler with my ccsb pickup, and when it is empty, or pretty light (~3-4k lbs inside) it tends to get squirrely when side winds hit etc.

Have you seen Optima trailers? I was browsing car trailers on my blackberry last night and they look pretty impressive..smooth sides, all aluminum, no need for transition flaps on the rear door etc.

[Bill1013]

Check out Pull-Rite hitches. PullRite has a SAFER, STRONGER, BETTER designed hitch for you

Don't know the price of them anymore, but I believe they are less than a Hensley

There is two dealers in Winnipeg