opinions on electric/hydraulic disc trailer brakes - Diesel Forum

mndorf · 04-17-2006, 08:55 AM

I'm looking at an older flatbed tandem dual gn. Newer 12k axles were retrofitted and they have hydraulic disc brakes. The electric over hydraulic system was retrofitted.

Anyone have experience with this braking system? Anything I should look out for? Do the DOT inspectors have issues with these retrofits?

Bruce

CaptRon · 04-17-2006, 09:18 AM

I would call this an upgrade instead of a refit, especially the discs as they are so much better than drums. The hydraulic unit was needed for the discs and is an upgrade over electric brakes.
I wish that I could afford to upgrade my fifth wheel like this but it's not cheap. DOT never has a problem with upgrading the brakes to a better system.

Capt Ron

CCOUGHRAN · 04-17-2006, 10:30 AM

i had a 45' flatbed built last year using 22# beam, and 12k elec/hyd disc brakes,i love it...

the only thing that takes a little time getting used to is the delay while the plunger applies pressure to the hyd system.it may be 2-3 second delay.

i have trailers with vacuum/hyd, elec/hyd, and electric..

absolute best is the elec/hyd., they are very smooth compared to electic as well.

chris

haul_n_horses2 · 04-17-2006, 11:02 AM

I do not haul commercial so I have not had to deal with DOT, but my horse trailer has a GVWR of 23,000# and I had the 8K Dexter axles with their disc brake system installed. With the BrakeSmart controller, the hydraulic pump has a very short lag before you feel actuation and the trailer brakes alone will put you through the windshield. Definite improvement over any electric brakes I have driven. Maximum load in this trailer has been about 18K # and braking was very secure. I had no qualms driving down some pretty steep grades (I75 Northbound from KY into Cincinnati, OH and the like).

CaptSkup · 04-17-2006, 11:29 AM

I have electric over hydraulic disc brakes(three axles) on our new Teton. They are the best option you can get. That trailer weighs over 22,000lbs, hitched to the truck easily 30,000. The brakes will stop both the trailer and the truck on a dime. I just wish Ford's Tow Command would work with this system. Hoping for in the '07-'08 models.

kiteflyer · 04-18-2006, 10:54 AM

I up-graded my 5th wheel to Electric-Hydraulic disk brakes and am very happy. The up-grade was a weekend project. I would spend the money again in a heartbeat. I don’t understand the 2-3 second delay comment. The actuator I got has a 300 milla-second response time. This means that it will go from 0 to 1600 psi in less then 1/3 of a second. In effect it means I can lock up the brake in less than 27 feet at 60 MPH and have done it. I also have a BrakeSmart controller. I think that in its self has a lot to do with better braking as it made a significant improvement with the electric drum brakes.

CCOUGHRAN · 04-18-2006, 11:14 AM

the comment about the 2-3 second delay came from my past experience.

now, i am not using a brakesmart, thought i would like to have one in the trucks. it may be that the hydraulic pressure is not as grabby as the electric brakes, so you don't notice the brakes being applied.

it could have been the setting on my controller, because it does allow you do set the delay.

it would be interesting to see if the delay is due to my controllers, or the trailer. the 45' trailer is usually behind the 04 550, but when i picked it up from the mfg, it was behind the 03 3500. it acts the same with both of my trucks.

chris

haul_n_horses2 · 04-18-2006, 01:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don’t understand the 2-3 second delay comment. The actuator I got has a 300 milla-second response time. This means that it will go from 0 to 1600 psi in less then 1/3 of a second.

[/ QUOTE ]That depends on the hydraulic actuator/pump. Some may have a faster response than others.

zmc501 · 04-26-2006, 08:45 AM

How expensive was your Brakesmart?

Pat Dolan · 05-01-2006, 12:17 AM

I have the MasterBrake Elecdraulic actuator (sounds like what you have) with BrakeSmart controller, and the delay is absolutely un-detectable. Not only that, but the proportioning is flawless, and they can be set up for full ABS. I pull at 26k trailer with tripple Dexter 8k torsion axles, and it was the best single mod to my trailer I have ever done.

Pat

kiteflyer · 05-03-2006, 11:10 AM

I do have a MasterBrake Elecdraulic actuator. I was money well spent. I did the up-grade is two steps. I put the BrakeSmart controller on first. I took one trip with trailer with just electric brakes. There was a significant improvement with just the controller. The braking became very smooth. The old controller required full out put to have effective braking. The BrakeSmart ended up being set at 50% and was better braking. The one thing I did when I installed it was to by pass all the factory wiring. I ran new 10 gauge wiring from the batteries to controller and connector. I don’t know how much the helped.

Phase 2 was to put the MasterBrake Elecdraulic actuator and disk brakes on the trailer. After the install the controller was backed down to about 30%.[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/warmsmile.gif[/img]

I agree with you the delay is absolutely un-detectable, the proportion is flawless and was the best single modification I have ever done on my trailer. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

TxBuster · 07-11-2006, 11:05 PM

Hate to bring a post back from way back, but is one system any better than another? I just bought a 30' GN with tandem dual 10K Dexter's with discs. It currently has a vacuum/hydraulic system, but figure the upgrade to electric/hydraulic would be worth the money spent. I am in the process of re-habbing the trailer from the ground up and want to do it all right the first time.

On a side note, how do I tell if I have 10K or 12K axles?

LongRider · 07-11-2006, 11:34 PM

If you want the brakes to perform at their best, leave the vacuum-over-hydraulics intact.

The only advantage of electric-over-hydraulics is the fact that any truck with a plain old dime-a-dozen electric brake controller can pull the trailer.

I won't have anything on my trailers, except vacuum-over-hydraulic; they will stop, and stop quick.

What experience I have had with the electrics is a bad "lag time" from pedal application before the signal gets to the trailer brakes.

With vacuums, you will have to have the proper system on the truck; but, it is WELL worth it.

You will not need a breakaway switch, nor will you need a breakaway battery on the trailer.

I love my vacuum-over-hydraulics; the only thing better is full air.

LongRider · 07-11-2006, 11:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]

the only thing that takes a little time getting used to is the delay while the plunger applies pressure to the hyd system.it may be 2-3 second delay.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the "lag time" I was talking about.

LongRider · 07-11-2006, 11:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]

On a side note, how do I tell if I have 10K or 12K axles?

[/ QUOTE ]

As a general rule, the weight rating that the manufacturer has given the trailer can be divided by the number of axles and this will give you the axle rating.

Look at the plate on the trailer neck and there should be a weight rating.

If it says 20,000, then you have 10K.

If it says 24,000, then you have 12K.

You could also have 8K or 9K.