2015 cab chassis questions - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
'11-16 Ordering Information Discussion of ordering and status of an order of a Super Duty truck. All engine types allowed.

 
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-19-2013, 01:29 PM Thread Starter
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2015 cab chassis questions

Hello everyone well I am not new to the diesel stop, as I've been viewing the forums for years. However, I finally decided to sign up and ask some questions.

I am seriously considering ordering a new f-550 for a tow vehicle. I will be towing a large stock trailer and horse trailer with living quarters. From what I've heard I'll may be able to order soon after the first of the year. My questions are: will the new options such as the engine brake be available? Or is that on the pickups only? Also I would like to get the largest towing capacity possible. What would be the best specs to have? I have heard that they may go over 35k gcvwr this year. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-19-2013, 03:24 PM
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Currently there has been no release of the new specs for the 15 Superduty. I expect to see them posted in a few months though.
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-19-2013, 03:27 PM
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The chassis-cabs have the reduced horsepower/torque ratings. Unless you need to mount a special body on it, your best bet will probably be an F-450 pickup. Ford is supposed to be building the '15 F-450 pickup with upgraded chassis and 19.5 commercial tires. It should also have a higher hp/tq rating than what the CC trucks have. I'd be willing to bet Ford will beat Dodge's 37,000# GCWR.

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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-19-2013, 05:51 PM Thread Starter
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The main reason I am looking at a CC is I want to put a custom hauler bed on, as this vehicle would be strictly a tow rig. However the new F-450 pickup looks pretty enticing after watching some YouTube videos of its debut at the Texas State fair. I just might be inclined to go with the 450 if the gvw numbers are close to the same as the 550. I could probably also get get more bells and whistles with the 450 for less $$$$ vs. 550 after custom bed etc. As the the highest trim on the CC is Lariat. A lot to think about I guess.

Ford blood runs deep through my veins.
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1986 F-150 XLT Lariat ext cab 5.0 Grey
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-20-2013, 02:54 PM
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My guess the highest tow rating will be the 450 pickup probably even more then the 550 chassis cab since Ford engineers sole purpose is the get that number as high as possible on the F450. CC usually don't have printed tow ratings, you have to calculate based on its rate ratings, weight, bed you put on, etc. And as mentioned tuning might be different, although Ford has said the 450 pick up will have custom tuning but they haven't said whether it will be the CC tuning or something different all together. Also you can get features like Nav and back up sensors on the pick up model and not cc models. Then you still have the option of selling your pickup bed and putting on a hauler bed and adapting the sensors/camera to work on it. You'll notice on Western Haulers website they are opting mainly to start with the 450 pickup with 17's and puton the hauler bed even though a CC model is available.

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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-20-2013, 03:26 PM
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With all the changes that Ford announced for the 6.7L engine for 2015, I too, wonder how the cab chassis engines will differ in 2015 from the pick up engines.

For years 2011-2014, the cab chassis version has not fared as well. From the reports of both service technicians as well as owners, the cab chassis version of the existing 6.7L had more turbo replacements than the pick up version. This concerned me, as a current cab chassis owner.

So for 2015, it will be interesting to see if the hardware on the 6.7L will be as different between the PU and the CC as it has been for years 11-14.

Despite the '15 450 PU going back to 19.5's and bigger brakes, it is likely that the frame will remain the same as it currently is... which is the same as a pickup frame. For those that need a heavier duty frame with a higher section modulus (over double that of the pickup), especially with heavier custom hauler bodies that increase the trucks curb weight and induce more stress at the cab to bed junction area of the frame when traversing dissimilar road inclinations between the rear and front tires, I can see where the cab chassis might still be preferred.

Also, the 60" NTEA standard cab to axle distance of the cab chassis, versus the 56" cab to axle distance of the pickup frame, will make a difference in the selection of available hauler and service bodies.

If Ford is listening, it would be nice if Ford did offer all of the Platinum level interior amenities that are available in the pick up as options in the cab chassis. There are a lot of RV haulers seeking the highest GVWR's possible without having to step up, literally, into a true medium duty truck like a 650/750 or Freightliner. These customers would pay extra to tow in the same luxury as the pick up KR and Platinum equivalents. That being said, isn't Navigation already available in the current 550?

