Two good friends asked me this week, "would you spend the money for the diesel"? - Diesel Forum - TheDieselStop.com
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 07:43 AM Thread Starter
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Two good friends asked me this week, "would you spend the money for the diesel"?

I have two friends looking to buy new trucks and they both called me this week to ask if I would spend the money on a diesel these days. I have an 02 7.3 and would likely head south to find a decent 7.3 or 6.0 (which would then get bullet proofed) if my truck were to disappear. I am not sure I'd plunk down 75K on a new truck. But, these guys are going new and not sure if they want gas or diesel.
So far, my response to both was that I would go with gas unless they really need the towing capacity. I think they were looking for the fuel economy. Any idea what crew cab, short bed, 4x4s are getting for gas mileage vs fuel mileage? Any other words of wisdom that I can pass on? I am really not familiar with the new diesels. I hear the maintenance and potential costs are way worse than the 7.3. I searched and did not see a recent thread on this. I saw one from 2015 about the 6.2. Any thoughts on this? Thanks.

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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 10:17 AM
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I think you gave them good advice. It almost pains me to say it, but 3 of my 4 vehicles are diesel and I am not sure I will stick with it. These emissions systems are proving to be unreliable and expensive to repair after a certain amount of time. Which is to say, likely just out of warranty. I certainly have not had trouble with my 6.7, but I know it's day will come.

If they plan to pull loads of around 10k or more REGULARLY, then perhaps having the power of a diesel would be beneficial. However, if they don't pull that often, or that heavy, then a gasser might be the answer. That's not to say it will be trouble free, but it seems the emissions systems on the gassers have far less issues. They should look closely at the new 7.3L gasser. But I'd ride in both before I made the decision.

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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 04:03 PM
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My diesel has been trouble free as far as emissions goes. I have 64,000 miles on mine without a single issue. Diesels are expensive considering the 13 quarts of full synthetic oil that I use and the fuel filters on my truck are around $100. It's funny you may never have to change the fuel filter on a gas truck but on a diesel every 20/ 30,000 miles seems nuts to me and there are 2 of the damn things. I work my truck towing my 5th wheel so I work mine and I buy fuel all over the country and still not one issue. I have a 15 6.7. When I got my truck I knew I needed a diesel because a gas truck doesn't get near the fuel millage. I do see in some places diesel is cheaper than gas. Also a gas motor doesn't have neat the torque of the diesel. I pass gas trucks going up mountain passes all the time and I have the exhaust brake on the other side. I get around 12 towing my 13.000# 5th wheel. If your buddies just drive around town and get groceries in it than gas is there ticket. If they work there truck than they need a diesel. Diesel trucks hate commute traffic and stop lights.
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 06:17 PM
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It depends upon how much they want to tow. I would ask them that. The diesel tows a lot more (Around 35,000 lbs vs. only around 16,000 for the 2019 6.2l gas). I don't know if they are planning to go for 2019 or 2020. For 2020, there are 10 speed transmissions vs. 6 speed for 2019. Also, the new 7.3L gas will be available in 2020 (Up to around 21,000 lbs towing). The purchase price and operating costs will be higher for the diesel.

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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 10-31-2019, 10:54 AM
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These guys above have all said it well, to answer more of your questions.

Driving on highway with stop and go traffic, I usually get around 15mpg.

Driving 85-90 mph I see about 10-12 mpg.

100% Texas highway(Dallas,Austin,San Antonio and Laredo) unloaded @ 75-80 mph I get 15-17mpg

100% Texas highway unloaded @65 mph I get 20-21.5 mpg.

14-16k loaded trailer @ 75-80 mph I get 12-14mpg

14-16k loaded trailer @ 60-65 mph I get 14.5-15.5 mpg

10k 33ft camper from Tx to Fl @ 75mph I get 8.9-10.2 mpg

10k 33ft camper from Tx to Fl @ 65mph I get 11-12 mpg


Ive never towed or driven in Mountains so can't comment on this results but all numbers above have been made numerous times and my mpg are repeated results. I drive with a light foot and always anticipate the road ahead, I keep the live fuel economy gauge on dash cluster in 20-30mpg as much as possible while maintaining speed. lol.... As you can see, keeping the rpms around 1800rpm(65mph) really improves economy. My truck is a 2017 with 92k on the clock, Ive had zero issues with the truck and do some towing. I am watching closely to see results of the new 7.3 gasser.operational exposes are much higher and unleaded fuel is much lower.
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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 11-01-2019, 09:02 PM
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My NEW truck - - 30 days old

I now have 1,250 miles on my 30 day old 6.7 crew cab 4x4.

