Thank you for the info. I see online these places that sell for 100 over invoice and only like 200 for document fee. Im trying to see if any dealer is like that in louisville. We went ro oxmore ford but i sid not really like them. They have the truck we like but the only thing the sales man would say is if qwe were using an a or x plan. I told him i should be able to get close to that with out having to use the plan but then he would only talk in msrp after that. I did not feel like trying to sit down with them. I may try all state ford or try okline first. I dont mind driving to get a good deal. Just depends on how far away. Dont want to loose the saving only to pay for it in travel and time. Thanks for the info.