Last edited by NYB; 12-20-2013 at 03:28 PM.
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-20-2013, 05:24 PM Thread Starter
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Ford does post the tow ratings for the chassis cab models. I just looked it up on their website. The highest rated 5th wheel towing is 25,500 on the 550 with 4.30 gears. I don't see the chassis cab changing for 2015. But who knows I guess. Yes you can get navigation on the chassis cab. The only thing you can't get that the pickups have is the backup sensors and camera. I've been spoiled by mine on my 2011. I guess if the hp/tq and towing capacities are up-rated on the 450 pickup I'll probably be looking at that and ditching the hauler bed idea. Either way the heaviest trailer I'm pulling is somewhere in the 25k range. Like most rv folks as you mentioned before I want the highest towing with the most creature comforts. If I would have to go to a medium duty (650/750, business class etc.) I might as well just throw a gooseneck hitch on my class 8 peterbilt.
One more thought. If the 450 is up-rated (hp/tq, towing) I can maybe get it for less $$$ then the 550 after the hauler bed etc. 450:~70k? Vs. 550:~60k+ 15-20K for custom bed. Any thoughts?

Ford blood runs deep through my veins.
2011 F-350 Lariat 6.7 cc drw FX4 bronze metallic two-tone adobe
2011 Ford fusion (town car)
2000 F-350 xlt 7.3 cab chassis with flatbed 330,000 plus miles
Previous:
2004 F-350 XLT 6.0 6 spd srw cc long box Arizona beige
2000 F-250 XLT 6.8 V10 auto cc short box green
1999 F-150 XLT sport 4.2 V6 single cab black
1986 F-150 XLT Lariat ext cab 5.0 Grey
1980 F-150 XLT custom single cab 300 6cyl.(best engine Ford ever made) blue

Last edited by bakerranch; 12-20-2013 at 05:31 PM.
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-21-2013, 12:39 AM
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At least you have a realistic idea about what a hauler bed costs, and what it will cost in the future going forward. It will only be more.

More thoughts, since you asked...

While it has been very nice to have some features of my custom bed, such as side box storage access, complete bed utilization, outside "lockers" without having to climb up into the bed, etc, there have also been a few challenges.

It is difficult to find bed accessories "off the shelf". From roll top covers to back flip covers to ladder racks to headache racks to even the mounting system for a B&W hitch, there is no orderable part number that fits. Once you go custom, everything else added must be custom too.

On the other hand, this provides an opportunity to design accessories that work better, work differently, or are better suited for ones' personal needs. And, what you have is not cookie cutter like everyone else's. But, there is a cost to this uniqueness.

The 450 pickup bed, being the same as a 250 and 350 pickup bed, is ubiquitous. Every accessory company out there has designed something for it, because the Ford pickup is the number one selling full size truck. So you can not only find orderable parts, you can even find used accessories on CL or eBay, from 15 years ago, that will still fit the 450 bed.

On the other hand, that's like everyone else. And you have wasted bedwall and wheel well space. And to access storage (when set up for a fiver), you have to climb into the bed to get at the center. But the storage box will be cheaper than the custom boxes of a custom bed.

More thoughts... on fuel range and capacity, balanced with storage space...

With the 550, you can have up to 105 gallons of fuel capacity, with ZERO loss of bed space. To be certain, let's say 90 gallons, because I'm unsure of the status of the company that made the 65 gallon midship tank. But I am sure of the status of one of this web forum's sponsors: Transfer Flow. They make a 50 gallon midship tank for the narrow frame 550 chassis cab, and that, combined with the 40 gallon aft axle tank, adds up to 90 gallons, plus a gallon or two in the fuel rail and filter, of fuel capacity BELOW the datum line.

The "datum line" is a reference line of the chassis in elevation view. Let's call it the top of the frame rail. That's below the bed. No big boxes of fuel in the bed to have almost 100 gallons of range, where you can buy known good water free fuel at a good price, and go as far as you need to go (1,000 mile range at 11 mpg).

You can haul the same amount of fuel in a pick up, but then you can't haul much of anything else, because you lose a huge chunk of storage space that you already didn't have due to the inherent inefficiency of a fleet side pick up bed. The pick ups don't have an aft axle fuel tank. And the midship tank in the pick up holds less than the aft axle tank in the chassis cab.

On the other hand, with the chassis cab, you'll have to find a place to store the spare tire, if you chose to carry one. Yet, it is a lot easer to pick up and roll a tire (say, to or from the back of your trailer, or, in and out of your hauler bed) than it is to hand carry 50 gallons of fuel.

The depreciation hit might be heavier on a hauler bed... or not. The market is narrower, less universally understood, and not quantified by Kelly Blue Book. With a chassis cab, you don't have a complete vehicle until you have it completed, and KBB only estimates values of vehicles completed at the original manufacturer. The F450 pickup is a known and common quantity, completed by Ford. The F550 chassis cab will be completed by a second stage upfitter.

On the other hand, that upfitter could be you! Find another F550 hauler with a dead and gone 6.0 or 6.4 that frustrated it's owner one too many times, and buy the truck not running, for the hauler bed that is on it. Sell of the old chassis you pulled it from for parts, and then have the hauler bed painted to match and mounted to complete your new '15 550, for probably 10K less than having a fresh bed built.

