The Diesel Stop banner

Rough running when cold...normal?

3K views 21 replies 7 participants last post by  Ford06 
#1 ·
I'm pretty new to the 6.0's. I picked up an 05' F250 several weeks ago, and drove it to work today for the first time. The temps are down in the high 20's/low 30's. I went out at lunch time and fired it up to go grab a bite to eat. I didn't let it warm up for a few minutes like I usually do. It ran pretty rough and jerky for a few minutes until the thing started to warm up. Is that normal for the 6.0's? It wasn't blowing any smoke, it just ran rough and was a little down on power. After a few minutes everything was back to normal and it was running nice and smooth again.

I'm running 15w-40 Motorcraft oil. Would I be better running a 5w-40 when the temps are like this? Or should I just make it a habit to let it sit for a few minutes and idle to warm up before I try to drive it anywhere?

Just trying to see if that's normal cold behavior for ht r6.0's....or if I have an injector issue or something.

Thanks!
 
#3 ·
I'm planning on changing the oil tonight. Rotella T6 5w-40 and adding 64oz of HSS stiction eliminator. I'll let you know how it works out.
 
#5 ·
Please don't use stiction eliminator. Many of those additives contain higher levels of chlorine, which cause excessive wear on the cam and internal components due to corrosion. Fully synthetic motor oil is the best option, just dont add anything else. If the temperatures are low, use 10w-30 oil designed specifically for diesels. Above 32, use 15w40.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
 
#4 ·
Diesels don't like to be run hard until warm. Keep boost under 10psi until its fully warmed up (150 degrees of ECT or above). I let mine hit 100 degrees of ECT before driving it. The 6.0 uses advanced fuel timing when the egnine's cold. The theory was that there's delay in injector opening due to the cold oil's flow characteristics. This means that when the engine's cold the timing is higher, and higher fuel timing is one thing that contributes to blowing a head gasket.
 
#6 ·
I tend to agree. 5W40 T6 full synthetic is fine year round. Every oil manufacturer says specifically not to use additives in their oil. If I had stiction and was facing injector replacement on a set of injectors with less than 150k miles on them I would try Archoil's product, which carries a money back guarantee to fix stiction. Worst case it doesn't work and you're out no money.

Otherwise, avoid the snake oil.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ArcticDriver
#9 ·
Archoil works! I can attest to that. I used it with Rotella T6. Nothing unusual showed up on my used oil analysis after using it.
 
#12 ·
Well, basic chemistry tells me that if I combine water (H2O) and chlorine (Cl) I invariable end up with HCl and free oxygen. HCl is hydrochloric acid. Free oxygen is also not really your friend because its bouncing around looking for something which with to form an oxide, which rust and corrosion are both oxides of iron and aluminum respectively, from which everything inside an engine is made.

Like nutritional supplements in the US there is nothing that forces additive companies to list ingredients, and they hide behind their "secret" recipes. So does any particular additive contain chlorine? How would anyone know, expect the people selling it to you and if you ask them my guess is the answer will be "no" whether it does or doesn't.

In general additives at best are going to partially mask a real problem. At worst they might cause one.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ArcticDriver
#13 ·
I'm not arguing that chlorine is not good for your motor..........but at this point, nobody has any facts that prove that the three top additives that a ton of people use (Archoil, Rev-x, HSS) have any chlorine in them.

With so many people using those additives.....if there was chlorine in them, or some other chemical that would damage your motor......don't you think it would show up on the Blackstone oil reports that so many people do? I've never once hear or seen an oil report showing that any of those three additives was doing damage to a motor.

Just to come out and say "chlorine is bad for your motor, those additives "might" have chlorine in them, so don't use them".........is a foolish statement, unless someone has some actual facts and data.
 
#16 · (Edited)
Hey these guys were just trying to offer you the advice you came on here asking.
I don't see anything "foolish" in their advice. Various oil additives did contain CP at one time and they are so secretive in their products that it was not unreasonable to provide a warning. Even if oil additives do not contain CP there are still some out there that are crap.

As for any negative effects showing up immediately on a UOA, it would appear that the effects of Chlorinated Parafins (CP) result in accelerated wear over time and not something that would flag an immediate UOA. If you have specific knowledge to the contrary then I always enjoy that type of link in a post since we are all here to learn.

The good news is CPs have not been used in motor oil additives for atleast a decade but I think they are still used in cutting oils.

As for Archoil or any of these additives, I am not in a position to say whether their benefit outweighs their risk; however, it is true that their ingredients are proprietary. Can you describe in depth how the nanotechnology in Archoil works and if nanotechnology is used in CK-4 motor oil? These are questions I have been trying to find answers to without much success.
.
 
#14 ·
Logic tells us that an absence of proof is not a proof of absence. You can't make a valid argument that because no one knows that there's chlorine in those additives means that there isn't chlorine in those additives. As far as the OA reports, I can't remember ever seeing one where anyone was running any kind of additive. Every OA I've seen was done on ether straight conventional or synthetic oil alone.

People do not always equate problems with their causes. Sometimes the purported cause is also wrong. At one point doctors really though ice cream caused polio. People having engine failures would not likely make a connection between an oil additive and the failure.

