Ready to Cancel Trip GROSSLY DISAPPOINTED w/ Towing! - Diesel Forum

tginz · 03-05-2005, 08:16 AM

THIS IS MY FIRST TIME TOWING WITH MY 7.3 X. I'M BEGINNING TO THINK MY DAD, THE GM MAN, IS RIGHT - THIS THING MIGHT JUST BE THE POWER-JOKE. I drove about 30 miles yesterday to pick-up new boat. 24 footer, new aluminum trailer about 8,000-lb. GTW. My 7.3 X was warmed after the 30 miles drive as it was about 40 outside. Hooked up to boat, pulled out of yard, and the trailer tracked PERFECTLY on the highway BUT BUT BUT Where is the (*)^*& "power" in these things. I spoke to a guy at the yard with an 02 7.3X pulls a 28' cigerette with a tri-axle trailer over 10K GTW and says the 7.3 X is unbelievable and the best towing machine. Uh, right?

Ok now that I've vented on our beloved PSD - let me explain. I have 67K on my truck and love it like a child. I've had it since new and know it well.

WITHOUT TRAILER - I'm not a hot rod harry and rarely ever break the 2K RPM mark even starting up. Frankly no need. It usually shifts about 1,800-2,000, accelerates just fine for my likely and cruises at 65 all day without effort. Uphills it doesn't need to downshift, it just grunts its way up, never loosing more than 1 mph with the cruise on. Even out west I was so impressed with how it just WENT.

WITH TRAILER - Now with 8K attached, its a P.O.S.! At 60-65, I'd start up small inclines and then I'm down to 55, then 50, then 45, downshift, 3rd with T/C unlocked burning rpms with little speed increase. Now holding up traffic. The EGT's were at 850, tranny at 140 with outside temp 40 after stop and go traffic. THANK YOU BOB RILEY for the Tru-Cool MAX.

Starting on a small incline after stopping for traffic, I ran the rpms up to 2,000 in first, then same in second, got going, then third - 2,000 rpm T/C unlocked, barely held my speed. It was easily 1/2 mile before I hit 40. Now on flat land, it was obviously better but holding 60-65 was a full time job. But Egt's were never under 900. This is simply ridiculuous. I can't tow all the way to Florida (1,500 miles) like this.

SOME OTHER FACTS - 7.3 X, 3.73 rears, no mods or chips, original 01 tranny (yes I know mechanical diode), from my Autotap scanner and laptop (oh, drive with this baby running)- I was running 200-275-lbs of net torque, EBP of 30-lbs.,with T/C locked my computer calculcated slip rate was 1-3 rpms.(not bad)

ANY SUGGESTIONS????

Do I wind this thing up more? Never had to without a load. Isn't the max. torque range at about 1,800 rpm's?

Why won't it hold 60-65 on small inclines turning 1,800 rpms?
Why are my Egt's at 900 on flatland?

Thanks for a help - I'm ready to give on this whole towing thing!!! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/sick.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/sick.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/sick.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/sick.gif[/img]

Completely disappointed and discouraged....tginz

R.J. · 03-05-2005, 08:41 AM

tginz

[ QUOTE ]
EBP of 30-lbs

[/ QUOTE ]

That seems like a lot of back presure in the exhaust system to me. Maybe a bad EPS [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shrug.gif[/img]. Maybe a stuck EBPV [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shrug.gif[/img]

whyzee · 03-05-2005, 08:46 AM

yes these trucks are a DOG without a chip. You need a chip or programmer. If your computer code is PMT2 I have a 78hp tow safe chip that rocks. Towed since new 10klb skidsteer with no drivetrain problems about 200 mi month in northwestren CT, pretty hilly.

If you want to spring for a programmer I just put an EDGE EVO in 3 days ago. The power is SCARY. You cant stay on the gas for more than 7-10 seconds before you are way way over the speed limit and almost scared. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif[/img]

You will LOVE your truck soon, stick with this site [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smokin.gif[/img]

tginz · 03-05-2005, 08:51 AM

RJ

I found a link at to how to the clean the EPV, BUT won't I hear that crazy exhaust hissing ALL the time - you know the one that you get when it is cold and the motor's warming up??? The truck sounds perfectly normal and warmed up when I'm having this lack of power.

thanks tginz

PWRBYIH · 03-05-2005, 09:28 AM

Sound's like somethings wrong, I am towing 11,500 with my 2000 F250 crew cab with the same setup and its a good towing truck. Are the trailer brakes dragging? The auto transmission shifts back and forth between OD and next gear down and I drive rt 84 at 55-60 with the cruise control on with no issues. If you are manually shifting the auto transmission and shifting at 2000 rpm the performance would be sluggish.

IBSTROKIN · 03-05-2005, 09:33 AM

What you describe is the exact same thing I felt when I first pulled with my trucked,about 8000#s.I was very disappointed in my truck,heck my gas Cheby pulled the same load much better than my truck.I was told on here that my symptons were pretty much normal and a chip would take care of that!Since my funds were low at the time,I purchased the SPDiesel box in my sig,and that alone made enough difference in the way my truck pulls.

tginz · 03-05-2005, 09:52 AM

You want to hear disappointing....... I checked the brakes, they are free..... I just hooked the boat to my 96 200K mile Buick Roadmaster GM 350 to move it around my shop yard. With the hitch 1/2" off the ground and front wheels just touching the pavement, [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] I went up the street for fun, boy great power, no problem towing. Turning and stopping could be an issue, though.

