13 row to 26 row trans cooler - not impressed - Page 3 - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
'99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain Discussion of the '99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 1999-Up Super Duty trucks and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 7.3L Power Stroke engine.

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post #31 of 67 (permalink) Old 04-20-2014, 05:40 PM
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NYB,has my vote locked in for The Diesel Stop Affirmation Advocate.Good stuff people pay $125/ hr.for that!
So I was thinking about throwing one of those 6.0 coolers on my truck for when I plow but with the air not moving across the cooler like if I was blasting down the road be better to a smaller coil with a fan like that Mitsimoto?
NYB you know you are my bud.
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post #32 of 67 (permalink) Old 04-21-2014, 05:20 AM
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Gooday NYB, I have finally got my daughter to resize the photos. I have many more, if you would like to view them, PM me your email and i will send them.
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03 F250 4x4 CC 7.3ltr 4R100HD rebuilt, 160,000 Klms
GTP38R , Turbo-master , IH Bellowed up pipes, RiffRaff CAC boot kit, AIH delete, .
4" Turbo back exhaust ,Banks power elbow, LPG (Gas over diesel) DP F6 tuner, 40hp tow, 60hp tow, 80hp tow, 60hp, 80hp, 120hp race, Decel, 1200 RPM.
RiffRaff 6637 intake ,pre filter, Snorkle
Custom made trans cooler with twin thermo fans ,water to oil cooler
Scangauge 11,AutoMeter Trans temp, pyro ,Water/Oil temp, Fuel Pressure, Boost.
Longrange 120 ltr fuel tank and transfer pump, 15,000 lb winch, Warn winch bar, Lightforce HID spot lights, HID headlights, Black Widow Drawer System, Snugtop Canopy with gull windows, Fr & Rr ARB Diff locks, Hornblaster Train horns, Post fuel pump filter, RiffRaff FRx and HPx , Bilsteins x4, Onboard compressor , Air tank and water traps, Billet door handles, Alpine headset, Alpine overhead DVD player, Rockford Fosgate sub, Alpine amp and CD changer.
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post #33 of 67 (permalink) Old 04-22-2014, 07:37 PM
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Thanks for the poker game NYB .
Mate
Googs. Dude. I should have known better than to brag about my 8 inches, cause there is always another man who's got bigger. Even then, 10" maybe. But 12"???? Like they say, look out for the thunda down unda.

Thank you for the bigger pictures also. Your set up is mind blowing. Looks like all custom welded heat exchangers?

Is that the Ford OEM Transfer Case shield (FOTZ- 7E063-A) you used to mount and protect the Oil to Water cooler? Do you have a transfer case also, or do you have twin transfer case shields mounted in series, one protecting your transfer case and one protecting and holding the cooler?

Heck yes I'm PM'ing you for more pictures. I want to fully appreciate all the work that you did putting that all together. There is no question you won this hand of poker, but I'm going to lay all my cards out on the table to the lesser hand I had to fold with my pics below, since you so kindly obliged my request for larger pics.




The difference between the 7.3L auto trans cooler, and the V10 auto trans cooler. Photo taken in year 2000, long before this became a "mod" popularized on the forums. Yes, even before Brian at BTS did it. And long before the 6.0L coolers came out. But I still lost this hand. Oil to Water is definitely a more efficient way to remove heat, and while I did add the OEM OTW cooler (by installing a new radiator) with this upgrade, the total surface area of the OEM OTW in tank cooler is much smaller than the custom OTW cooler shown by Googs in his pics above this post.





Twin 8" PermaCool electric fans (specific parts utilized in upper left hand pic) being assembled on their own tubular support structure (rather than ziptied to the heat exchanger), with baffles and shroud constructed from sheet aluminum and durable rubber cut from mudflaps (specific parts utilized in upper right hand pic).