Sticker on it was $63,500 ... I got it for $56,000 with nice options. I opted for a 10yr/100k mile extended warranty and got it for $2501.

made the deal on Sept 30 - the last day of the month and last day of the quarter.

I get around 13 mpg in town.

I just got back from a long drive (280 miles one-way) that included mountains and flatland. I averaged around 75 mph running the A/C the entire way and averaged 17.4 mpg.

How long will they have the truck? I plan on 15+ years so I went diesel.

Ford is coming out with a new gas engine. It's a 7.3 push-rod design. Google Ford Godzilla for details. It's replacing the v-10.

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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 04:29 PM
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Two factors decide which is more economical, IE Cost per mile. How many miles driven per year, and how many of those miles are towing. Since the 7.3 has not hit the lots yet and we have no idea what the MPG will be with them, put that one aside for comparison and stick to 6.2 vs 6.7.

If driven low miles per year, the 6.2 gasser will be more economical. Towing won't be as great and MPG will be much lower, but it will be less expensive to operate.

If driven a lot of miles, and do a lot of towing, then the Diesel will bring in a better CPM even with the larger maintenance costs. Based on 7500 mile change intervals, the diesel may cost a little more per change, as well as the filter costs, however, with a lot of miles driven, and fuel costs starting to be within .20 of regular unleaded now, that 5 MPG difference unloaded adds up. Even if the 6.2 gets 10 MPG towing, that 2-3 MPG difference towing adds up, and in the end can be a wash, or a savings.

I've run these comparisons several times and CPM between the two always favors the diesel when a lot of miles are driven. A lot being anything above 33K a year. Anything between 25 & 30K becomes a wash and below 25K the gas becomes favorable. More savings can be had if the maintenance is DIY.

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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 11-06-2019, 11:56 PM
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Something else that is CRUCIAL: will they regularly operate the vehicle for short trips? The reality is that 3/4 or 1 ton pickups have diesel engines that take a few miles to warm up and then a couple dozen more miles for the exhaust emissions hardware to warm up and then do their jobs and then only if the truck is driven at interstate highway speeds. Persons that drive 4 miles of city streets as their regular drive to work will have issues with every one of the brands due to insufficient operation to enable the emissions system time to work. Warranty does not cover the one hour of shop labor (or more) that will be charged to run a stationary cleaning cycle when the usage of the vehicle does not allow the system to accomplish the task passively. This is a bigger problem for cold weather climates like New York.

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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 11-07-2019, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clydesdale View Post
I have two friends looking to buy new trucks and they both called me this week to ask if I would spend the money on a diesel these days. I have an 02 7.3 and would likely head south to find a decent 7.3 or 6.0 (which would then get bullet proofed) if my truck were to disappear. I am not sure I'd plunk down 75K on a new truck. But, these guys are going new and not sure if they want gas or diesel.
So far, my response to both was that I would go with gas unless they really need the towing capacity. I think they were looking for the fuel economy. Any idea what crew cab, short bed, 4x4s are getting for gas mileage vs fuel mileage? Any other words of wisdom that I can pass on? I am really not familiar with the new diesels. I hear the maintenance and potential costs are way worse than the 7.3. I searched and did not see a recent thread on this. I saw one from 2015 about the 6.2. Any thoughts on this? Thanks.
Hard to compare a 20 year old trucks. The 7.3l TD is a good solid motor. The 6.7l TD IMO will be and is becoming the "new" 7.3l. Lots of emissions differences, etc. and yes some people like myself will lay down 60gs for a new truck but I plan to keep it for 8-10 years, if not more. If they can wait I would get the 7.3l gas motor Ford is releasing 2020 Great HP and low end Torque for pulling if I wre tgo get back to gass motors. Not sure about MPG's but I would assume 10-12 city and 5-8 when pulling heavier trailer. This is very specific purchase. I had a gasser and pulled my trailer and 2 days later traded it in for this diesel. Ive owned good share of diesels and once you get one and you tow with it is hard to go back. My 6.4l HEMI averaged 10-11 city and 5 when pulling. This rig gets 14 town and 19-20 highway and 10-11 towing. I love these debates! Let us know what they decide.
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