GTP38R install tips - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
'99 & up Upgrades and Aftermarket - 7.3L Engine Upgrading or adding OEM or aftermarket equipment to your 1999-Up Super Duty or Excursion with 7.3L Power Stroke diesel engine. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 7.3L Power Stroke engine.

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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-13-2018, 01:35 AM Thread Starter
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GTP38R install tips

Going to install a GTP38R soon and was looking for some tips. I have watched a few Youtube videos and have write ups from Garrett and Riffraff on turbo installs. I have purcased all new boots, clamps and plenum inserts from Riffraff to go with the installation. Just looking for any tips or tricks to help me along. I have a pedestal o-ring kit from Dieselorings and one from Garrett as well, which should I use. Any help is appreciated, Thanks.

2002 F250 Super Duty Crew Cab 7.3L Lariat 2WD 131,000mi; 4in turbo back custom exhaust, Garrett GTP38R turbo, Riffraff intercooler boots, Dorman Up-Pipes, Ford Severe Duty AIS, 31 row 6.0 transmission cooler, Scangauge II, ISSPRO EV2 Boost-EGT-Trans temp-Fuel pressure Gauges, DP T-5 Tuner (stock ,60HP tow, Decel, 60HP highway econo, 80HP city econo), Dieselsite coolant filtration, Max Air A/C mod, foglight mod, AIH delete, LED interior, back up camera, hid foglights.


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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-13-2018, 01:40 AM Thread Starter
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Moderator please move to the correct forum. Should have posted in the 7.3 engine upgrades.

2002 F250 Super Duty Crew Cab 7.3L Lariat 2WD 131,000mi; 4in turbo back custom exhaust, Garrett GTP38R turbo, Riffraff intercooler boots, Dorman Up-Pipes, Ford Severe Duty AIS, 31 row 6.0 transmission cooler, Scangauge II, ISSPRO EV2 Boost-EGT-Trans temp-Fuel pressure Gauges, DP T-5 Tuner (stock ,60HP tow, Decel, 60HP highway econo, 80HP city econo), Dieselsite coolant filtration, Max Air A/C mod, foglight mod, AIH delete, LED interior, back up camera, hid foglights.


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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-13-2018, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jleedog View Post
Going to install a GTP38R soon and was looking for some tips. I have watched a few Youtube videos and have write ups from Garrett and Riffraff on turbo installs. I have purcased all new boots, clamps and plenum inserts from Riffraff to go with the installation. Just looking for any tips or tricks to help me along. I have a pedestal o-ring kit from Dieselorings and one from Garrett as well, which should I use. Any help is appreciated, Thanks.


You got all great parts to add to you 7.3. Either o-ring kit is a good to use you are replacing all 4 o rings on the pedestal I hope. The only tip I could give you is get the turbo in place and get the bolts in but leave it loose a little then get your up pipe flange with the alinement pin to back of the turbo get the ban clamp on loose. Then torque the turbo down then do the rear clamp. That how I have done my turbo and several other turbo installs. You will probably need two people to do the down pipe. Good luck and enjoy the new turbo.


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2000 F250 7.3 4inc exhaust, Ts 6 pos chip witch custom tunes, Built 4R100 w billet triple disc converter, 6.0 trans cooler and deep tans pan, CCV mod, 4 gauge pod A piller,Boost,Trans temp,EGT,fuel pressure AFE intake,RIFFRAFF Frx fuel Rail dead head fix black spring,High Flow banjo bolts,High Flow CVD Fitting, Harpoon mod,Diesel site adrenaline HPOP,AIH Plug,Plenum Reinforcing Inserts. FULL FORCE DIESEL STAGE 1.5 single shot injectors, Garrett powermax GTP38R and blank pedestal, RIFFRAFF Intercooler CAC Boots with complete clamp kit , scanegauge 2
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-13-2018, 04:03 PM
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Do you already have the turbo? If not I would seriously look into putting a billet wheel in your stock turbo. I’ve had both but I prefer that setup with my stock injectors. As for recommendations, I would get a set of bellowed up pipes. They can be purchased through amazon or eBay for less than $100 now and seal much better than the original style.

01 F250 Auto, PHP Hydra, 4" SS Magnaflow Exhaust, AIS Filter, Edge Insight w/ backup camera, Autometer Sport Comp II Boost gauge, stock turbo w/ RRD billet wheel, Turbomaster wastegate controller, EBPV delete pedestal, 6.0L Trans cooler, Transgo tugger shift kit. Trans rebuilt in 2014 w/ heavy duty billet triple disk converter, Kevlar, heavy duty sprags(after the TC broke).
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-14-2018, 10:27 AM
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Do yourself a favor and do the belloewd up-pipe why you are at it. I would also go with a upgraded wheel and 360į kit in it. They are easy to build but can be a pain in the a** to reinstall. The key is to take your time and have an extra set of hands to help. I do one or to a year helping out friends and friends of friends. I always find that my truck is always the one that ends up being the biggest pain.

2002 f250 7.3 4x4 256,000miles. Bone stock other than hutch mode and edge evo programer I use for gadges most of the time. I also have air bags on back for towing.
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-14-2018, 12:26 PM
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Doing the bellowed up-pipes at the same time is great if you can swing it. I got the Dorman brand from Amazon and they've been great. Much cheaper than International ones.

Aligning the up-pipes with the connection at the rear of the turbo will be your greatest headache and it's almost impossible to do if the up-pipe clamps are tight. The most important tip IMO is to loosen the up-pipe clamp bolts at the bottom where they connect to the header so you can move the up-pipes around a bit. This will make aligning them with the turbo possible. When you're ready to install, finagle the new turbo onto the pedestal, make sure the orings are in place, then LOOSELY install the (2) turbo mounting bolts (tight enough that the orings can't slip out, but loose enough that it moves easily). Then work on getting the up-pipes connected to the turbo. It's a real pain getting it all aligned, then holding it in place while you try to slip the clamp on. Once you get that done, the worst part is over. Get the exhaust connected to the turbo and then you can tighten all the loose bolts down.

IMPORTANT: Some people are recommending you upgrade the compressor wheel. A few weeks ago, I would have said the same thing, but now I'd NEVER do it. I installed a 38R with Dieselsite's Wicked Wheel II a few years ago and it blew up 3 yrs later. I followed all of the instructions to the T and absolutely did NOT use an impact wrench to install the wheel, but it failed. After I posted my experience, a number of people said they had the same thing happen so I'd strongly recommend not "upgrading" the wheel unless you're willing to gamble with your new turbo. You can see the photos below of my failure.
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-14-2018, 06:37 PM
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Venom, Iíd heard from somewhere that the billet wheel with the 38R was not a dependable combination. My recommendation is a billet wheel in his stock turbo.

Jlee, I couldnít see your signature yesterday when I posted. Now that I see your setup Iím gonna again recommend looking at the stock turbo with billet wheel instead of the 38R. I ran a 38R for years and was just never happy with it. Of course at the time I didnít have the AIS so the 6613 filter made the turbo so much more obnoxious for noise. My truckís main purpose is to tow. I feel the 38R was very top breathing, whereas the stock with billet wheel is suited more at mid range power. Iím very happy with my RRD wheel setup.

For the bellowed up pipes I used Alphadog on mine the. The cheapest on eBay ($70) when doing my dadís since he was running low on cash. Both have worked fine so far. I figured a failure on the up pipe would be a pain in the butt overall not such a big deal so a place to save money.

The hardest part for me seems to be getting the marmon clamp off the back of the turbo. That doggone thing sticks and thereís not any angle to get on it to give it a whack.

On the install make certain you get the ďbaby buttĒ seated correctly. Iíve seen a lot of posts where folks have missed the locating pin. Youíre working on it blind so I can see how that could happen.

Good luck with your install.

01 F250 Auto, PHP Hydra, 4" SS Magnaflow Exhaust, AIS Filter, Edge Insight w/ backup camera, Autometer Sport Comp II Boost gauge, stock turbo w/ RRD billet wheel, Turbomaster wastegate controller, EBPV delete pedestal, 6.0L Trans cooler, Transgo tugger shift kit. Trans rebuilt in 2014 w/ heavy duty billet triple disk converter, Kevlar, heavy duty sprags(after the TC broke).
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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-14-2018, 06:52 PM
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Venom, Iíd heard from somewhere that the billet wheel with the 38R was not a dependable combination. My recommendation is a billet wheel in his stock turbo.

Jlee, I couldnít see your signature yesterday when I posted. Now that I see your setup Iím gonna again recommend looking at the stock turbo with billet wheel instead of the 38R. I ran a 38R for years and was just never happy with it. Of course at the time I didnít have the AIS so the 6613 filter made the turbo so much more obnoxious for noise. My truckís main purpose is to tow. I feel the 38R was very top breathing, whereas the stock with billet wheel is suited more at mid range power. Iím very happy with my RRD wheel setup.

For the bellowed up pipes I used Alphadog on mine the. The cheapest on eBay ($70) when doing my dadís since he was running low on cash. Both have worked fine so far. I figured a failure on the up pipe would be a pain in the butt overall not such a big deal so a place to save money.

The hardest part for me seems to be getting the marmon clamp off the back of the turbo. That doggone thing sticks and thereís not any angle to get on it to give it a whack.

On the install make certain you get the ďbaby buttĒ seated correctly. Iíve seen a lot of posts where folks have missed the locating pin. Youíre working on it blind so I can see how that could happen.

Good luck with your install.

Jason, I can't comment on whether a billet failure is limited to only 38R turbos. I ran a billet in my stock setup for less than a year before installing the 38R. The billet solved the surge issues in the stock turbo, but I didn't see any improvement in pressure. I agree with you on the 38R. I did NOT see any improvement with the 38R; in fact, I think it is worse than the stock turbo. Now that my 38R is a dud, my stock turbo is back in so I'll see how it runs.
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-21-2018, 04:58 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks all for the helpful tips. I have no leaks from my up pipes, so for now I think I will leave them alone (probably regretfully). The main reason I went with the 38R was to reduce EGT, this hopefully will allow a little more pedal when needed. I tow a lot and always drive by my gauges. I have heard that a billet wheel needs to be balanced to the turbo or there is a possibility for failure. That is why I went with the setup that I bought.

2002 F250 Super Duty Crew Cab 7.3L Lariat 2WD 131,000mi; 4in turbo back custom exhaust, Garrett GTP38R turbo, Riffraff intercooler boots, Dorman Up-Pipes, Ford Severe Duty AIS, 31 row 6.0 transmission cooler, Scangauge II, ISSPRO EV2 Boost-EGT-Trans temp-Fuel pressure Gauges, DP T-5 Tuner (stock ,60HP tow, Decel, 60HP highway econo, 80HP city econo), Dieselsite coolant filtration, Max Air A/C mod, foglight mod, AIH delete, LED interior, back up camera, hid foglights.


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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 07-28-2018, 10:07 PM Thread Starter
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Install complete. What a pain in the arse putting the collector on the back of the turbo. I ended up purchasing new Dorman up pipes after taking off the old pipes. The old ones seemed to be kind of loose and the donuts were not really sealing as good as they should, but I had very little soot around the collector. I had several failed attempts to put the v clamp on the turbo. I ended up having the driver and passenger up pipes bolted on at the collector and leaving the bottom disconnected to give me the adjustments that I needed to get the pin and baby's butt lined up. I also used a piece of string around the pedestal around the back of the collector and over the top of the turbo to hold it together while I moved the clamp in place. I also put a zip tie on the bolt of the v clamp to keep it from moving when I was putting the nut on and tightening it.

2002 F250 Super Duty Crew Cab 7.3L Lariat 2WD 131,000mi; 4in turbo back custom exhaust, Garrett GTP38R turbo, Riffraff intercooler boots, Dorman Up-Pipes, Ford Severe Duty AIS, 31 row 6.0 transmission cooler, Scangauge II, ISSPRO EV2 Boost-EGT-Trans temp-Fuel pressure Gauges, DP T-5 Tuner (stock ,60HP tow, Decel, 60HP highway econo, 80HP city econo), Dieselsite coolant filtration, Max Air A/C mod, foglight mod, AIH delete, LED interior, back up camera, hid foglights.


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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-01-2018, 11:36 AM
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Install complete. What a pain in the arse putting the collector on the back of the turbo. I ended up purchasing new Dorman up pipes after taking off the old pipes. The old ones seemed to be kind of loose and the donuts were not really sealing as good as they should, but I had very little soot around the collector. I had several failed attempts to put the v clamp on the turbo. I ended up having the driver and passenger up pipes bolted on at the collector and leaving the bottom disconnected to give me the adjustments that I needed to get the pin and baby's butt lined up. I also used a piece of string around the pedestal around the back of the collector and over the top of the turbo to hold it together while I moved the clamp in place. I also put a zip tie on the bolt of the v clamp to keep it from moving when I was putting the nut on and tightening it.
Amen to the collector on the rear of the turbo sucking tail. I used the Dorman pipes also and they have been great.

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Blew the hot side Boot at the intercooler on the first test drive. Wow this thing seems to make some good and fast boost even on my stock tuner setting. Reconnected the boot and tightened it even more. I was afraid to tighten it to much and possibly crack the plastic on the IC, but then on inspection I see that they put a steel sleeve on the inside to prevent this. I also had to trim about 3/8in off the Riffraff boot because it seemed a bit long and was not allowing the spider to IC pipe to line up cleanly. Not really noticing any bad whistle noises that some people complain about with this turbo. Cant wait to try and tow the trailer. Wondering if I will need a boost fooler to keep defueling from happening when the PCM sees higher than 22psi. Have a call in to Jody at DP to find out if they change those settings in the program. Anyone have any input on this?
The whistle can be ignored to some extent, especially for us guys who like the sound, but my other half really hates it. As far as using tuning to remove the defueling issue, yes it's possible. Not sure whether DP does in their tunes, but I have Gearhead and PHP tunes (great tunes) and they do.
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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-02-2018, 02:24 PM Thread Starter
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Spoke with Jody Tipton from DP tuner. (great customer support) he told me that his tunes will not defuel until it sees 35psi. He advised that I will see an overboost voltage code at 23psi and if seeing a SES light becomes annoying a boost fooler would need to be installed.

2002 F250 Super Duty Crew Cab 7.3L Lariat 2WD 131,000mi; 4in turbo back custom exhaust, Garrett GTP38R turbo, Riffraff intercooler boots, Dorman Up-Pipes, Ford Severe Duty AIS, 31 row 6.0 transmission cooler, Scangauge II, ISSPRO EV2 Boost-EGT-Trans temp-Fuel pressure Gauges, DP T-5 Tuner (stock ,60HP tow, Decel, 60HP highway econo, 80HP city econo), Dieselsite coolant filtration, Max Air A/C mod, foglight mod, AIH delete, LED interior, back up camera, hid foglights.


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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-08-2018, 09:52 PM
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Glad to hear you got it all done. For some reason Iím not getting notifications about this thread so I had to stop by to check on your progress. I wouldnít have recommended the billet wheel so heavily if Iíd known youíd already purchased the 38R....

I see in your signature that youíre running the AIS. That should greatly help the turbo noise. The 6637 open filter with the 38R was just plain annoying. Iíve since switched the turbo and filter out and Iím liking the quiet. Guess Iím getting old. lol. Well our tow to the track did change from 1 hour to a 3 hour trip so that probably has a lot to do with my setup changes.

I know youíve gotten your answer about the over boost but Iíll share my info. Previously I ran a TW tune which would turn on the SES during semi hard acceleration but Iíve since switched to PHP tunes on the Hydra. It doesnít turn on the SES for overboost. Sometimes the light would get on my nerves but it wasnít a big deal. It went back out after a few minutes.

I see you have the 6.0 trans cooler. Thatís one of my favorite mods. It really brought my temps down.

I recently did the Hutch and Harpoon mod. Took most of Saturday by myself but I love being able to quickly fill it up completely and I think the pickup part of the mod made my engine run quieter. I swear itís not my imagination as my wife and dad both noticed it too. Iím guessing the fuel has less air in it now which has quieted it down.

Iím interested in hearing an update once you tow to get your feeling on your new turbo.
Happy towing!

01 F250 Auto, PHP Hydra, 4" SS Magnaflow Exhaust, AIS Filter, Edge Insight w/ backup camera, Autometer Sport Comp II Boost gauge, stock turbo w/ RRD billet wheel, Turbomaster wastegate controller, EBPV delete pedestal, 6.0L Trans cooler, Transgo tugger shift kit. Trans rebuilt in 2014 w/ heavy duty billet triple disk converter, Kevlar, heavy duty sprags(after the TC broke).
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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old 08-09-2018, 08:54 AM
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As far as balancing, the stock GTP38 can install a billet wheel when the wheel itself is balanced and nothing else changes. With the 38r, if you add a billet wheel, you have to get the whole rotating assembly balanced together as a unit. That is where most people have the problems destroying the turbo. If the whole assembly gets balanced, I don't think there is any issue with longevity, however most people still claim that performance is not improved or even worse with the billet wheel anyways.

Moral of the story: if buying a 38r, just accept it for what it is (which is much better than stock). If you want better than that, get a KC38r or go the T4 route.

2000 F-250 4x4 SuperCab Short Bed 7.3 w/ 280,xxx mi - 4" Pro Comp - Redhead - 37x12.50x17 BFG A/T KO - 3.73 Gears - CTS2 - Hydra - FFD 238cc/80%
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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-08-2018, 04:45 PM
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As far as balancing, the stock GTP38 can install a billet wheel when the wheel itself is balanced and nothing else changes. With the 38r, if you add a billet wheel, you have to get the whole rotating assembly balanced together as a unit. That is where most people have the problems destroying the turbo. If the whole assembly gets balanced, I don't think there is any issue with longevity, however most people still claim that performance is not improved or even worse with the billet wheel anyways.

Moral of the story: if buying a 38r, just accept it for what it is (which is much better than stock). If you want better than that, get a KC38r or go the T4 route.

Ran my original 38R for 14+ years and over 100k mi. Had a problem with the original, factory compressor impeller after that long.

Replaced it with a WW, and was ASSURED by the seller that NO BALANCING is required. I was assured that the wheel is "factory balanced", and the entire rotating assembly does NOT require a re-balance after installation. I then read through multiple posts on a couple forums (including here) where many people said "no balance required" when installing a new WW.
So (against my intuition) I went ahead and installed it. Everything went together fine, and the turbo went back on the truck. Ran it for about 3 months, primarily back and forth to work, and one desert trip.


The WW grenaded while leaving a stoplight (under light load) and destroyed the compressor housing.
I was able to limp it home...

DON'T CHANGE THE STOCK, 38R WHEEL!
There is absolutely NO reason to install an aftermarket wheel in an otherwise good 38R.

Furthermore, the belief that anything with "billet" on it is somehow better/stronger/lighter than something that is cast (and machined) is simply WRONG. If a "billet" compressor wheel was better/stronger than the cast & machined wheel, Garrett would be putting those in from the factory.

Long story long... if it ain't broke, don't fix it. If it is broke, replace it with an original part, not this crap sold as an "upgrade".

I was later informed by a local turbo shop that ALL of those aftermarket "billet" wheels are of Chinese manufacture, regardless of whom you buy it from. And, interestingly, the one I received did not say "Made in USA" anywhere on it, on the box, or on the "instruction sheet" enclosed with it (didn't say China either, but, usually US-made goods say "USA").

I have since replaced the whole turbo with a brand-new 38R. Should be good for another 100k+...


~Al
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