Installation close ups of the twin electric fans inside the rad support. In addition to a solid baffle over the top of the OTA trans cooler and fans (see middle column of pics, top and bottom), there is a "flow through" screen strategically positioned underneath the trans cooler bridging the gap between the cooler and the cross rail of the rad support, on either side of the power steering cooler (removed and not shown in these pics, but you know where it goes in the center), intended to provide at least as much resistance to air flow as the stacked plates of the heat exchanger fields of both the power steering cooler and the transmission cooler.

(See the middle row, center pic for the fans as mounted without the screen air diffuser, then see the adjacent left hand column middle pic for the diffusers as installed. The diffusers add resistance, but not entire blockage, to bypass air flow through the gap under the OTA transmission cooler).

The diffuser screen, made up of two layers of hard wire cloth (attic soffit vent screens from the hardware store) sandwiching a finer solar screen cloth, (source material shown in the upper left hand pic) is installed to discourage air from bypassing either the OTA trans or power steering cooler.

Cooling air pulled through by the engine fan or the electric fans, or both. At the same time it can be pushed through by frontal air pressure from moving forward, especially as directed by the lower twin scoops (shown in a separate pic at the end of this post). No matter what the source of the air is, the flow of the air AROUND the coolers is metered to a resistance greater than or equal to through the coolers, so that air is encouraged to flow through the coolers rather than anywhere else.





In this single photo above (single because it is recently taken, some 13 or 14 years after installation, whereas the other grouped photos posted above are rephotographed from old film prints layed out in a matrix), the solid aluminum top baffle is shown as riveted to the aluminum support tube that holds the fans in place close coupled to the transmission cooler.

That solid top surface is intended to do a couple of things...

1. The top aluminum shroud maintains a totally independent cooling air passage to the intercooler (seen in the photo) above the baffle, such that no heat rejected from the transmission cooler is introduced to the cooling air of the charge air cooler. I wanted maximum temperature drop for the brief amount of time that turbo charged air gets to visit the interooler, for the most air density derivable in the journey through the CAC ducts.

2. The top baffle covering the trans cooler to electric fan gap keeps the twin electric puller fans from drawing in air from anywhere else other than through the transmission cooler's heat exchanger field.





Finally, I added stealth wide mouth air scoops, necking inside through a narrower venturi, then expanding to a flow directed disbursement that captures some of the air flowing under the truck and channels it through the transmission cooler via ducting hidden within the bumper.

A secondary air dam captures the air that would otherwise create fuel robbing turbulence under the truck, and redirects that air into the transmission cooling scoops...





This is a 2000 truck, and from 1998 through mid 2001, the bumper and valance panel were solid as you see here. At some point in mid 2001, Ford cut out holes in the center of the bumper trim valance panel and chin spoiler to direct more cooling air to the lower half of the heat exchangers, and they did this not only in the Super Duty, but in the E Series vans as well. Perhaps they finally got the "right person" on that job.

Nevertheless, even if I updated to the later style bumper, air dam, and valance panel trim, my hidden front winch and front receiver hitch (that doubled as a "Blocker Beam" before Ford came out with them) ... would have prevented Ford's after the fact cooling air flow remediation through their 2002 model year bumper trim. Hence these hidden scoops.

There are actually a total of nine very stealthy hidden scoops in the front of my truck, that are screened, well drained, ducted, and directed towards either cooling needs or inlet air needs. Snow and water mitigation measures are incorporated into all of them, but testing of their efficacy in that regard is severely limited where I live, so in spite of my best efforts to consider the worst case scenario, I'm not suggesting that anything that I have done here would pass the same vetting process that an OEM would require.

But lets face it, almost anything is better than what Ford originally "vetted" during 1996-1997 when the 99 up Super Duty diesel was nearing release. Even this weekend hack achieved MUCH MUCH MUCH better and MEASURABLE transmission cooling with the foregoing measures.

Last edited by NYB; 05-07-2014 at 11:02 AM.
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post #34 of 67 (permalink) Old 04-22-2014, 07:47 PM
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MAD SCIENTIST I tell ya
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post #35 of 67 (permalink) Old 04-22-2014, 08:00 PM
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MAD SCIENTIST I tell ya
Come on Nick you know this is your destiny.