Bottom line, I own a $50K truck with no power.

tginz

Pat Dolan · 03-05-2005, 09:54 AM

Tom:

Let me hazard a guess that you haven't towed very much in any truck. While your EBP does sound a bit high, if there was anything really wrong with the truck, you would notice it empty (unless it crept up ever so little at a time).

Adding that little boat more than doubles your weight, and performance is going to take a huge hit. I drag 24 - 26k around with a nearly stock 7.3 (will not be the case after this week), and I can assure you, that while I have some huge problems with the PowerJoke, its ability to drag stuff down the road isn't one of them.

While it is true that some engine mods may make it do its job better, I would guess that trans help is more what you may want (keep in mind, I don't actually HAVE any automatics). I would just take care of the fuel system mods, and drop the exhaust and intake restriction (to lower EGT) and call the engine adequate. However, I would still head off to FL for your vacation first.

Pat

4cstr · 03-05-2005, 10:10 AM

Do you have a boost guage? If you were having EBPV problems...you would have little if any boost. That alone would make the truck run very doggy.

Dave

SmokeyWren · 03-05-2005, 10:17 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Do I wind this thing up more? Never had to without a load. Isn't the max. torque range at about 1,800 rpm's?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, you have to mash on the go pedal.

Max torque is only 1,600 RPM, but when you look at the horsepower curve you'll see you won't have any horses hooked up until you get up to at least 1,900 RPM, and preferably 2,000.

[ QUOTE ]
Why won't it hold 60-65 on small inclines turning 1,800 rpms?

[/ QUOTE ]

Horsepower curve. Kick it up to 2,000 RPM and it will downshift a lot less often. Or spend the money for intake, exhaust and programmer to get the HP up at 1,800 RPM.

I made a long trip last fall "out west" without a chip or programmer. Grossing 16,000 pounds. California, Oregon, Washington, Idaho. But worst was the canyons and ridges of Arizona. No fun - because it downshifted for every little bump in the road. For the 100,000 miles of towing before that, I had intake, exhaust and towing chip. Lots more fun - because it rarely downshifted at 1,800 RPM. Without the chip I had to speed up to about 67 MPH at 1925 RPM to have enough horses to pull the load. But that's too fast for me except when in "flat" country, so as soon as I got home I called Jerry at GOS Racing and bought an Edge Evolution. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/warmsmile.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
Why are my Egt's at 900 on flatland?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds normal when towing. 600 to 900 on the plains - because the plains are not really "flat". Over 1,000 means you're climbing some pretty good grades. Over 1,100 means you've probably downshifted to 3rd and are climbing a very good grade.

Derag2 · 03-05-2005, 10:24 AM

I've pulled 12,000lbs with my truck with 4 inch exhaust and it pulls it fine? To me it sounds like your too scared to get on it..... Don't be scared to lay the wood a little bit you gotta give a diesel the fuel to make the power. I pulled about 7K or so about 4 hours last summer with my truck and it never missed a beat....... 60-70 up hills. I'd say something is wrong with your truck.

At work we have a 2000 F-350 with a 6sp 4.10 and it pulls the 12K load all the time during the summer months and it rarely falls below 60 going up hills. Of course a chip would help but its not needed to pull 8K.

Mike Lewis · 03-05-2005, 10:31 AM

Your truck has a problem somewhere. My '91 could pull that load easily... its normal load is a 10,000 pound horse trailer which is pulled in overdrive at 70-75 mph on the interstate.

Pulling a 6500 pound car trailer loaded with a large car and household gear only slowed me to 50 going up a long 6% grade in California... and then only because of heating issues forcing me to keep my foot out of her.

A 2001 should handle your boat perfectly.

Mike

Mike Lewis · 03-05-2005, 10:32 AM

Yeah, but his truck is way down on power, even in stock form... no sense adding a power adder when there's something more basic wrong with his power output.

444-4D · 03-05-2005, 10:39 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Do I wind this thing up more?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, A lot more. It will pull best in the 2500-3000 RPM range, especially on hills. Your problem will be finding a gear that will allow a correct RPM & MPH.

fordmastertech · 03-05-2005, 10:39 AM

Tom
Just wait until the crap winter fuel we have in CT at this time goes away. I am having the same issues with my X at this time also. I towed with the X when it was stock and it did a good job but with the slight mods I have done it tows great now and flat out fly's when towing, nothing can stop it except the vehicles in front of me.
Congrats on the new boat. I cant wait to see the pics when you unwrap it.

On edit if you want to get together sometime we can hook your trailer and boat to my X and let you see what a slightly modded engine can do when towing. I just have to take the X out of hibernation for the winter to do so and would like to wait for the better fuel.
FMT
[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smokin.gif[/img]