Miss causing romping upon start up - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
Power Strokes 1994-1997 General Technical discussion of topics related to vehicles powered by the Power Stroke engine in 1994 through 1997 models.

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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-18-2018, 09:05 AM Thread Starter
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Miss causing romping upon start up

Firstly - I don't have any scanning abilities - I have a local mechanic that scans codes and etc. for me...


However, I like to get general possible issues for symptoms - from you guys before I simply allow him to tell me what the scans determine the proper "repair" will consist of.


I had an injector go bad last December (350,000 miles with stock / original injectors and etc.)
My mechanic replaced all 8 injectors with rebuilt ones, valve cover gasket / wiring, GP's, GPR and did a rebuild on the oil cooler due to a leak.


Truck has ran perfect (around 25,000 miles) until Friday. Drove 100 miles - shut it off for 15 minutes - and when I started it up - it "romped" like a cylinder (or more = entire bank maybe) was "missing". I reved it up to 1500RPM and it smoothed out - but back down to idle - it romped again. Reved it up to 2000RPM - and then it acted and ran perfectly normal.
However - a few miles farther away at another location - I shut it off for 30 minutes - and the above repeated.
And now - every time I shut it off and let the HP oil "drop" to zero - it romps when started - until I rev it up to around 2000RPM - then it runs like nothing happened.


It romps pretty hard like one entire bank is "out" - but I can move the harness connections on both banks with no change. I'm fairly sure it must be in the HP oil system because once I hit 2000RPM - something is happening to cure the issue - until I shut it off and restart.

I don't believe one injector o-ring could cause this severity of "romping" - and what are the odds of several injectors having this same "odd" issue simultaneously...?


However - is there something on the 2 - HP oil lines - feeding each knjector bank (o-ring / etc.) that might cause this type of issue?
(Like a leaking o-ring at "idle" pressure - but when 2000RPM is reached - the "leak / bypass" seals - until the oil pressure drops to zero when shutting it off.)


Any input is appreciated so I can compare to what my mechanic suggests.


Thanx!

2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT

Last edited by Audiowriter; 11-19-2018 at 05:13 AM.
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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-18-2018, 11:26 AM
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Could you video what's happening?

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1994 F350 7.3 PSD 4X4 ZF5 DUALLY
PHP HYDRA, 6637, 3-4 DP TO STRAIGHT 4 BEHIND THE TIRE, 1.0 EXHAUST HOUSING, DIY D66 TURBO, FUGA E-FUEL, EBPV DELETE. Cooper discoverer AT/3'S.

2010 VW JETTA TDI DSG Kerma tune. Hankook ventus v2 concept 2.


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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-19-2018, 05:06 PM Thread Starter
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Here a link to my youtube channel to a video of what it does.


2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT
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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-20-2018, 05:25 PM
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Just for giggles, try unplugging the icp sensor.

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1994 F350 7.3 PSD 4X4 ZF5 DUALLY
PHP HYDRA, 6637, 3-4 DP TO STRAIGHT 4 BEHIND THE TIRE, 1.0 EXHAUST HOUSING, DIY D66 TURBO, FUGA E-FUEL, EBPV DELETE. Cooper discoverer AT/3'S.

2010 VW JETTA TDI DSG Kerma tune. Hankook ventus v2 concept 2.


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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-20-2018, 07:56 PM Thread Starter
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Ok. I'll try that... 70jasprer.

My "mechanic" said the injectors have a 12 month or 12 K mile warranty - and I'm at 25,000 miles... XXXXXXXX on that...
and he thinks that I simply have a single injector "sticking" open.
He's pretty good with these motors - as far as my experience with him over the past 15 years or so...
He suggests that running some injector cleaner through the system will most likely clear up the problem.
However - I have a large auxiliary fuel tank hooked directly to my front truck tank (80 gallon) and I haven't used the smaller
rear truck tank for years -and it has had the same fuel in it for a long time.... so I am afraid to use it to "put the injector cleaner through" for a quicker, potential - "trial resolve".

I wonder if I pull the fuel filter - and remove half of the contents of the fuel bowl - then pour / mix into it - half of Lucas injector cleaner - if that will at least make a more intense - immediate impact on "de-gumming" the stuck injector as the fuel "cycles" back into the tank???
As I will also put an appropriate amount of injector cleaner in the main tank also........

