Do I have a clutch problem or tranny issue? - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
'99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke Engine and Drivetrain Discussion of the '99 & up 7.3L Power Stroke diesel engine and drivetrain in the 1999-Up Super Duty trucks and Excursions. No gas engine discussion allowed except on transmissions and drivetrain that pertain to all models. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 7.3L Power Stroke engine.

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post #1 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-16-2019, 08:54 PM Thread Starter
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Do I have a clutch problem or tranny issue?

Hello all,
I have some ugly noise that intermittently comes from my truck. I have linked a youtube video:


It seems to happen as I am releasing the clutch. But, it stops when the clutch is engaged and I am fully moving forward. It also seems to stop when I then press the clutch down all the way.

The other issue is that something has been getting stuck in there. When I start the truck in neutral, it might not be willing to go in gear. So, I then have to shut the truck off, put it in gear and start it. The truck will then shutter just a touch, like it wants to move, and then it releases and I can drive just fine.

The clutch is a South Bend Con O and was put in 10+ years ago, but has only about 50k on it. I am only driving the truck about 2-3k miles per year for the last few years. Any ideas how to diagnose from the video? Thanks.

2002 F-250, PSD 6-speed, CC, short bed, 4X4, Toreador Red w/ Silver accent, A.R.E mx cap, Weld Super Single II and 33s in the summer, x-springs, F-350 blocks and badges, AIC, proflaps, ITP intank mod, AirDog with 3 micron filter, isspro guages and TTM, scangauge, husky liners, alarm, xm stereo,stull 5399-p grille, centramatics, ccv mod, AIS Air Filter, Southbend CON O, Detroit Truetrac LSD, coolant filter, 203 stat with billet housing, blackcloud intake heater plug/boost fitting, reese titan hitch, fabcraft PTO cover/temp sender port, prodigy brake controller, ITP Boost Annihalator, oilguard bypass filter, Mag-Hytec rear dif, bilsteins, hellwig rear stabilizer bar, ATS housing, non-ebpv pedistal and exhaust flange, magnaflow 3.5dp exhaust, ITP reg return, turbomaster wastegate controller, and ceramic coated bellowed up pipes, PHP 50t and 80p, currently 127,000 miles.
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post #2 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-16-2019, 11:06 PM
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Throwout bearing would be my guess.
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post #3 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-17-2019, 12:48 AM
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I'm not so sure it would be a throwout bearing. That would likely make noise any time the clutch pedal is depressed. But even if it is, the tranny will have to come out anyway. It could be the pilot bushing. I had a SB kevlar pilot bushing go out on me. It would so the signature "shaft rattling around in a bore" sound. I was worn enough that I could stick a 1/8" allen wrench alongside the input shaft in the bushing. With the clutch sticking engaged occasionally, I would also suspect the disc springs or the center of the disk coming apart. I've had the center hub of the disk let go on me as well. I was thinking "Oh crap, the input shaft broke", but fortunately, the tranny was fine.
Let us know what you find when you tear into it.

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post #4 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-17-2019, 07:08 AM Thread Starter
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Should I order a new clutch kit from South Bend? I believe I would get a new bearing and bushing with the kit. I don't use the truck often and it does not always make the sound. Some days I can drive it and it is fine. Would you use this think at all or can this result in more damage?
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post #5 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-17-2019, 12:19 PM
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I would get a replacement clutch kit on the way (they sell a replacement kit, since you already have the flywheel). Listening to your video another time, I really think you have a spring or something like that loose inside the bell housing/clutch. I don't think it will do a lot more damage, but the center section of the disk could give up completely like mine did (didn't have any noise prior) and leave you stranded on the side of the road. I would avoid driving much until you get it fixed.