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03 F250 4x4 CC 7.3ltr 4R100HD rebuilt, 160,000 Klms
GTP38R , Turbo-master , IH Bellowed up pipes, RiffRaff CAC boot kit, AIH delete, .
4" Turbo back exhaust ,Banks power elbow, LPG (Gas over diesel) DP F6 tuner, 40hp tow, 60hp tow, 80hp tow, 60hp, 80hp, 120hp race, Decel, 1200 RPM.
RiffRaff 6637 intake ,pre filter, Snorkle
Custom made trans cooler with twin thermo fans ,water to oil cooler
Scangauge 11,AutoMeter Trans temp, pyro ,Water/Oil temp, Fuel Pressure, Boost.
Longrange 120 ltr fuel tank and transfer pump, 15,000 lb winch, Warn winch bar, Lightforce HID spot lights, HID headlights, Black Widow Drawer System, Snugtop Canopy with gull windows, Fr & Rr ARB Diff locks, Hornblaster Train horns, Post fuel pump filter, RiffRaff FRx and HPx , Bilsteins x4, Onboard compressor , Air tank and water traps, Billet door handles, Alpine headset, Alpine overhead DVD player, Rockford Fosgate sub, Alpine amp and CD changer.
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post #36 of 67 (permalink) Old 04-22-2014, 08:41 PM
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Nope.Everytime I fabricate something the planning and execution time spent is way high and I am never satisfied.I so not excellent in that department.When I pulled my bed to remove and fabricate new bed reinforcements I had to bring in a buddy that has been doing that stuff since he came back from Vietnam.He also has a degree in electrical engineering.
He is a nice guy,wicked smart and VERY handy when in those waters.
I believe he has pictures of that project.He did an amazing job fabricating those reinforcements.Way better than factory but was able to replicate exact shape and dimentions.He saved me from loosing my mind making them perfect .
I will see if he still has pictures.
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post #37 of 67 (permalink) Old 04-23-2014, 06:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYB View Post

Is that the Ford OEM Transfer Case shield (FOTZ- 7E063-A) you used to mount and protect the Oil to Water cooler? Do you have a transfer case also, or do you have twin transfer case shields mounted in series, one protecting your transfer case and one protecting and holding the cooler?

NYB,
That is the original Ford Transfer Case Cover, no there is only one Transfer Case cover, I had to fit the W/O cooler on the Transfer cover because there isn't much room left under the truck now, with a long range fuel tank, LPG Gas tank and Air tank under the truck.

The easiest way was to utilize the Transfer Cover and it is also closer to the transmission, as you can imagine there are a couple of extra water pipes running on the right hand chassis rail,I also have the auxiliary transmission filter on the side rail as well but all in all it fits without too much drama.

Your set up looks and sounds like It's a great build, I'm sure you run good temps when in tow.

As far as the poker game is concerned I would say It's an equal playing ground old mate, you have a very nice set up.

Seeyalater Mate


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03 F250 4x4 CC 7.3ltr 4R100HD rebuilt, 160,000 Klms
GTP38R , Turbo-master , IH Bellowed up pipes, RiffRaff CAC boot kit, AIH delete, .
4" Turbo back exhaust ,Banks power elbow, LPG (Gas over diesel) DP F6 tuner, 40hp tow, 60hp tow, 80hp tow, 60hp, 80hp, 120hp race, Decel, 1200 RPM.
RiffRaff 6637 intake ,pre filter, Snorkle
Custom made trans cooler with twin thermo fans ,water to oil cooler
Scangauge 11,AutoMeter Trans temp, pyro ,Water/Oil temp, Fuel Pressure, Boost.
Longrange 120 ltr fuel tank and transfer pump, 15,000 lb winch, Warn winch bar, Lightforce HID spot lights, HID headlights, Black Widow Drawer System, Snugtop Canopy with gull windows, Fr & Rr ARB Diff locks, Hornblaster Train horns, Post fuel pump filter, RiffRaff FRx and HPx , Bilsteins x4, Onboard compressor , Air tank and water traps, Billet door handles, Alpine headset, Alpine overhead DVD player, Rockford Fosgate sub, Alpine amp and CD changer.
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post #38 of 67 (permalink) Old 06-23-2014, 09:22 AM Thread Starter
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Well, I finally got a chance to really give my truck a test.
Up until now, my towing was just short trips of less than 10 miles and all surface streets.
Yesterday, even though we are only camping a short distance, I wanted to weigh my set up. So, my son and I loaded up the camper that's loaded up for a week. The only thing we were missing was my Wife and Daughter, the 2 dogs and the dog's crates.. they were coming by later in the day.

