High pressure oil leak - at my wits end - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
6.0L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain Discussion of the 6.0L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 2003-Up Super Duties and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 6.0L Power Stroke engine.

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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 05:26 PM Thread Starter
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High pressure oil leak - at my wits end

I posted some time ago about doing some PM. I ended up replacing my injectors, the oil cooler, standpipes, dummy plugs and STC fitting. I need to emphasize that the truck was starting and running fine until I started work on it. Now with it back together I get a long crank every time. If it sits for even a few minutes I'm back to a 30 second crank and I can't find the leak.

I just finished taking the valve covers off both sides so I could leak test it through the ICP fittings. Even with my ultrasonic leak detector I can't hear any leaks. So I put the valve covers back on and pulled the turbo to test it through the ICP fitting - same result - can't hear any leaks. I even went so far as to mist a little soap over the STC and the back of the pump but still no joy.

It runs good after it starts but my IPR stays above 30%. It touches 30% once it settles in but even that seems a little high to me for idle - is it? What have I missed? It has to be something I did but I'm damned if I know what it is. Am I making work for myself and worrying about nothing? Should I be driving it - IOW do I just have air in the system? That seems really unlikely to me but I'm at my wits end right now.

2006 F250 6.0 4x4

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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 05:43 PM
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How much driving have you done since the work (number of starts and run time in minutes)? Sometimes it takes 2-3 runs where you actually get onto it a little (acceleration). Say 20 minutes of driving with a few strong (not necessarily WOT) runs after it warms up some.

Mark
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 05:45 PM Thread Starter
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I haven't pulled it out of the shop. I never hooked up the CAC tubes or finished buttoning it up so it hasn't done anything except idle on the spot.

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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 05:57 PM
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While there still might be an issue, IMO you shouldn't be concerned until it has been run more.

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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 06:37 PM Thread Starter
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I'm going to take the night off and start fresh in the morning but so far that's where I'm at too. I left it aired up over noon - probably sat for 2 hours - and when I disconnected the air it blew back at me so it was still holding pressure. I was actually about to rig up a gauge on it to see if it was leaking down but when it blew back as strongly as it did I kind of lost interest in rigging up the gauge.

If anyone has any other suggestions between now and morning I'm open.

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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-12-2019, 09:26 PM Thread Starter
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13 or 14 second crank for the first start today. I finished buttoning it up and took it for a quick drive. It threw a code for #5 injector open so I spent some time tracking that down to a loose connection at the FICM. I should be springing for a new FICM harness but I'm getting tired of spending money so I'll see where that goes. I didn't take it back out after snugging up the connector but ran it briefly watching with Foreskin and I liked the numbers better. IPR is dropping close to 20 at idle now. Googling around tonight I stumbled onto this thread:
https://www.thedieselstop.com/forums...6/#post1769584

It contains this TSB text:
TSB 05-19-14
10/03/05
ISSUE Some 2003-2006 model year vehicles equipped with a 6.0L diesel engine may exhibit a crank time longer than 2.5 seconds in ambient temperatures above 32°F (0°C) and/or during hot restarts, or may exhibit a runs rough condition with no diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs). These conditions may be noticed at factory delivery or after a repair involving removal of high-pressure oil system components. This may be caused by air trapped in the high-pressure oil system.
ACTION To purge the air drive the vehicle through at least 12 short, high-demand cycles, or until crank-time has improved (Example: 12 aggressive accelerations 25 MPH to 50 MPH (32 Km/h to 80 Km/h)). Turn off the engine for 5 minutes following the drive cycle, then restart the engine. If crank time remains above 2.5 seconds, perform normal hard start diagnostics per the PC/ED manual.
NOTE A THREE TO FIVE (3-5) SECOND CRANK TIME MAY BE CONSIDERED NORMAL IN COLDER TEMPERATURES.
NOTE IF THIS PROCEDURE IS NOT FOLLOWED, IT MAY TAKE MORE THAN 100 MILES OF NORMAL DRIVING TO REMOVE ALL OF THE TRAPPED AIR.

