Long Crank Cold - Park with engine downhill? - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
6.0L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain Discussion of the 6.0L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 2003-Up Super Duties and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 6.0L Power Stroke engine.

 
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 09:26 AM Thread Starter
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Long Crank Cold - Park with engine downhill?

I'm trying to remember the tip for testing the oil level at the ICP sensor when checking for leaking dummy plugs. I can't find the post that I had read a few years ago but seem to recall that it was recommended to park the truck/vehicle on a hill, with the engine pointed downhill. I'm hoping someone can explain the logic with this test. I'm assuming that we are trying to leverage gravity to see if the dummy plug o-ring (passenger side) is the root cause of the leak and consequent long Crank Cold.

My question is that, why would you want to park it facing downhill? Wouldn't this skew the test because the oil would naturally want to flow downhill, towards the ICP sensor port?

I had a no-start hot issue that I just resolved by installing the updated STC Fitting. Now I'm on to resolving my long Crank Cold issue and don't want to take off the valve covers if I don't need to. Probably going to have to do it anyway s but figured I'd ask for some clarification here first.

Thanks.
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 05:27 PM
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How long is long? Mine always fires in a couple seconds when parked nose up. Can be 5-10 seconds parked down hill. Curious on the physics of this as well.
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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 07:44 PM
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Did you install the yellow o-ring under the HPOP when you re-installed it? Could you have pinched it?

Usually a normal nose-down start, and an extended start or even a no-start w/ nose-up, is due to the oil in the oil rail not draining out w/ the nose-down, but does w/ nose-up. It is most often seen when the HPOP fails (allows reverse flow), when the ball bearing falls out of an early HPOP, or when the lower HPOP o-ring fails.

I suppose t is possible that it could also be the dummy plugs leaking down.

Mark
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Last edited by bismic; 08-28-2019 at 07:45 AM.
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-28-2019, 07:30 AM Thread Starter
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I had two problems with my truck. 1) a no-start hot which I resolved with the new STC Fitting. 2) a long crank cold (5+ seconds to build 500+ ICP)

I was very careful with the the re-install of the HPOP. The long crank issue existed before I replaced the STC Fitting so I know that didn't cause it.

I'm thinking it's the dummy plugs or stand pipes. It's an easy job so I might as well just do it. I was just trying to understand the theory behind parking the truck with the nose pointing downhill and I know it involves the oil rail. Assume if the dummy plugs have a bad o-ring, the oil will drain out of the oil rail. That is why they tell you to pull the ICP Sensor first thing in the morning (before cranking) to see if there is any oil visible. If you see oil, then you can assume that the dummy plug on the passenger side is good. If not, that is likely the problem. I try to find a source for the parking downhill theory and post it here for reference.
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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-28-2019, 07:58 AM
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So you have or haven't checked your ICP sensor .... ?

Mark
06 F250 CC SB FX4 Lariat;ARP studs;OEM gaskets;Banks exhaust;DynaTrac Ball joints;Coolant filter;High-Idle mod;RACCCV6000;JimmiJammers;Ravelco;SynchroMax xfer case;Fumoto valve;Harpooned;CPOhighwayProducts toolbox;tracrac;Fox Weatherboots;Wet Okole Seat Covers;BriteBox;Re-flashed;Quadzilla Recon XZT Fuel Press;Blue FPR spring;DashDAQ;PHP FICM;RiffRaff boots;DCPower270A XP;PowerInverter;Rancho7000's;BPD EGR cooler;One-piece HPOP fitting;D-plugs&standpipes;BPD Billet WaterPump;SCT w/ Matts SRL+;ELC Ultra;DuraTracs
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-28-2019, 01:21 PM
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Here is the DTR video on extended crank when cold. He references checking the oil rail level at the ICP sensor.



As I posted earlier (for anyone else that might read this), there can be other reasons that cause the oil rail to bleed down.

Note that a FICM issue can be the cause of an extended crank when cold (or hot).

Mark
06 F250 CC SB FX4 Lariat;ARP studs;OEM gaskets;Banks exhaust;DynaTrac Ball joints;Coolant filter;High-Idle mod;RACCCV6000;JimmiJammers;Ravelco;SynchroMax xfer case;Fumoto valve;Harpooned;CPOhighwayProducts toolbox;tracrac;Fox Weatherboots;Wet Okole Seat Covers;BriteBox;Re-flashed;Quadzilla Recon XZT Fuel Press;Blue FPR spring;DashDAQ;PHP FICM;RiffRaff boots;DCPower270A XP;PowerInverter;Rancho7000's;BPD EGR cooler;One-piece HPOP fitting;D-plugs&standpipes;BPD Billet WaterPump;SCT w/ Matts SRL+;ELC Ultra;DuraTracs

Last edited by bismic; 08-28-2019 at 01:24 PM.
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 08-28-2019, 05:14 PM Thread Starter
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I checked it last winter (when the long crank cold first began) and the oil level was "up", meaning it was visible at the ICP Sensor location.

Maybe you are right, it could be my FICM. I just want to get it figured out before this winter.
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-01-2019, 04:54 PM Thread Starter
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Took off the passenger valve cover and the dummy plug and this is what I found. One side of the O-ring looked fine and as I spun it around, it was disintegrated, almost. Suspect this is the cause of my long crank cold.

Incidentally, I somehow lost the rubber gasket that goes between the valve cover and the oil rail. It's one that covers/seals the ICP Sensor hole. Don't think it fell into the cavity below where injectors and valves are but have ordered an inspection camera just to see. Don't want to have to take off the oil rail again. The bottom two bolts rear bolts are a PITA. Finally got them out with a stubby torx 30 and a small ratchet. Not fun.

Does anyone know the part number for the rubber seal that I mentioned?
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-01-2019, 05:27 PM Thread Starter
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Here is the dummy plug o-ring
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-01-2019, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
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Can someone tell me where the oil drain back holes are in the head? Is a big enough hole for the 2" diameter rubber ICP valve cover gasket to fall through?
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post #11 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-01-2019, 05:40 PM Thread Starter
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This is the gasket I'm talking about...
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post #12 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-03-2019, 10:13 AM Thread Starter
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To close the loop on this thread, I found the ICP rubber seal on the cross member under the motor. I put everything back together, new dummy plug and standpipe, and it's running fine.

The bottom line for me is, if someone has both a no-start hot and a long crank cold situation, it's likely not the same problem. The no-start hot, assuming you have the newer square HPOP, is most likely the STC Fitting. The long crank cold is likely a bad o-ring on the dummy plug(s). I replaced the standpipe since the kit included the upgraded one, but it was fine. No o-ring issues.

Now I've got to do the driver's side, which is easier, in my opinion, than the passenger side.

I'm curious to see what the dummy plug looks like on that side.

Take care guys and drive safe.
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