So we headed north on I-75 up past the Cartersville area. I wanted to get in an honest 30 miles with the trailer. Temps were hovering around 95F ambient. we kept speeds in the 65mph range, but did pass a few slower trucks and RVs where we probably hit 70mph. This was mostly uphill.. at least we increased in elevation some in rolling hills.

So, to make this long winded story short..
15220lbs GCW with the equivalent of a block shaped camper, 95F ambient
Generally up hill at 65mph average
Trans temp maxed at 170F measured at the test port. heading back home with a stop at the scale and more of a down hill route, temps were in the 160-165F range.

So, these temps sound much improved from what I used to see which was in the 180-200F range.

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"The Rig" - 2001 Ford F-250 CCSB 4x4 7.3 PSD Lariat - 285/75R16 BFG AT KO, HD4R100, MBRP 4" XP series exhaust, Ford AIS Intake, Zoodad, Fumoto oil drain valve, Pioneer AVIC-Z130BT In-Dash Nav, ScanGauge II, GlowShift 3 Gauge Pod (EGT, TFT, Boost)
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post #39 of 67 (permalink) Old 06-23-2014, 03:26 PM
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Sold!
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post #40 of 67 (permalink) Old 06-23-2014, 07:47 PM
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Well, I finally got a chance to really give my truck a test.
Up until now, my towing was just short trips of less than 10 miles and all surface streets.
Yesterday, even though we are only camping a short distance, I wanted to weigh my set up. So, my son and I loaded up the camper that's loaded up for a week. The only thing we were missing was my Wife and Daughter, the 2 dogs and the dog's crates.. they were coming by later in the day.

So we headed north on I-75 up past the Cartersville area. I wanted to get in an honest 30 miles with the trailer. Temps were hovering around 95F ambient. we kept speeds in the 65mph range, but did pass a few slower trucks and RVs where we probably hit 70mph. This was mostly uphill.. at least we increased in elevation some in rolling hills.

So, to make this long winded story short..
15220lbs GCW with the equivalent of a block shaped camper, 95F ambient
Generally up hill at 65mph average
Trans temp maxed at 170F measured at the test port. heading back home with a stop at the scale and more of a down hill route, temps were in the 160-165F range.

So, these temps sound much improved from what I used to see which was in the 180-200F range.
Wow that good temp readings you will be happy with that, but the 180-200F temps where not going to destroy your tranny pulling that weight.

Glad to hear it's fixed where you like to see the temps .


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03 F250 4x4 CC 7.3ltr 4R100HD rebuilt, 160,000 Klms
GTP38R , Turbo-master , IH Bellowed up pipes, RiffRaff CAC boot kit, AIH delete, .
4" Turbo back exhaust ,Banks power elbow, LPG (Gas over diesel) DP F6 tuner, 40hp tow, 60hp tow, 80hp tow, 60hp, 80hp, 120hp race, Decel, 1200 RPM.
RiffRaff 6637 intake ,pre filter, Snorkle
Custom made trans cooler with twin thermo fans ,water to oil cooler
Scangauge 11,AutoMeter Trans temp, pyro ,Water/Oil temp, Fuel Pressure, Boost.
Longrange 120 ltr fuel tank and transfer pump, 15,000 lb winch, Warn winch bar, Lightforce HID spot lights, HID headlights, Black Widow Drawer System, Snugtop Canopy with gull windows, Fr & Rr ARB Diff locks, Hornblaster Train horns, Post fuel pump filter, RiffRaff FRx and HPx , Bilsteins x4, Onboard compressor , Air tank and water traps, Billet door handles, Alpine headset, Alpine overhead DVD player, Rockford Fosgate sub, Alpine amp and CD changer.
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post #41 of 67 (permalink) Old 06-23-2014, 08:01 PM Thread Starter
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Wow that good temp readings you will be happy with that, but the 180-200F temps where not going to destroy your tranny pulling that weight.