Lot's of different ways to go, but the main thing is to wait and see exactly what differences in engines that the cab chassis will have in 2015. Will there be more alignment between the CC engines and the PU engines? Will the CC engines get updates also, but different updates? Will it take another year of teething pains to manifest any design, performance, implementation, or reliability deficiencies with the updates?

Only time on the road by paying customers, not engineering test tracks, not magazine reviews, and certainly not radiant Ford press releases, will tell.
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-21-2013, 08:41 AM
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I just read on another site that the new hp/tq figures are 425/875 with 32,000# towing capacity. That should figure at least a 40,000# GCWR. The max Dodge rating is 37,000# GCWR.

'19 F-450 King Ranch
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-21-2013, 10:49 AM
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Good info here. Nice to know you can get the nav in cc now. Last I ordered was in 2012 so that what I was using for reference. As long as the Nav there I'm sure there would be an easy way to add in a backup camera. Maybe order a harness the splice in aftermarket can??? And for back up sensors there's plenty of options that would probably be easier to install on a hauler bed then retro fitting factory ones. Actually I think they make license plate frames that have the camera and sensors all mounted up on them.

You might have this already decided but if I was doing a hauler bed I would work with a company that has a ford ship thru number. That way ford delivers the truck directly to them, they put on all the accessories you want, then can ship it to your dealer or you can pick it up. Top 3 I know of are 2L Custom Trucks or Western Hauler in Texas or Classy Chassis back east somewhere. 2L/Western are huge in the horse world (they both raise show as well) and Classy seems to be big into the rv world, but they all build good trucks and have been around for years.


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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-21-2013, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JESSE 1 View Post
I just read on another site that the new hp/tq figures are 425/875 with 32,000# towing capacity. That should figure at least a 40,000# GCWR. The max Dodge rating is 37,000# GCWR.
Was that for the F-450 pickup? Any mention of GVWR?
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-21-2013, 02:18 PM
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I read this on another Ford Truck Enthusiast site.

The new issue of Diesel Power Magazine has a report on the new Super Duties.

These are Diesel Power Magazine estimated numbers so the numbers may change.
These are for the F-450 pickup, no mention of GVWR but if max towing is 32,000# then the GVWR should be at least 40-42000#.

Curb weight: 8700lbs
Max Payload: 6000lbs
Max towing: 32,000lbs
Price: $70,000
425hp @ 2800
875 @ 1600
4:30:1 axle ratio
19.5 wheels, 225/70R19.5 tires
manual control over exhaust brake function
12.25 Dana rear axle

'19 F-450 King Ranch
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-21-2013, 11:29 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JESSE 1 View Post
I just read on another site that the new hp/tq figures are 425/875 with 32,000# towing capacity. That should figure at least a 40,000# GCWR. The max Dodge rating is 37,000# GCWR.
Wow nice
Well if those numbers are right I may have to totally ditch the hauler bed idea. This is an awesome discussion though. I am really glad I decided to ask for some advice, I was pretty set on a F 550 chassis cab, but I'm not so sure now.

Ford blood runs deep through my veins.
2011 F-350 Lariat 6.7 cc drw FX4 bronze metallic two-tone adobe
2011 Ford fusion (town car)
2000 F-350 xlt 7.3 cab chassis with flatbed 330,000 plus miles
Previous:
2004 F-350 XLT 6.0 6 spd srw cc long box Arizona beige
2000 F-250 XLT 6.8 V10 auto cc short box green
1999 F-150 XLT sport 4.2 V6 single cab black
1986 F-150 XLT Lariat ext cab 5.0 Grey
1980 F-150 XLT custom single cab 300 6cyl.(best engine Ford ever made) blue
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-25-2013, 12:41 PM
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And if your mainly towing you could also go with a bed height tool box or tool box/fuel tank combo. I would love to have one on my rig but unfortunately I need to the 8' bed from time to time.

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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 12-25-2013, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sportscraft View Post
..."toolbox/fuel tank combo: I would love to have one on my rig but unfortunately I need to the 8' bed from time to time."
Which speaks directly to the advantage of the chassis cab over the pickup bed. With a low profile service body mounted on a chassis cab, you can have side opening toolboxes, two frame rail mounted large capacity fuel tanks, AND maintain a clear 4x8 open bed simultaneously at all times.

Here's an example:















The is not easy to do with the wide frame (borrowed from the 250/350) F450 fleetside dually pick-up bed, and almost impossible to do while maintaining bed rail clearance for gooseneck and fiver trailers.

The caveats, however, are already pointed out in my earlier post above. There are few off the shelf accessories available.

Last edited by NYB; 12-25-2013 at 01:14 PM. Reason: To add better pictures
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