ICP Issue? IPR Issue? Other? Need help troublshooting. - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
6.0L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain Discussion of the 6.0L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 2003-Up Super Duties and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 6.0L Power Stroke engine.

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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 07-29-2019, 12:21 PM Thread Starter
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Question ICP Issue? IPR Issue? Other? Need help troublshooting.

I recently towed my camper up to the Great Lakes with the family (15hr road trip). No issues with the truck at all, ran like a top. A few days before we were getting ready to head back home I was driving the truck around town, and when I let off the gas and came to a stock light I noticed that the truck seemed to want to idle a little higher than it should....I took off from the light, and when I slowed down for the next light.....the truck started to idle super rough...chug, chug, chug, chug. It reminded me of when I had a wiring issue with my ICP sensor several years ago.



I didn't have my monitor going at the time, but when I got back to the camp site I scanned the truck....no codes. I drove the truck around for several more days....no issues, everything way fine. Very odd.



So we hooked up the camper and started to head home last weekend...while driving through town, I slowed down to make a turn....and I get the rough chug, chug, chug idle again...crap! My Torque PRO app showed the IPR rate jumping around 25-35% .....usually at idle it holds steady at 22.8%.



So I get back on the gas.....the motor smooths out, and runs great. 14 hours...all the way home....900 miles, several stops, not a single issue. Made it home with no issues.



So after I got home I checked the ICP sensor, it looked fine...no oil in the connector. The pigtail looked fine...no issues. As the truck was idling, I wiggled the wiring around...tapped on the sensor...nothing. Everything is fine. The ICP sensor is only about a year old.



Could this be a problem with the IPR?? Could it be getting "Sticky" at lower oil pressures required for idling? I hate issues like this that come and go....very hard to trouble shoot.



Where do I start?

2005 F250 6.0 PSD, ARP Studs, Felpro HG's, EGR Delete, IPR Coolant Filter, Bilstein 5100s, Blue Spring Mod, IDP Custom Tunes
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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 07-30-2019, 11:35 AM
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The interesting thing is that you noticed the engine idle was a little higher at idle and the IPR values were higher as well. You did not provide the actual ICP pressure reading. To me, based on your symptoms and the high idle I bet your ICP sensor is in fact failing. When one does this it is what we call "biased" and yes, it can happen intermittently. If you notice that the concern does not return after disconnecting and the reconnecting the sensor then a poor connection is suspect.


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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 07-30-2019, 12:51 PM Thread Starter
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The interesting thing is that you noticed the engine idle was a little higher at idle and the IPR values were higher as well. You did not provide the actual ICP pressure reading. To me, based on your symptoms and the high idle I bet your ICP sensor is in fact failing. When one does this it is what we call "biased" and yes, it can happen intermittently. If you notice that the concern does not return after disconnecting and the reconnecting the sensor then a poor connection is suspect.

Unfortunately, it happened so fast that I wasn't able to see the HPOP (ICP) pressure readings.....I just noticed the IPR % Rate jumping around..higher than normal. It did the fast idle thing the first time I came to a stop, and then did the rough idle thing the next two times it acted up.



So far, it's been 3 days and 900+ miles without a single hiccup. Maybe I will just replace the ICP sensor for the hell of it.....worst case, I have a spare if I never need one.



Without it trowing a code, or consistently acting up...it's going to be hard to troubleshoot the issue.



Is it unheard of for a new-ish (1yr old) oem ICP sensor to start acting up?

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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-03-2019, 09:24 PM Thread Starter
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Well....the truck has been running fine, until today. I was driving along, and let off the gas as I was coming over a hill on the way to to my house. I was going around 35mph....with the windows down so I could here the motor pretty well. All of a sudden when I had my foot off of the gas pedal, it was like I quickly tapped the throttle with my foot, just a quick little rev......all on it's own. Very odd........

