2002 F350 7.3 intermittent crank but no-start. HPOP? - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
'99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain Discussion of the '99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 1999-Up Super Duty trucks and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 7.3L Power Stroke engine.

 15Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-22-2018, 10:19 PM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 13
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
2002 F350 7.3 intermittent crank but no-start. HPOP?

Help. I have a 2002 F350 dually (7.3) 230,000 miles. Recently started getting intermittent no-starts. Engine will crank fine, but not start. Also no movement of tach needle when cranking. Engine WILL start with ether and runs perfectly once started, except that I get a check engine light if I cruise above 2100 RPMs for more than a minute or so. (That may or may not be related to the no-starts. I don't know).

Some days it has the no-start issue, some days it doesn't. Whether it starts normally, or I have to use ether, the check engine light always blinks on/off randomly, and stays on above 2100 RPMs though. A local shop looked at all the usual sensors that cause this issue, and they were all fine. After testing pressure on the HPOP, they said it needs to be replaced.

Is it normal for a bad HPOP to cause INTERMITTENT no-starts? What I want to avoid is replacing it and then discovering that it wasn't the problem after all. As you all know, HPOPs ain't cheap. I'm wondering if it could be the IPR, and if I should gamble and just replace that first.

Last edited by tech_rick; 12-22-2018 at 10:23 PM. Reason: typo
tech_rick is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 01:50 AM
Senior Member
 
2000F250-7.3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Westminster Colo
Posts: 497
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by tech_rick View Post
Help. I have a 2002 F350 dually (7.3) 230,000 miles. Recently started getting intermittent no-starts. Engine will crank fine, but not start. Also no movement of tach needle when cranking. Engine WILL start with ether and runs perfectly once started, except that I get a check engine light if I cruise above 2100 RPMs for more than a minute or so. (That may or may not be related to the no-starts. I don't know).

Some days it has the no-start issue, some days it doesn't. Whether it starts normally, or I have to use ether, the check engine light always blinks on/off randomly, and stays on above 2100 RPMs though. A local shop looked at all the usual sensors that cause this issue, and they were all fine. After testing pressure on the HPOP, they said it needs to be replaced.

Is it normal for a bad HPOP to cause INTERMITTENT no-starts? What I want to avoid is replacing it and then discovering that it wasn't the problem after all. As you all know, HPOPs ain't cheap. I'm wondering if it could be the IPR, and if I should gamble and just replace that first.


From my experience it probably is not holding pressure. Is it giving a code my guess is a p1211 code injection pressure above or below desired. If you can you need to watch ipr duty cycle and ice pressure when it is doing a no start and when your getting a CEL. https://oregonfuelinjection.com/cont...diagnostic.pdf


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
tech_rick likes this.

2000 F250 7.3 4inc exhaust, Ts 6 pos chip witch custom tunes, Built 4R100 w billet triple disc converter, 6.0 trans cooler and deep tans pan, CCV mod, 4 gauge pod A piller,Boost,Trans temp,EGT,fuel pressure AFE intake,RIFFRAFF Frx fuel Rail dead head fix black spring,High Flow banjo bolts,High Flow CVD Fitting, Harpoon mod,Diesel site adrenaline HPOP,AIH Plug,Plenum Reinforcing Inserts. FULL FORCE DIESEL STAGE 1.5 single shot injectors, Garrett powermax GTP38R and blank pedestal, RIFFRAFF Intercooler CAC Boots with complete clamp kit , scanegauge 2
2000F250-7.3 is offline  
post #3 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 09:11 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Greenville,Virginia
Posts: 141
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
unplug icp sensor and try starting
tech_rick likes this.

early 99 f250 auto 190000 miles ts6 chip, riffraff frx, 6637 filter with riffraff cover edpv delete 4in exhaust tru- cool max,dedc tow mirrors with lights/heat,glow shift boost,egt,trans, fuel, gauges. hopkins agility brake control,pyle backup camera,firestone air bags,marinco plug, 265/75r 16 cooper discoverer a/t3 tires sinister diesel coolant filter,Bilstein 5100 stancor gpr.
stumpman is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 09:30 AM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 13
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by stumpman View Post
unplug icp sensor and try starting
I've tried this and still no start.
tech_rick is offline  
post #5 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 10:49 AM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 13
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Thanks for this. The diag sheet is going to be REALLY helpful and I appreciate the link to it.

I'm thinking the problem is either the injector O rings, the IPR, or the HPOP. With it being an intermittent issue, it's hard to tell.

I'm not betting on the O rings because all the injectors were replace about 10,000 miles ago, and I have almost zero oil consumption.