I just don't want to get broke down far enough away from home where I'll get the BIG SCREW....

2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT
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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-20-2018, 10:11 PM
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Some trucks seem to do that upon a cold start. (Like actual below 0 cold start) Which shouldn't apply here.
Personally I don't think it's a injector hanging open.
You can try some injector cleaner though.

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PHP HYDRA, 6637, 3-4 DP TO STRAIGHT 4 BEHIND THE TIRE, 1.0 EXHAUST HOUSING, DIY D66 TURBO, FUGA E-FUEL, EBPV DELETE. Cooper discoverer AT/3'S.

2010 VW JETTA TDI DSG Kerma tune. Hankook ventus v2 concept 2.


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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-21-2018, 07:11 PM Thread Starter
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I unplugged the icp and started it up. CEL came on - but I still had the same romping miss as usual - I reved it up to 2000 rpm - and it straightened out - (purred like a kitten) The inside of the icp has oil in it - so I know its leaking.
But after shutting off the motor - then plugging the icp back in - it still romped the same (but the CEL light was OFF) and after reving it to 2000 rpm - it once again purred like a kitten...???

I put injector cleaner in it (1 and 1/2 bottles of lucas) we'll see if that helps.

I'm looking into buying a new icp because of the oil inside the connector...

2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT
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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-21-2018, 09:19 PM
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What oil are you running. The 7.3 can be oil sensitive. If you are running 15w-40 try something lighter.
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1999 F350 AUTO 4x4 CC LB DRW 4.10
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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-22-2018, 08:04 AM Thread Starter
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I have always run rotella-T 15W - 40 and haven't had any problems - well, that I know of.
The original set of injectors (changed at 350,000 miles) would romp slightly on extreme cold starts (below 30 degrees and plugged in) for a few seconds - it did that for years
until one injector completely failed - and then I had them all changed.
I'm due for an oil change in about 1500 miles anyway. If I don't get this figured out otherwise - what grade of oil should I try?
15W-30?

2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT
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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-22-2018, 11:10 AM
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5W-40.
It is possible it could be injectors.

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1994 F350 7.3 PSD 4X4 ZF5 DUALLY
PHP HYDRA, 6637, 3-4 DP TO STRAIGHT 4 BEHIND THE TIRE, 1.0 EXHAUST HOUSING, DIY D66 TURBO, FUGA E-FUEL, EBPV DELETE. Cooper discoverer AT/3'S.

2010 VW JETTA TDI DSG Kerma tune. Hankook ventus v2 concept 2.


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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-22-2018, 11:55 AM
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I had a 96 that had the elusive start and run fine but quit in 1/2 mile if not warmed up below 30 degrees and lower problem. I don't remember it romping at all. I even made Klhansen come over and pull codes with no luck. Our local go to shop guy said he would look at it but I should try changing to a lighter oil in the winter. So I went to Rotella 10w-30 and the problem went away completely!! I would go with the Rotella 10w-30 if you can find it, if not a synthetic 5w-40 should also work fine.

I reread your first post, this problem. This is happening after you have driven for a while so the oil should be hot and flowing well. I don't know if the lighter weight oil will help. Next time you drive and get the oil hot when you stop pull the dipstick and see if you have any bubbles on the dipstick (foaming) once again this would be fixed by a oil change of any weight. I would only do one thing at a time, injector cleaner or oil change then drive a while so you know what helped.

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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-23-2018, 06:12 AM Thread Starter
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Denny - The first time it "romped" upon start up - the oil was indeed hot -
However - since the "first incident" - it does it anytime I start it - cold, warm - or hot - every time I start it up.
I need to drive it to run the injector cleaner through - but I'm afraid to take it on any runs pulling the trailer - as my clients deliveries are quite time sensitive and a lot of my job security with them is the fact that I'm punctual. (That's why I have 2 trucks = if one truck shows the slightest potential for a breakdown - I swap until the problem is resolved...) I haven't had much time "off the clock" as I'm driving the back-up truck this past week - and haven't had time to drive this one to move some injector cleaner through the system.
I checked the oil that other day when this first happened - no foaming or etc. and the oil was full - and the fuel filter was quite clean.