At this point...should I just go a spend $125 on a new ICP sensor and swap it out? It's such a random issue, I have no way of really tracking it down, or troubleshooting it.

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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-04-2019, 06:23 AM
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Get a new ICP Sensor. Like you said, if it isn't the root cause of your problem, at least you'll have a spare. It's such an easy fix if it's the problem so why not take a chance.
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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 12:27 PM Thread Starter
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Get a new ICP Sensor. Like you said, if it isn't the root cause of your problem, at least you'll have a spare. It's such an easy fix if it's the problem so why not take a chance.

Thanks, I'm thinking the same thing. At least I will know that's one less thing that could be causing the problem.

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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 12:53 PM Thread Starter
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Get a new ICP Sensor. Like you said, if it isn't the root cause of your problem, at least you'll have a spare. It's such an easy fix if it's the problem so why not take a chance.

Thanks, I'm thinking the same thing. At least I will know that's one less thing that could be causing the problem.

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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 12:21 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dillon134 View Post
Get a new ICP Sensor. Like you said, if it isn't the root cause of your problem, at least you'll have a spare. It's such an easy fix if it's the problem so why not take a chance.



**UPDATE**



Well, I put in a new ICP sensor just for the heck of it. It's been a few weeks, and several hundred miles....and more more random "funky idle for a couple of seconds" type issues.......until today.



So, same as before.....I'm on the highway driving along. I let off the gas as I get off at the exit and start slowing down. And the motor does that "chug,chug,chug" type idle for 2-3 seconds.......and then it goes away and idles smoothly. It happened to fast, I couldn't catch any of the readings on the HPOP, ICP, IPR off of my Torque PRO app. Scanned the truck again with both Torque pro and Forscan...nothing. All it good.



It's frustrating tracking down stuff like this. I wish it would happen all the time, or do it when I'm at home and can spend some time looking at all the PID's.....but it only goes it when I'm out on the road, and just for a couple of seconds . Very odd.

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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 04:56 PM
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It sounds to me like a wiring connection and my rule for 12V troubleshooting is "Its always the ground" so that's where I'd start. On a ~15 year old truck its not hard to imagine a few bad ground connections or maybe even entire missing straps.

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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 07:37 AM Thread Starter
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Exclamation

Well, the problem happened again today on the way home from work. And it did for a pretty long period of time, so I was able to get some numbers on the PID's and more info.

So as I was driving around 55mph, the truck felt like someone had just quickly pressed the gas pedal for a spit second...just a quick jerk. It did it a few more times after that. The Throttle Position PID reading stayed steady when this happened, right around 20%. So the ECU wasn't sensing that I was calling for more throttle.

Then after a few miles, I let off the gas to make a turn....and I noticed that as I let off the gas the injectors sounded a little funny, and the truck wanted to idle fast. It held the idle at around 920rpms (usually it's around 650), my IPR rate was at 34.0% (usually it's at 22.8 during idle), and my HPOP pressure was 640psi (usually it's around 580 at idle). FICM voltage was 49.0, and battery voltage was around 14.2v. Even after getting on the gas several times, every time I let off.....it would fast idle. But, the idle was smooth...not rough an erratic. Just a higher than normal idle. Could the IPR be sticking? Not sure why that would explain the weird injector sound though while I was off the gas and coasting.

I drove for a mile or so, and the truck just felt weird. Every time I would let off the gas and coast the injectors would sound weird (like every other one was off or something), and it would idle fast. When I would get on the gas, everything would sound normal......but it just felt odd.

Jut as I pulled in the driveway thinking I could finally do some troubleshooting......I feel the idle drop back down to normal, and everything is fine. I couldn't get it to duplicate it no matter what I tried. Like before, I scanned the ECU...no error codes. I ran through all of the PCM, and Injector Click tests that I could run with Forscan, and they all showed good. I could hear each of the 8 injectors click like they should, nothing sounded odd.