First truck -- 1929 Model A Ford pickup, restored from ground up. Wish I still had it!
'99.5 F250 PSD Supercab LB 4x4, ZF-6 w/SB Con OFE, 3.73LS, Boost & pyro gauges, Swamps S175/146 injectors, DP 80 HP Econo PCM (classic version
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post #6 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-23-2019, 12:46 PM Thread Starter
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We are going to yank the transmission in about a week. I have other stuff going on. So..... it is research time. I have watched a couple of vids so far. Any specific critical steps or torque setting for parts NOT related to clutch? I have to remove starter, front drive shaft, rear driveshaft, slave, ........ What else? Will the exhaust be in the way? Any critical torque values. Any critical alignment with driveshaft? In one vid, I saw they had to remove the front sway bar links. Any other "replace while you are there" pearls of wisdom. Thanks.

2002 F-250, PSD 6-speed, CC, short bed, 4X4, Toreador Red w/ Silver accent, A.R.E mx cap, Weld Super Single II and 33s in the summer, x-springs, F-350 blocks and badges, AIC, proflaps, ITP intank mod, AirDog with 3 micron filter, isspro guages and TTM, scangauge, husky liners, alarm, xm stereo,stull 5399-p grille, centramatics, ccv mod, AIS Air Filter, Southbend CON O, Detroit Truetrac LSD, coolant filter, 203 stat with billet housing, blackcloud intake heater plug/boost fitting, reese titan hitch, fabcraft PTO cover/temp sender port, prodigy brake controller, ITP Boost Annihalator, oilguard bypass filter, Mag-Hytec rear dif, bilsteins, hellwig rear stabilizer bar, ATS housing, non-ebpv pedistal and exhaust flange, magnaflow 3.5dp exhaust, ITP reg return, turbomaster wastegate controller, and ceramic coated bellowed up pipes, PHP 50t and 80p, currently 127,000 miles.
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post #7 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-23-2019, 01:17 PM
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Exhaust should be out of the way as are sway bar links, although those are good head-knockers.
I don't have a listing of torque values handy, but could get those for you.
You need to index mark your t-case drive flanges and driveshaft yokes so you get them back in the same position.
And a set of extra long extensions are handy for getting at the top tranny to engine bolts.
One of the worst parts is getting the shifter boot off without tearing the heavy inner boot. After you unscrew the bezel from the floor, take a screwdriver and separate the inner boot from the bezel (it's held on by friction clips to the bezel) by gently prying it apart. Then you can get to the bolts for the shifter, remove that, then the inner boot. The shift tower has to come off as well.

Once you have the tranny out, check your up-pipes (exhaust manifold to turbo inlet) for leakage, and replace them (either new donuts if the pipes aren't hourglass shaped at the donuts, or new stock up-pipes or the improved bellowed up-pipes) if they're leaking. MUCH easier with the tranny out of the way. Plan on cutting the bolts at the exhaust manifolds, so have new bolts available. Soak the bolts there and at the turbo inlet with PB blaster the day before you start.

OH, and definitely use a tranny jack. You don't want to try bench pressing the ZF-6, even without the t-case attached.
I usually jack up the rear of the truck to give some more room to work, especially if you're planning on pulling the tranny all the way out from underneath.

First truck -- 1929 Model A Ford pickup, restored from ground up. Wish I still had it!
'99.5 F250 PSD Supercab LB 4x4, ZF-6 w/SB Con OFE, 3.73LS, Boost & pyro gauges, Swamps S175/146 injectors, DP 80 HP Econo PCM (classic version
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post #8 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-25-2019, 07:15 AM Thread Starter
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OK, Thanks. I already have bellowed up pipes and installed them several years ago, but not many miles ago. I probably have 45k on them, but 10 years. If the donuts look clean and now real soot around them, should I just leave well enough alone? I forget if it was hell or not. Can I do just the exhaust manifold side or do you have to do turbo side at the same time? BTW, about how long does it typically take to get the tranny out? Thanks again. The plan is to remove and inspect next weekend.