Again, not saying these additives contain chlorine, or that they cause engine failure. Its just important to examine a situation from all sides. In this case what we have is really just a lot of speculation on both sides, with no actual proof one way or the other about chlorine content or engine damage.
 
#15 ·
Logic tells us that an absence of proof is not a proof of absence. You can't make a valid argument that because no one knows that there's chlorine in those additives means that there isn't chlorine in those additives. As far as the OA reports, I can't remember ever seeing one where anyone was running any kind of additive. Every OA I've seen was done on ether straight conventional or synthetic oil alone.

People do not always equate problems with their causes. Sometimes the purported cause is also wrong. At one point doctors really though ice cream caused polio. People having engine failures would not likely make a connection between an oil additive and the failure.

Again, not saying these additives contain chlorine, or that they cause engine failure. Its just important to examine a situation from all sides. In this case what we have is really just a lot of speculation on both sides, with no actual proof one way or the other about chlorine content or engine damage.
That's exactly my point....if there is no data to prove or disprove it, why was it even brought up?
 
#18 ·
Well, I did my oil change last Wednesday. Fresh Rotella T6 5w-40 with 64oz of HSS Stiction Reducer. I’ve put about 150 miles on the truck since then.
I fired up my truck this morning (was in the high 20’s) and unfortunately my timer died on me so my block heater never turned on like it was supposed to.
Two big things I noticed……the motor cranks over much faster in the cold, and when it idles it is MUCH quieter than before. There isn’t nearly as much clicking/clacking from the injectors. It did however have that 2-3 seconds of chug, chug, chug before it smoothed out to a nice idle……but it’s always done that. Is that normal for a 6.0? I didn’t notice any of the rough running in the morning, but I let it warm up for 10 minutes also……so I didn’t expect any issues.

As far as if the additive is doing anything? Hard to really tell. At this point I’d say no….but I’ve only got 150 miles on it so far. I’ll see if I notice any different at 500.

I think the main different has been made by the 5w-40 synthetic oil. If the additive doesn’t make any changes, I’ll quit using it. I just wanted to see for myself what it would do.
 
  • Like
Reactions: wallis.3521
#19 · (Edited)
The "stiction eliminating" additives are probably not a long term solution to stiction. They definitely do help some folks (maybe even quite a few folks), but then some spool valve problems aren't helped at all by them. It is hit-and-miss. Probably because some spool valve issues are due to condition of the oil and/or "gumming up" , but some have already begun to "scuff".

I use Archoil occasionally. I do not have any stiction issues (never have had) ... even at 200k miles on original injectors. I wanted to see if I could get any fuel economy improvements and I wanted to see the results of the used oil analysis with it. I do oil analysis on every oil change (I have since I bought it new) - basically just as a hobby.

Results from using Archoil - haven't seen any fuel economy improvements. I definitely haven't seen anything of concern in the UOA when I use it.

Your described cold start operation does sound like minor stiction. I agree that 5W40 oil is probably going to help as much as anything.

Remember you can get your money back if the HSS doesn't work. If the stiction bugs you (and it sounds like it is pretty minor), you might try Archoil, but most likely it will require an injector change to completely resolve.
 
#20 ·
I'm with Mark on this one. I've wondered for years about just swapping a quart of oil for a quart of ATF to see if it would clear up stiction. Few things are as detergent as ATF, and if there's build up, varnish, etc. I have to believe if anything would dissolve it ATF would. I think the additives just try to increase lubricity in an effort to get the spool valves to slide more easily. If there's already damage I don't see anything helping that much. Regardless of what those commercials say about various additives once the metal is gone there's nothing that's going to put it back. As far as lubricity synthetic oils alone are amazing in that regard. Try cleaning synthetic oil off something and you'll see what I mean. Its hard to dissolve even with solvents.

As far as safe to use? I imagine Archoil, Rev-X, etc. are safe to use. I've used both those additives in the past without ill effect. Though, as Mark notes, I also noted no benefit either, as I'm already running synthetic oil and have been for almost 100k miles. Cold start improvement is the synthetic oil. If you really want to improve it to the max get your FICM tuned. I've started my truck in sub zero temperatures several times after sitting for days without being plugged in and it always fired right off. 5W40 T6 and an FICM tune seems to be the ticket for great cold starts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bismic
#21 ·
I talked to the Tech at Hot Shot Secret about the Stiction Reducer. I specifically asked him if it was just a lubricate, or if it actually cleaned and removed the deposits that caused the stiction on the injector spools. He told me that the Stiction Reducer had a very strong detergent package in it along with the lubrication enhancers....so it was actually remove the deposits on the injector spools.

All talk? Who knows. I'll know about a put a few thousand miles on the truck I guess. All I can say right now is that after going with the 5w-40 Rotella T6, it starts easier when it's cold out....and it's MUCH quieter when it's idling. So far so good.
 
#22 ·
I can attest that Archoil really works well for reducing stiction. Obviously it won't fix worn injectors, but it can help you get more life out of them. My UAO from Blackstone showed no problems after using it. I have since changed injectors and I am not using it now. Just running T6.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top