My plan is to replace the IPR first. The previous owner kept very detailed maintenance records on this truck and I can find no record of the IPR ever having been replaced. If that doesn't solve the issue, then it looks like Ol' Grey is getting a new HPOP.

If the HPOP doesn't do it, my plan is to contact a priest and have an exorcism done on the truck.
tech_rick is offline  
post #6 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 01:14 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Greenville,Virginia
Posts: 141
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
check tin nut on ipr as 2000f250 said have codes read and injector pressure and duty cycle% before replacing parts in hopes of guessing which part is bad
tech_rick likes this.

early 99 f250 auto 190000 miles ts6 chip, riffraff frx, 6637 filter with riffraff cover edpv delete 4in exhaust tru- cool max,dedc tow mirrors with lights/heat,glow shift boost,egt,trans, fuel, gauges. hopkins agility brake control,pyle backup camera,firestone air bags,marinco plug, 265/75r 16 cooper discoverer a/t3 tires sinister diesel coolant filter,Bilstein 5100 stancor gpr.
stumpman is offline  
post #7 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 01:24 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Greenville,Virginia
Posts: 141
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
After truck sits over night check hpop level.might want to back off on the ether tack will not move while cranking on 2002 model,
tech_rick likes this.

early 99 f250 auto 190000 miles ts6 chip, riffraff frx, 6637 filter with riffraff cover edpv delete 4in exhaust tru- cool max,dedc tow mirrors with lights/heat,glow shift boost,egt,trans, fuel, gauges. hopkins agility brake control,pyle backup camera,firestone air bags,marinco plug, 265/75r 16 cooper discoverer a/t3 tires sinister diesel coolant filter,Bilstein 5100 stancor gpr.
stumpman is offline  
post #8 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 04:34 PM
Senior Member
 
2000F250-7.3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Westminster Colo
Posts: 497
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
If you do need a pump I recommend a Dieselsite Adrenaline pump I have had one on my truck for two years and love it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
tech_rick likes this.

2000 F250 7.3 4inc exhaust, Ts 6 pos chip witch custom tunes, Built 4R100 w billet triple disc converter, 6.0 trans cooler and deep tans pan, CCV mod, 4 gauge pod A piller,Boost,Trans temp,EGT,fuel pressure AFE intake,RIFFRAFF Frx fuel Rail dead head fix black spring,High Flow banjo bolts,High Flow CVD Fitting, Harpoon mod,Diesel site adrenaline HPOP,AIH Plug,Plenum Reinforcing Inserts. FULL FORCE DIESEL STAGE 1.5 single shot injectors, Garrett powermax GTP38R and blank pedestal, RIFFRAFF Intercooler CAC Boots with complete clamp kit , scanegauge 2
2000F250-7.3 is offline  
post #9 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 05:16 PM
Lifetime Supporting Member
 
klhansen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Eagle River, Alaska
Posts: 24,800
My Photos: (180)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
I would say that its not your HPOP, or leaks in the hp oil system. Your problem being intermittent, you can be pretty sure that leaks don't heal themselves, and the HPOP is probably the most durable part of the system.
I would get a scan tool on it and check it out. Probably a wiring or sensor issue.
tech_rick likes this.

First truck -- 1929 Model A Ford pickup, restored from ground up. Wish I still had it!
'99.5 F250 PSD Supercab LB 4x4, ZF-6 w/SB Con OFE, 3.73LS, Boost & pyro gauges, Swamps S175/146 injectors, DP 80 HP Econo PCM (classic version
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
), AIS,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
regulated return,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
klhansen is offline  
post #10 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 06:13 PM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 13
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Today I replaced the fuel filter and the IPR. The issue remains. Still will not start unless I use ether, but runs GREAT once started. Also, it DID start this morning when cold, but would not start again later after having been run for a while.

When changing the IPR, I noticed something that struck me as suspicious: with the old IPR out and the new one not yet installed, all the oil in my HPOP reservoir leaked out from the IPR mounting hole. After installing the new IPR, I had to refill the reservoir. Is that normal? I thought the was supposed to be a check ball in there to prevent this happening.
tech_rick is offline  
post #11 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 06:28 PM
Lifetime Supporting Member
 
ArcticDriver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Longmont, CO
Posts: 3,784
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Sorry but you are not listening.

Stop using ether unless you want to damage your engine.

Get the codes read. If the CEL is coming on then it has codes stored.

Record your ICP/IPR relationship in real time.

OR.