Glad to hear it's fixed where you like to see the temps .
Not trying to fix anything as much as trying to protect an investment. I really like my old truck and don't want to get a new one. This one does all that I need. The trans temps seem all sorted.... next is going through to the rest of the cooling system and onto 1/2 million miles.

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"The Rig" - 2001 Ford F-250 CCSB 4x4 7.3 PSD Lariat - 285/75R16 BFG AT KO, HD4R100, MBRP 4" XP series exhaust, Ford AIS Intake, Zoodad, Fumoto oil drain valve, Pioneer AVIC-Z130BT In-Dash Nav, ScanGauge II, GlowShift 3 Gauge Pod (EGT, TFT, Boost)
307rwhp / 651rwft-lbs
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post #42 of 67 (permalink) Old 09-23-2014, 06:33 PM
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Sold!

A reminder bump for Nick... who is in the middle of doing this project right now.

Nick, I thought the image I was talking about was in this thread, but it isn't. I did find it elsewhere though:

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post #43 of 67 (permalink) Old 09-23-2014, 09:08 PM
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So if it clogs can that spring let the fluid flow?
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post #44 of 67 (permalink) Old 07-16-2019, 07:58 PM
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Id apologize for resurrecting this thread from almost 5 years ago but dont see anything wrong with it.

I found a leak on the hose fitting that connects to my 9 row on my 99 f250. I decided if Im gonna tear it down to fix it I might as well upgrade the cooler. Originally I bought a 26 row from a salvage operation in canada via ebay. I bought hoses and clamps and the magnafine filter mentioned here. My thought was Id catch any debris the used cooler had (right or wrong, not here to debate my logic there). Was a really nice looking cooler but it was lost in shipping. I told them either send me one in same or better condition or refund me the money so I can go elsewhere. Well they sent me one that was complete dogsh!t and after a very nice yet stearn email they refunded my money. By the way, if I was a jerk about it they may not have helped me.

I then decided to buy a cheap one from rockauto based on some reviews I read and its on the way.

Finally to my question; I have purchased new oil coolers in the past and to my horror found debris from manufacturing inside. So as I understand it ford does a new oil cooler and this filter when they do a reman trans. Should I install this filter with this brand new "cheap"cooler? I mean I have it, can it impede flow too much? I guess Id need to put it on a maintenance schedule based on miles.

This is a great thread by the way.

EDIT: Almost forgot to ask.. which line is the return???


thanks

early 99, cone intake, stock 3.5" exhaust, muffler deleted. Edge Evolution CS

Last edited by Barchetta; 07-16-2019 at 08:01 PM.
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post #45 of 67 (permalink) Old 07-16-2019, 09:12 PM
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I run the filter on mine on the supply line, but canít see how it would matter. The reason most of us do that is the supply line is easily accessible and a rubber line whereas the return is metal. The return line is the one that goes to the rear of the transmission.


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2003 F-250 XLT Crew Cab 7.3L, Chrome BigTex Grille Guard, Quad pillar - 3 ISSPRO gauges (trans, pyro, boost) and DP-Tuner F6; Roush fuel pressure / temperature / oil pressure gauges, Ford Severe Duty AIS, 31 row 6.0 transmission cooler, ScanGauge II, Marinco mod, Walker BTM, Full Force Stage 1 injectors

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