So tomorrow I'll take it for a hard run. I got in a couple of hard accelerations today but only for a few hundred yards. Tomorrow I'll push it harder and longer and I'll leave Forescan running to see what pressure I'm getting up to. Feeling a little more optimistic tonight.

2006 F250 6.0 4x4

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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 08:32 AM
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13 or 14 second crank for the first start today. I finished buttoning it up and took it for a quick drive. It threw a code for #5 injector open so I spent some time tracking that down to a loose connection at the FICM. I should be springing for a new FICM harness but I'm getting tired of spending money so I'll see where that goes. I didn't take it back out after snugging up the connector but ran it briefly watching with Foreskin and I liked the numbers better. IPR is dropping close to 20 at idle now. Googling around tonight I stumbled onto this thread:
https://www.thedieselstop.com/forums...6/#post1769584

It contains this TSB text:
TSB 05-19-14
10/03/05
ISSUE Some 2003-2006 model year vehicles equipped with a 6.0L diesel engine may exhibit a crank time longer than 2.5 seconds in ambient temperatures above 32°F (0°C) and/or during hot restarts, or may exhibit a runs rough condition with no diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs). These conditions may be noticed at factory delivery or after a repair involving removal of high-pressure oil system components. This may be caused by air trapped in the high-pressure oil system.
ACTION To purge the air drive the vehicle through at least 12 short, high-demand cycles, or until crank-time has improved (Example: 12 aggressive accelerations 25 MPH to 50 MPH (32 Km/h to 80 Km/h)). Turn off the engine for 5 minutes following the drive cycle, then restart the engine. If crank time remains above 2.5 seconds, perform normal hard start diagnostics per the PC/ED manual.
NOTE A THREE TO FIVE (3-5) SECOND CRANK TIME MAY BE CONSIDERED NORMAL IN COLDER TEMPERATURES.
NOTE IF THIS PROCEDURE IS NOT FOLLOWED, IT MAY TAKE MORE THAN 100 MILES OF NORMAL DRIVING TO REMOVE ALL OF THE TRAPPED AIR.

So tomorrow I'll take it for a hard run. I got in a couple of hard accelerations today but only for a few hundred yards. Tomorrow I'll push it harder and longer and I'll leave Forescan running to see what pressure I'm getting up to. Feeling a little more optimistic tonight.


LOL - I guess you had to see it in official Ford writing.

As I posted ............. I was optimistic a few days ago. That said, when you do work, you can always pinch an o-ring ....

Mark
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 12:52 PM Thread Starter
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[/B]

LOL - I guess you had to see it in official Ford writing.

As I posted ............. I was optimistic a few days ago. That said, when you do work, you can always pinch an o-ring ....

I wasn't slagging your advice. In fact if you recall you were less than certain yourself. And I'm still not convinced its right. I'm getting shorter cranks but it sure doesn't light up immediately like it used to do.


I gave in this morning and ordered a FICM harness so my shop will be tied up for a few more days. There's a local oldster who wants to get his Kubota side by side on my lift but I've told him he has to wait until I'm done buggering around with my 4WD grenade. I just can't abide knowing that something isn't right and the FICM harness is clearly on its way out. This morning the miss was back - I could probably McGyver something to make it work but I'm not going to. Chinese harness $40; Ford harness $300. Going with Ford.

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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 08:46 PM
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I wasn't slagging your advice. In fact if you recall you were less than certain yourself. And I'm still not convinced its right. I'm getting shorter cranks but it sure doesn't light up immediately like it used to do.