Keep throwing money after parts that may be in good repair. What did the IPR set you back? $180 and a few hours of time?
tech_rick likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
2002 F-250 4x4 CC SB 7.3 PSD w/4R100. 182,000 miles.
NOS Black CPS. ScanGauge-II, AIC, Bilstein 5100, Stancor GPR, Marinco Mod, B&W Turnover Ball, Michelin Defender LTX


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
2002 F-250 4x4 SC LB 7.3 PSD w/ZF-6. 177,000 miles.
NOS Black CPS. ScanGauge-II. Bilstein 5100. Stancor GPR. Walker BTM. Noco Mod. Michelin Defender LTX 285/75/16.

SOLD:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
2000 F-250 4x4 SC SB 7.3 PSD w/4R100. 164,000 miles.
NOS Black CPS. Rebuilt Fuel bowl w/gold spring, 6.0 Cooler, Walker BTM, Stancor GPR, Michelin LTX M&S2.
ArcticDriver is offline  
post #12 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 06:54 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Greenville,Virginia
Posts: 141
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
post your location someone with ae might help. yes its normal for oil to leak out
tech_rick likes this.

early 99 f250 auto 190000 miles ts6 chip, riffraff frx, 6637 filter with riffraff cover edpv delete 4in exhaust tru- cool max,dedc tow mirrors with lights/heat,glow shift boost,egt,trans, fuel, gauges. hopkins agility brake control,pyle backup camera,firestone air bags,marinco plug, 265/75r 16 cooper discoverer a/t3 tires sinister diesel coolant filter,Bilstein 5100 stancor gpr.
stumpman is offline  
post #13 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 06:57 PM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 13
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArcticDriver View Post
Sorry but you are not listening.

Stop using ether unless you want to damage your engine.

Get the codes read. If the CEL is coming on then it has codes stored.

Record your ICP/IPR relationship in real time.

OR.

Keep throwing money after parts that may be in good repair. What did the IPR set you back? $180 and a few hours of time?
Yep about $180. The IPR was the original one as far as I can tell. I tried to have the codes read. O'Reilly's near me has an OBD II reader, but it showed no errors. They said the CEL has to be on at the time of the scan for them to pick up anything. They couldn't get the code history.

I'll have to find someone with a reader that can get stored codes that are not active at the time the scan is made.

Do you know if it's normal for all the HPOP reservoir oil to leak out the IPR port when the IPR is removed?
tech_rick is offline  
post #14 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 06:58 PM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 13
My Photos: (0)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by stumpman View Post
post your location someone with ae might help. yes its normal for oil to leak out
I'm near Paris, Tennessee.

At this point, it appears that my problem is most likely either:

A: HPOP

or,

B: Injector O rings.

All 8 injectors were replaced in November of 2017 by the previous owner. I assume the O rings would have been replaced at that time as well. So the O rings are just over a year old and have about 10,000 miles on them. Is there a way, without digging into the engine, to tell which of these two things is the problem? When I find someone who can read the stored codes, are the codes likely to point out which thing is the problem?

Also, I know that changing the HPOP is far more expensive than changing out the injector O rings, but isn't it more difficult to change the O rings than the HPOP (given that I'll do the work myself).

Last edited by tech_rick; 12-23-2018 at 07:32 PM.
tech_rick is offline  
post #15 of 28 (permalink) Old 12-23-2018, 07:24 PM
Lifetime Supporting Member
 
klhansen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Eagle River, Alaska
Posts: 24,800
My Photos: (180)
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by tech_rick View Post
O'Reilly's near me has an OBD II reader, but it showed no errors. They said the CEL has to be on at the time of the scan for them to pick up anything. They couldn't get the code history.

I'll have to find someone with a reader that can get stored codes that are not active at the time the scan is made.
You need a PowerStroke compatible scan tool. What the guy at O'Reilly told you is total BS. Their scan tools (and at other parts stores don't work either.

Pulling the IPR WILL drain the oil from the reservoir. Your issue is more of a no start when hot rather than intermittent. So you should look at injector O-rings. If the upper O-rings are leaking you won't lose any oil but can cause a no-start when hot.

Like Dan said DON'T USE ETHER!
tech_rick likes this.

First truck -- 1929 Model A Ford pickup, restored from ground up. Wish I still had it!
'99.5 F250 PSD Supercab LB 4x4, ZF-6 w/SB Con OFE, 3.73LS, Boost & pyro gauges, Swamps S175/146 injectors, DP 80 HP Econo PCM (classic version
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
), AIS,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
regulated return,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
klhansen is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com > 1999-2007 Ford Super Duties > '99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome