Injector knock (I think) - Page 2 - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
'99 & up Upgrades and Aftermarket - 7.3L Engine Upgrading or adding OEM or aftermarket equipment to your 1999-Up Super Duty or Excursion with 7.3L Power Stroke diesel engine. Please confine discussion of topics in this forum to those items that are specific to the 7.3L Power Stroke engine.

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post #16 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 04:09 PM Thread Starter
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I have the autoenginuity but I dont know if it will do what you ask. I'm still learning that thing, it does so much.
I will try to unplug the injector this weekend and try not to get shocked. I have been shocked by MSD 6AL before couple years ago.....Still recovering from that one.
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post #17 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-17-2017, 06:57 PM
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It should if you have the ford part not just obd2.

I use a flathead to take them off and on seen people do it with bear hands

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post #18 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-21-2017, 02:26 PM Thread Starter
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I have the Ford Mod for the autoenginuity. Still trying to figure out all what it does. The thing is a monster. I didnt get a chance to do the injector unplug last weekend....Life happened. Will try here in the next few days. Unless anyone out there can shed some light on some of the settings of auto enginuity
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post #19 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-21-2017, 04:18 PM
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If it has it look for a power balance test, engine balance, or contributing test it's faster than taking off the valve cover and doing it one by one.

Now the test says to do it when hot but if the motor acts up cold I start there and test while hot.

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post #20 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-21-2017, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by klhansen View Post
Justin,
The way I understand the IPR to work is that the duty cycle is the amount of time that the needle is closed. The signal pulses 12 V rapidly to the coil pushing the needle closed and then releasing it back open. So 65% duty cycle would be closed 65% of the time and open 35%, resulting in an overall modulating position of the needle with time. So if the duty cycle can go higher with a tune, then the needle would be closed a higher percentage of the time, resulting in higher HPOP pressure output. A test pigtail with 12V applied across the coil would result in a 100% duty cycle and max out the pressure that the HPOP can supply. That's what the service manual says, and this http://www.thedieselstop.com/faq/949...iagnostics.pdf also talks about how it works.
Please correct me if that's not right.
Kevin
Here is some information I have on the IPR that Patrick Feeley provided some time ago...

The IPR is an electronically controlled pilot operated pressure control valve. The basic components of the IPR are the: Body, Spool Valve, Spool Spring, Poppet, Push Pin, Armature, Solenoid, and Edge Filter (later ones don’t have the edge filter).

The IPR controls HPOP outlet pressure in a range between 450 and 3,000 psi. An electrical signal to the solenoid creates a magnetic field which applies a variable force on the poppet to control pressure.

OPERATION – Engine Off

With the engine off, the valve spool is held to the right by the return spring and the drain ports are closed.

OPERATION – Engine Start Up

Approximately 1,500 psi of oil pressure is required to start a relatively warm engine. If the engine is cold (coolant temperature below 32F), 3,000 psi of oil pressure is commanded by the PCM.

Oil flow through the IPR is as follows: Pump outlet pressure (red) enters the end of the body and a small amount of oil flows into the spool chamber through the pilot stage filter screen and control orifice in the end of the spool. The electronic signal causes the solenoid to generate a magnetic field which pushes the armature to the right. The armature exerts a force on the push pin and poppet holding the poppet closed allowing spool chamber pressure to build. The combination of spool spring force and spool chamber pressure hold the spool to the right closing the drain ports. All oil is directed to the pressure rail until the desired pressure is reached.

OPERATION – Engine Running

Once the engine starts, the PCM sends a signal to the IPR to give the rail pressure desired. The injection control pressure sensor (ICP) monitors actual gallery pressure. The PCM compares the actual rail pressure to the desired rail pressure and adjusts the signal to the IPR to obtain the desired rail pressure.

The actual oil flow through the IPR during engine operation is as follows: Pump outlet pressure (red) enters the end of the body and a small amount of oil flows into the spool chamber (orange) through the pilot stage filter and the control orifice in the spool. The pressure in the spool chamber is controlled by adjusting the position on the poppet and allowing it to bleed off some of the oil in the spool chamber. The position on the poppet is controlled by the strength of the magnetic field produced from the electrical signal from the PCM. The spool responds to pressure changes in the spool chamber (left side of the spool) by changing positions to maintain a force balance between the right and left side of the spool. The spool position determines how much area of the drain ports are open. The drain port open area directly affects how much oil is bled off from the pump outlet and directly affects rail pressure. The process of responding to pressure changes on either side of the spool occurs so rapidly that the spool is held in a partially open position and pump outlet pressure is closely controlled. The IPR allows infinitely variable control of pump outlet pressure between 450 psi and 3,000 psi.


So the duty cycle does not correlate to on/off time. It correlates to a magnetic force which is directly related to the position of the valve. At 65% duty cycle or more, the valve is in a location to pretty much block the drainage of oil.
post #21 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-21-2017, 10:11 PM
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So the duty cycle does not correlate to on/off time. It correlates to a magnetic force which is directly related to the position of the valve. At 65% duty cycle or more, the valve is in a location to pretty much block the drainage of oil.
But the magnetic field is controlled by the duty cycle of the 12V signal to the coil on the IPR valve. 65% duty cycle means that the coil is energized with 12V 65% of the time and de-energized 35% of the time. The on-off cycle happens very fast (haven't measured the frequency, but it's probably 10's of times per second) so what results is a fairly smooth effective signal. I can't say that 65% duty cycle equates to a fully closed IPR, but the amount of valve closure is proportional to the duty cycle signal (lower duty cycle = less valve closure and lower pressure, and higher duty cycle = more valve closure and higher pressure).

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post #22 of 28 (permalink) Old 03-10-2017, 03:04 PM
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You changed your fuel pump. But have you verified your pressure? What about the uptake in the tank. Screens clogged? Line cracked sucking air?

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post #23 of 28 (permalink) Old 03-13-2017, 11:52 PM Thread Starter
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Does the auto enginuity do the power balance test? Havn't had a chance to test the injectors yet. Turned stupid cold with snow from 70 degree weather. Welcome to Kansas.. Need to check the fuel pressure too. No one reants those things at least not for a diesel anyway.
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post #24 of 28 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 12:38 AM
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Does the auto enginuity do the power balance test? Havn't had a chance to test the injectors yet. Turned stupid cold with snow from 70 degree weather. Welcome to Kansas.. Need to check the fuel pressure too. No one reants those things at least not for a diesel anyway.
It will do CCT and PERDELS.


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post #25 of 28 (permalink) Old 03-15-2017, 11:16 AM Thread Starter
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Err ok sorry not sure what that is or how to do that. ArticDriver.
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post #26 of 28 (permalink) Old 03-15-2017, 08:23 PM
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CCT is a cylinder contribution test. PERDEL is percent deceleration from each cylinder. Both need to be done when the engine is at operating temperature. Both are variants of a power balance test.


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post #27 of 28 (permalink) Old 03-22-2017, 09:33 AM Thread Starter
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I will have to look for those tests. I will do that in the next day or two an report back what I find. Truck runs fine but dam that knock just isn't right.
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post #28 of 28 (permalink) Old 03-22-2017, 11:04 AM
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Unplug injectors one at a time and see if the knock goes away.
Or use AE to do it
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