2002 F-250, PSD 6-speed, CC, short bed, 4X4, Toreador Red w/ Silver accent, A.R.E mx cap, Weld Super Single II and 33s in the summer, x-springs, F-350 blocks and badges, AIC, proflaps, ITP intank mod, AirDog with 3 micron filter, isspro guages and TTM, scangauge, husky liners, alarm, xm stereo,stull 5399-p grille, centramatics, ccv mod, AIS Air Filter, Southbend CON O, Detroit Truetrac LSD, coolant filter, 203 stat with billet housing, blackcloud intake heater plug/boost fitting, reese titan hitch, fabcraft PTO cover/temp sender port, prodigy brake controller, ITP Boost Annihalator, oilguard bypass filter, Mag-Hytec rear dif, bilsteins, hellwig rear stabilizer bar, ATS housing, non-ebpv pedistal and exhaust flange, magnaflow 3.5dp exhaust, ITP reg return, turbomaster wastegate controller, and ceramic coated bellowed up pipes, PHP 50t and 80p, currently 127,000 miles.
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post #9 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-25-2019, 04:10 PM
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Bellowed up-pipes don't have donuts, so you should be good. Gaskets on top and metal-to-metal flanged joints at the manifolds, IIRC. Time helps as far as how hard a job is.
You should be able to have the tranny pulled back out of the way in a couple of hours. I'd say figure 6 hours total for the whole clutch replacement if you're working by yourself.

First truck -- 1929 Model A Ford pickup, restored from ground up. Wish I still had it!
'99.5 F250 PSD Supercab LB 4x4, ZF-6 w/SB Con OFE, 3.73LS, Boost & pyro gauges, Swamps S175/146 injectors, DP 80 HP Econo PCM (classic version
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post #10 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-27-2019, 09:06 PM Thread Starter
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ok, thanks. One more quick question for now, where are folks buying parts online these days? Southbend recommends that I have a new T/O on hand, as the clutch might be fine. They say my setup uses a stock bearing and I would want a Ford part. It has been a while, thankfully, since I had to buy a part. Thanks.

2002 F-250, PSD 6-speed, CC, short bed, 4X4, Toreador Red w/ Silver accent, A.R.E mx cap, Weld Super Single II and 33s in the summer, x-springs, F-350 blocks and badges, AIC, proflaps, ITP intank mod, AirDog with 3 micron filter, isspro guages and TTM, scangauge, husky liners, alarm, xm stereo,stull 5399-p grille, centramatics, ccv mod, AIS Air Filter, Southbend CON O, Detroit Truetrac LSD, coolant filter, 203 stat with billet housing, blackcloud intake heater plug/boost fitting, reese titan hitch, fabcraft PTO cover/temp sender port, prodigy brake controller, ITP Boost Annihalator, oilguard bypass filter, Mag-Hytec rear dif, bilsteins, hellwig rear stabilizer bar, ATS housing, non-ebpv pedistal and exhaust flange, magnaflow 3.5dp exhaust, ITP reg return, turbomaster wastegate controller, and ceramic coated bellowed up pipes, PHP 50t and 80p, currently 127,000 miles.
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post #11 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-27-2019, 11:27 PM
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Yes, replace the throwout bearing as a matter of course, any time you work on the clutch. It's a job you don't want to do twice, because you didn't replace the throwout bearing.

First truck -- 1929 Model A Ford pickup, restored from ground up. Wish I still had it!
'99.5 F250 PSD Supercab LB 4x4, ZF-6 w/SB Con OFE, 3.73LS, Boost & pyro gauges, Swamps S175/146 injectors, DP 80 HP Econo PCM (classic version
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post #12 of 40 (permalink) Old 07-30-2019, 10:53 AM Thread Starter
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Absolutely replacing the T/O bearing. But, where are you guys getting Ford part online? Is there a preferred online vendor?