I gave in this morning and ordered a FICM harness so my shop will be tied up for a few more days. There's a local oldster who wants to get his Kubota side by side on my lift but I've told him he has to wait until I'm done buggering around with my 4WD grenade. I just can't abide knowing that something isn't right and the FICM harness is clearly on its way out. This morning the miss was back - I could probably McGyver something to make it work but I'm not going to. Chinese harness $40; Ford harness $300. Going with Ford.
Over the internet, I have found you can't be 100% sure about anything, especially when repairs have just been made. I think it is DieselTechRon that stated he has never seen an oil rail nipple cup o-ring failure that wasn't self induced. While I don't go that far, it is certain that repair work can sometimes go wrong. Happens to everyone from time-to-time.

My statement "While there still might be an issue, IMO you shouldn't be concerned until it has been run more" simply reflects the fact that absolute certainty usually comes ONLY with hands-on testing. I simply didn't see an acknowledgement of my post recommending run time and hard accelerations and it looked like the thread you stumbled on was a new perspective to you. It seemed consistent w/ my post except I didn't think it would take 12 runs (and still don't) as long as you get some decent accelerations that develop some high ICP pressures.

I do wish you well with it and would expect you to "have it licked" w/ what you are planning to do.

Mark
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 09:06 PM Thread Starter
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I do wish you well with it and would expect you to "have it licked" w/ what you are planning to do.

I hope you're right.


As to your other comments, like you said, its the internet. You don't know me and I don't know you. But I do know Ford. Thanks for your interest - Bill Ford isn't likely to help me out.

2006 F250 6.0 4x4
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 10:11 PM
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You should always do a little research on who you get advice from before you spend money - it is easy to do. Advice to try something that is free is usually worth trying.

best of luck.

Mark
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If it has never left the shop and been at run at higher throttle and higher load pulling the truck down the road you could have in the oil rails. I have had several I had oil rails off of for head gaskets or just injectors or stand pipes. When I put them together I found other repairs needed and the truck was not put together and driven so they had long crank, high idle IPR %, etc. Once I finished the truck and did test drive 5 miles and ran it hard it had no issues. Dozens of thousands of miles later no hot start complaints. There is not an air bleed for those cyl head oil rails at their high points. The air is compressible and the HPOP volume is not great. It takes the HPOP a bit of turning to build start pressure before it fires off. Once running the air is fighting pressure retention and it makes the IPR valve duty cycle high. Once you run it hard and the volume in oil rails is higher it will push the air out and all those bad things and bad numbers should resolve themselves. That you have air tested it you've done two things: you see that it has no leaks and you put more air in the system and made the problem persist with little improvement when it may have gotten better.

You may have a problem but I really think from what you've posted that you have not gotten the air out and your problem is not a problem.

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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-14-2019, 04:34 PM Thread Starter
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I really think from what you've posted that you have not gotten the air out and your problem is not a problem.

I think you and the previous poster are correct. I'm inclined to worry and this is the first 6.0 where I've worked on the oil rail so I was doing what I do best, worrying. Apparently I was concerned about nothing. I just got done changing the FICM harness and it lit right up afterwards. Have to put the CAC tubes and airbox back on before I can do another test run but I'm confident its fixed. Thank you both for the encouragement.



Next project will be a different forum - I found a 2008 Lariat with coolant in the cylinders. Its in pretty sweet condition, other than the obvious mechanical flaw. The guy pretty well gave it to me but I haven't been able to go get it until I got my 6.0 back on the road. Road trip!

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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-19-2019, 08:18 AM Thread Starter
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It always bugs me when threads like this don't come to a conclusion so here's the rest of the story. We took the truck on a 2 hour run yesterday and it performed flawlessly. The starts are back to "normal". No leaks that I can see - the bottom of the bell housing has been wet as long as I've owned the truck but it never seems to drip on the shop floor - that's unchanged. I've got the front driver side hub off right now because the u-joint has been marginal for a while and I anticipate using 4WD to get my broken spark and fume truck out of a snow bank this weekend. Thanks to all those who helped.

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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 03-19-2019, 09:15 AM
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Glad it is running well and the thread update is a big help to others. I have had the "hanging drop" for 211k miles and 16 years. Never has gotten worse fortunately.
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