Looming large "carbon tax" fuel tax increase - Page 3 - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
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post #31 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 03:59 PM
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So what has to happen in order to make the U.S. energy-independent?

More Mass-Transportation but obviously since our populations are not centralized, we have to come up with alternative fuel sources for independent transportation.

There has to be some hard numbers somewhere that say if we add X mass-transporation, mandate Y fuel efficiency etc.....

Why has their not been the creation of a government agency started just for this purpose? It could be called the "Energy Security Agency" or something.

I don't see anything with being "protectionist" when it comes to energy.
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post #32 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 05:43 PM
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How about we call it the "Department of Energy"?

Imagine if we had put even a 10% carbon tax on domestic fuels and a 50% carbon tax on imported fuels in 1979 (the year of the second Arab oil embargo) and gave the DOE the same funding, mandate and respect we gave NASA in the 1960s.

29 years later, we'd be spending about the same money per gallon but we'd have light rail corridors in every freeway median, AMTRAK schedules that work, 50-100 mi/gal cars, less suburban sprawl, residential energy retrofits, most of the thousands of tons of nuclear waste cleaned up, no need for new refinery capacity; wind farms in Nebraska, solar farms in Nevada, tidal generators in Maine and a robust grid delivering electric power where it's needed; and be spending less money on fuel per year.

Instead, we bought into the myth that collective action is inherently bad and let Exxon & Enron make energy policy.

Like the Fram Filter guy used to say, "Pay me now, or pay me later."

Ever since 1979, Jimmy Carter and the Green Party have been warning us that this day would come.
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post #33 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 07:55 PM
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Oil is now up $5.08 to an all time record $134.06 ! And diesel has increased 3x as much as gas since last year.



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post #34 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 08:25 PM
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I'll go you one more

Quote:
Originally Posted by drcampbell View Post
How about we call it the "Department of Energy"?

Imagine if we had put even a 10% carbon tax on domestic fuels and a 50% carbon tax on imported fuels in 1979 (the year of the second Arab oil embargo) and gave the DOE the same funding, mandate and respect we gave NASA in the 1960s.

29 years later, we'd be spending about the same money per gallon but we'd have light rail corridors in every freeway median, AMTRAK schedules that work, 50-100 mi/gal cars, less suburban sprawl, residential energy retrofits, most of the thousands of tons of nuclear waste cleaned up, no need for new refinery capacity; wind farms in Nebraska, solar farms in Nevada, tidal generators in Maine and a robust grid delivering electric power where it's needed; and be spending less money on fuel per year.

Instead, we bought into the myth that collective action is inherently bad and let Exxon & Enron make energy policy.

Like the Fram Filter guy used to say, "Pay me now, or pay me later."

Ever since 1979, Jimmy Carter and the Green Party have been warning us that this day would come.
Sometimes, it sucks to be right.
50% tax would bankrupt many companies. However a stiff tax on imported energy and how about a tax CREDIT on domestic energy and a DOUBLE credit on alternative domestic energy. Yes I know the credits would go to me but it's better here than over there!

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post #35 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-22-2008, 01:06 AM
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Originally Posted by drcampbell View Post
How about we call it the "Department of Energy"?

Imagine if we had put even a 10% carbon tax on domestic fuels and a 50% carbon tax on imported fuels in 1979 (the year of the second Arab oil embargo) and gave the DOE the same funding, mandate and respect we gave NASA in the 1960s.

29 years later, we'd be spending about the same money per gallon but we'd have light rail corridors in every freeway median, AMTRAK schedules that work, 50-100 mi/gal cars, less suburban sprawl, residential energy retrofits, most of the thousands of tons of nuclear waste cleaned up, no need for new refinery capacity; wind farms in Nebraska, solar farms in Nevada, tidal generators in Maine and a robust grid delivering electric power where it's needed; and be spending less money on fuel per year.

Instead, we bought into the myth that collective action is inherently bad and let Exxon & Enron make energy policy.

Like the Fram Filter guy used to say, "Pay me now, or pay me later."

Ever since 1979, Jimmy Carter and the Green Party have been warning us that this day would come.
Sometimes, it sucks to be right.

Understanding economics is not easy.

Even if we paid more for "energy", if the energy was produced here would the country not be "saving" as a whole?

I suppose trade imbalances work if our currency is worth more than everyone elses but that's not the case anymore. It's really turning out to be a perfect storm.

It's definitely negatively impacting the car business. No question about it.

And I totally agree. If the kids at NASA can launch a ship at a comet, Orbit the comet and shoot another little sattelite at it's surface and watch the ensuing carnage, I am sure they are smart enough to look at America's energy situation and say ok, here is what you need to do.

Then after that, we can pay them back by giving them all the money they need to put us on MARS.

I am going to go back to school and finally finish getting my BSME but as we can see, it's not that America lacks intelligence, it's our leaders simply do not have the will-power to what is good for the country as a whole.

Do any candidates, even the ones that are not well known, have any clue about this issue?

Roosevelt did BIIIIIIGGGGGGGG infrasctructure projects to create jobs during the depression, will things have to get that bad before we act and does anyone at this point in time even have the balls or leadership skills to do what he did?
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post #36 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-22-2008, 01:25 AM
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Originally Posted by checkthisout View Post
... Do any candidates, even the ones that are not well known, have any clue about this issue? ...
I daresay I qualify as both "not well known" and "have a clue".

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1986 Isuzu P'up, 177,673.8 miles.
- Hella headlights (highly recommended)
- DOT C-2 back end (also recommended)
- R-12 air conditioner converted to R-406a. Saved ozone and money
- 4.1:1 final drive converted to 3.4:1. Quieter, better mileage but it's a good thing I live in the flat Midwest.
- 9/22/2007, age 21: Still running well when reluctantly sent away for reincarnation, due to body & frame rust.
- Never did get around to converting it to french-fry oil, which is why I originally stumbled upon this site.

Last edited by drcampbell; 05-22-2008 at 01:29 AM.
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post #37 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-22-2008, 04:40 AM
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I daresay I qualify as both "not well known" and "have a clue".

You'll be running against me and I have special powers that can make a Chad hang like no Chad has ever hung before.


No seriously though, this issue could literally destroy the country in a matter of a few years.

What are we going to do about it?
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post #38 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-22-2008, 05:28 AM
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Shoulda, woulda coulda... The country is bankrupt.

This thread looks like Clam bait to me. Just wait till he chimes in. You are all doomed.

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Oil is meant to be burned - used veg, tranny or motor oil - filter it, mix it, burn it all. The government lies to us.

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post #39 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-22-2008, 09:12 AM
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I don't know about destroy?

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You'll be running against me and I have special powers that can make a Chad hang like no Chad has ever hung before.


No seriously though, this issue could literally destroy the country in a matter of a few years.

What are we going to do about it?

But major economic changes in business and peoples lives, I would say it's happening right now.

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post #40 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-22-2008, 09:52 AM
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But major economic changes in business and peoples lives, I would say it's happening right now.
I have been seeing this locally now for months with no end in site. Less people in resturants, parents skipping meals and smaller towns used to having weekend tourists are seeing less business as people dip further into savings like 401K' and IRA's to pay for the increases in food and fuel.
Business owners have less retained profit to put back into the business and give salary increases which are less and not as frequent.
It is snowballing at a rapid rate as the "Ants" save for what the "Grasshoppers" can't foresee.

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post #41 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-27-2008, 09:51 AM
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That was the lightest holiday traffic three day weekend I have driven through since the 70's.

Last edited by 06Clone; 05-30-2008 at 12:26 PM.
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post #42 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-28-2008, 02:08 PM
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Carbon tax ... is that like paying your way out of hell with the Cath church?

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post #43 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-29-2008, 06:34 PM
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Carbon tax ... is that like paying your way out of hell with the Cath church?

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post #44 of 44 (permalink) Old 05-30-2008, 10:45 PM
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That was the lightest holiday traffic three day weekend I have driven through since the 70's.
It's also pretty telling to see all of the docks............ with no boats.............lining the Intercoastal.
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