2002 F-250, PSD 6-speed, CC, short bed, 4X4, Toreador Red w/ Silver accent, A.R.E mx cap, Weld Super Single II and 33s in the summer, x-springs, F-350 blocks and badges, AIC, proflaps, ITP intank mod, AirDog with 3 micron filter, isspro guages and TTM, scangauge, husky liners, alarm, xm stereo,stull 5399-p grille, centramatics, ccv mod, AIS Air Filter, Southbend CON O, Detroit Truetrac LSD, coolant filter, 203 stat with billet housing, blackcloud intake heater plug/boost fitting, reese titan hitch, fabcraft PTO cover/temp sender port, prodigy brake controller, ITP Boost Annihalator, oilguard bypass filter, Mag-Hytec rear dif, bilsteins, hellwig rear stabilizer bar, ATS housing, non-ebpv pedistal and exhaust flange, magnaflow 3.5dp exhaust, ITP reg return, turbomaster wastegate controller, and ceramic coated bellowed up pipes, PHP 50t and 80p, currently 127,000 miles.
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post #13 of 40 (permalink) Old 08-04-2019, 09:15 PM Thread Starter
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OK, this job was ugly and thanks for all the help. It is out, but that is about it. I still have it under the truck and my brother and I are beat. So, tomorrow we will remove the pressure plate and clutch. The throw out bearing plastic portion was hanging disconnected. I will post a pic. There is minimal play in the input shaft. You really have to yank on it to feel movement. The input shaft tip was completely dry, no sign of any grease. There should be the Kevlar bushing from southbend in there, but won't know until tomorrow night. See pics of throw out bearing. Thanks.
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2002 F-250, PSD 6-speed, CC, short bed, 4X4, Toreador Red w/ Silver accent, A.R.E mx cap, Weld Super Single II and 33s in the summer, x-springs, F-350 blocks and badges, AIC, proflaps, ITP intank mod, AirDog with 3 micron filter, isspro guages and TTM, scangauge, husky liners, alarm, xm stereo,stull 5399-p grille, centramatics, ccv mod, AIS Air Filter, Southbend CON O, Detroit Truetrac LSD, coolant filter, 203 stat with billet housing, blackcloud intake heater plug/boost fitting, reese titan hitch, fabcraft PTO cover/temp sender port, prodigy brake controller, ITP Boost Annihalator, oilguard bypass filter, Mag-Hytec rear dif, bilsteins, hellwig rear stabilizer bar, ATS housing, non-ebpv pedistal and exhaust flange, magnaflow 3.5dp exhaust, ITP reg return, turbomaster wastegate controller, and ceramic coated bellowed up pipes, PHP 50t and 80p, currently 127,000 miles.

Last edited by clydesdale; 08-09-2019 at 10:42 AM.
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post #14 of 40 (permalink) Old 08-04-2019, 10:33 PM
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My throwout bearing was gone worse than yours and the fork was being cut by the pressure plate.
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post #15 of 40 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 11:05 AM Thread Starter
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There is very minimal play in the input shaft. I did just remember that replacing that is very complicated. How much play is acceptable? I did see where there was discussion on the net about this, but it is in a bmw and someone said that with the tranny out, there will be some play because the shaft is only supported by one bearing on the back end, but when it is installed, it is also supported by the pilot bearing. This is stuff that is out of my league. But, I am hoping that the slight play that I have is within spec.

2002 F-250, PSD 6-speed, CC, short bed, 4X4, Toreador Red w/ Silver accent, A.R.E mx cap, Weld Super Single II and 33s in the summer, x-springs, F-350 blocks and badges, AIC, proflaps, ITP intank mod, AirDog with 3 micron filter, isspro guages and TTM, scangauge, husky liners, alarm, xm stereo,stull 5399-p grille, centramatics, ccv mod, AIS Air Filter, Southbend CON O, Detroit Truetrac LSD, coolant filter, 203 stat with billet housing, blackcloud intake heater plug/boost fitting, reese titan hitch, fabcraft PTO cover/temp sender port, prodigy brake controller, ITP Boost Annihalator, oilguard bypass filter, Mag-Hytec rear dif, bilsteins, hellwig rear stabilizer bar, ATS housing, non-ebpv pedistal and exhaust flange, magnaflow 3.5dp exhaust, ITP reg return, turbomaster wastegate controller, and ceramic coated bellowed up pipes, PHP 50t and 80p, currently 127,000 miles.
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