2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT

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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-30-2018, 10:11 AM Thread Starter
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My mechanic pulled the codes - and the only code was the ICP. I changed the ICP and have driven it about hundred miles running injector cleaner through it. However, even before I changed the ICP (and even since I changed it) if I sit in park - and rev the engine up to 2000 RPM - it will quit romping and everything is fine and it purrs like a kitten - but if I rev it up to 2400 (or more) RPM - the overdrive light begins flashing - but it still purrs like a kitten until I shut it off - and start it again - and the above repeats???
Any ideas?

I'm uploading another video of my truck "romping" - and the OD flashing - after I changed the ICP. (I didn't change the connector yet - because the wires look good - but I suppose there could be oil up inside the actual connection housing) - I will change the connector today - but why would this cause the OD to flash?

BTW - a couple of months ago I made a 200 mile delivery in very hard rain. At one point my speedometer jumped around for a few seconds - then everything was fine. Then - after a few moments - the engine shut off for a split second - then came back on as if nothing happened. This hasn't happened since... However - a few times recently - when backing up or changing from drive to reverse (or reverse to drive) the ABS light will come on and stay on - until I shut off the motor and restart it - then everything seems normal again - all of this occurred since the rain storm and before the romping started.

Maybe I got water in the CPU? I'll have to pull it and check...

2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT

Last edited by Audiowriter; 11-30-2018 at 10:23 AM.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-30-2018, 07:00 PM Thread Starter
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Ok. After changing the ICP - today I changed out the connector too - (the odd wiring colors screwed me up - until I found the right "combination".........) and it still romped - and the OD light flashes when revving above 2200 RPM - in PARK. ---- BUT - when driving down the road - and making the motor hit 2900 RPM - the OD does NOT flash...
Below is the video of that romping and OD light issue dilemma in park...

However - after messing with it for a while - it completely quit running - will not start!!!!

I found out there is practically no pressure at the fuel pressure schrader valve - so I have taken the fuel pump out and am going to put a new one in tomorrow (or Sunday - depending on weather because the truck is "dead" outside of my shop and 100 % chance of rain tomorrow...)
(She has 385,000 miles right now - had the fuel pump replaced 2 years ago at 336,000 miles - and 50,000 on a pump is ok with me - been here - done this with fuel pumps at 50 - to 100K several times over the years) .................... However - the mechanic's "help apparently" - 2 years ago - must have jabbed a sharp "screwdriver" (or something into the rubber hose from the feed line from the fuel tanks - to the pump - because it has a "hole" in it!!!) I know better than to use something sharp to remove - or install - these short hoses from the fuel supply / or the bowl - onto the pump when installing one.......or removing one.............. So here I am........ Maybe this "little hole" has been a situation waiting to happen???

After I install the new fuel pump tomorrow (or when possible...) I'll update what happens.


I am hoping that the weak fuel pump is what caused the "romp" at start up - until I revved it up a little and got the pump to "work" - and now it's dead... (glad it happened here at home.....) - and I'm also hoping that the low fuel pressure at 2500 RPM is what is causing the OD light to flash ... I don't know why the OD light - and fuel pressure would be connected - but I'm going to find out if the pump is causing the romping - and maybe even the OD light issue.............


Maybe the low fuel pressure from the hole in the hose (X@#$%$#*&^ = = = mechanics...) and normal wear and tear on the pump caused some issues - in conjunction with the ICP leaking into the connector...

I'll BE BACK............

2 each - Stock - 97 F-350 7.3 PS 1 ton Duallys - RWD - AT

Last edited by Audiowriter; 11-30-2018 at 07:19 PM.
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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 12-01-2018, 12:33 AM
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Just a wild guess but maybe when your revving it that high in park itís building some high fluid pressures in the transmission that it doesnít like. When you cycle the key off it clears it out until the next time itís done. Be interesting to see if it does the same thing once you get your issue cleared up or if it was in neutral instead of park.

Hope your fuel pump clears up that romp and the trans light blink is a weird side effect of the revs in park.

1995 F350 CC dually, 5 speed, 2WD, 3.55 gear, 4Ē exhaust, e99 intake spyder and intercooler, DIY air filter mod, custom gauge pod with pyro, egt, and trans temp. 160 FF injectors, DP F6 w/40 tow, 80 tow, 80 dd, fast idle & exhaust brake, PTO w/hydraulic pump for custom tilt bed trailer and winch
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