After the idle went back to normal, I climbed up on the truck and pressed around on the FICM connectors, every section of wiring loom I could find, and every socket and electrical connectors and sensor I could find....nothing. No blip in the idle, no increase or decrease in idle speed....nothing.


With this new info, any ideas??? Would a bad ground cause this higher than normal idle issue?? Could this be a sticking IPR? That might explain the high idle, but it wouldn't explain the strange injector sound. Failing FICM?

Thanks so much for the help guys!!

2005 F250 6.0 PSD, ARP Studs, Felpro HG's, EGR Delete, IPR Coolant Filter, Bilstein 5100s, Blue Spring Mod, IDP Custom Tunes

Last edited by iqraceworks; 08-24-2019 at 07:40 AM.
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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 09:47 AM
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If IPR were to stick close the injection knock gets LOUD and it runs rough. The values and idle speed sound like default for no ICP sensor input but that should give DTC for ICP sensor. You aren't getting that code from what I gather from the thread. So at this point I would monitor the 5V reference you will find at ICP sensor. Use a T pin if you don't have a pointed DVOM probe and insert it next to the wire down into back of connector. You don't puncture the wire, you push the pointed tip through the rubber connector body seal and it makes contact with the metal terminal. I can't recite the wire color but probe until you find the one that is 4.95-5.05 volts. Run a long wire, it can be tiny gauge speaker wire for this purpose, and attach to the DVOM and read that voltage if it begins to act up. If it is more than .3V below the 5V spec then it will mess up the output signal. If it is higher that offsets the signal too. Other sensors share the 5V source in the PCM and you can find it when it is acting up by un plugging the other sensors. The exhaust back pressure sensor has done that for me a couple of times and did not set a DTC. Someone may chime in with the sensor groups so you don't fool with ones that could not affect the Vref for the ICP. I have not had a bad pedal sensor on a 6.0 yet but if it acts up you should look at aceel pedal PIDs. Again, I would think any disagreement between the redundant accel pedal sensor inputs should set a DTC readily.

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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 10:44 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the tips on what wires to check. The problem I'm running into is that when it happens.....it only happens for a short amount of time, and then goes back to running like normal. I haven't been able to make it home yet while it's still acting up. I would love it if the problem happened long enough so that I could actually make it home and get my multimeter put and start checking stuff.

I just got back from a 45min drive this morning.....didn't skip a beat, not a single hickup.

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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 01:56 PM
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Have you scanned for DTCs again?

2015 F350 Platinum Max Tow What a beast with the 4.30 gears!
2006 F450 CC Hauler bed 4x2 6.0 L 6.0 auto, Lariat, 4.30 r/a, SCT, 4in exh. 103K New heads to repair diesel in coolant, 148K.
2006 F350 Lariat CC Dually 4X2, 6.0 auto 4.10 LS, SCT, airbags, 4 in. exh. 154K Rebuilt engine to repair damage from burned piston. One head to fix fuel in oil problem.
36 feet on the floor Elite/Outlaw LQ horse trailer.
35+5 foot double tandem axle flatbed trailer.
36 foot double tandem axle flatbed trailer
36 foot Platinum 6 horse LQ, side load, full width back tack
2003 EB Expedition 171K (no engine repairs, gas burners are the new longevity leaders)
2004 Volvo V70R AWD-high miler in fleet, 253K (no engine repairs) Hail totaled it but I kept it. Looks like a golf ball now.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 05:05 PM Thread Starter
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Yep....no codes.

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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 07:01 AM Thread Starter
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Seems like it's doing it more frequent now. On the way to work this morning...pulled into the gas station, let off the throttle as I'm slowing down......and the motor reved up a little bit on it's own....like I mashed the gas just for a split second. Startled me a little bit. Then it acted fine again. When I was leaving the gas station a few minutes later, I let off the gas and get the rough idle thing.....and also a high idle. I get on the highway, and then everything acts fine, all the way to work.

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