3306 Cat vs L10 Cummins
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I hope it's flat where you live, no hills!! I have a 300 hp in my single axle Mack. Most tandems and tri-axles around here are running at least 400 hp engines. but with that said, I know the L-10 is a really good engine, I don't know much about the 3306. you can get away with a lower HP engine if you have more gears, say a 13 or 15 speed.
The 3306 is a good engine which it looks like you already know with that old 235. The engine prolly still runs great but the hydrolics are getting bad by now right? A lot of equipment has the 3306 and theyre all good running machines. I would go for the Cat engine since you already have Cat equipment so you have more of the same stuff. Thats just me though...
Chris
Chris
Where I work we have a '90 International tandem dump with a 3306. It moves along fairly well, but not near as well as the Ford tandem and triaxle with the 3406 Cats. I have no experience with the L10. As for the Tranny, I think you will like the 8LL.
Stephen
Stephen
opt for the L10. We have both in a few of our trucks. The L10's are 270 low flows, the 3306's are 300's. A 3306 needs a push to get a load moving where a L10 will pull it in 2 or 3 gears higher from a stop. Plus the cummins has a very simple fuel system that is cheap and very easy to crank up. The Cat is well... a Cat. Grab your wallet when you need parts. Both are good mid range engines and will serve you fine for a dump, although power will be shy if you want to pull a trailer to. Try and find a 13spd or at least a 10 if you can. You need about 400hp to pull an 8spd well, although there are many 300's out there with an 8. The big problem is the engines don't have the grunt to pull a hill in 8th, but you can't really drop a gear because most will only do about 45mph. in 7th. Big PITA on a highway.
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179 Posts
Ok - what about a L10 vs a 3406? me and my questions lol Found another truck I like 3406/8LL
What you guys are saying is what I heard when I bought my excavator. 3306 is a great engine, but not so good in a truck. Power delivery isnt smooth or something like that..
What you guys are saying is what I heard when I bought my excavator. 3306 is a great engine, but not so good in a truck. Power delivery isnt smooth or something like that..
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Guy thought it was 350. Sounded like a nice truck. Have not looked at it yet.
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I think you will be happy with the 350. It won't be the fastest truck around but assuming its geared right it should pull really well. What kind of truck is it?
Guy thought it was 350. Sounded like a nice truck. Have not looked at it yet.
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I think you will be happy with the 350. It won't be the fastest truck around but assuming its geared right it should pull really well. What kind of truck is it?
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Guy thought it was 350. Sounded like a nice truck. Have not looked at it yet.
Only bad thing about Cat engines is the parts are kinda $$$. And only Cat can do the the injection pump which is $$$$.
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the CAT 3406 is a whole class size bigger engine than the L10.
The L10 and 3306 are sort of light weights for a heavy truck.
The truck with the 3406 is going to have significant more TARE weight
than an L10 powered one.
It is a matter of preference: some people want the lightest weight truck possible so they can haul more, and others want a truck that goes like H--- and can't be broken.
If you build a truck with an L10, and light running gear and suspension you have saved a lot of weight which means you can haul a lot more before you have to pay to pass the scales.
If you go weigh the truck with the L10 or 3306 compared to the 3406 you will likely find a couple thousand lbs difference in tare weight.
The 3406 has always been on the heavy side and likely weighs 500 lbs
more than the L10 or 3306---but then its torque was so high for its day that you will find heavier everything else along with a bigger radiator.
Personally, I'm no fan of a flimsy truck just so it will haul more,
particularly in the old second hand market but there are trade offs to be made.
Guy thought it was 350. Sounded like a nice truck. Have not looked at it yet.
Only bad thing about Cat engines is the parts are kinda $$$. And only Cat can do the the injection pump which is $$$$.
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the CAT 3406 is a whole class size bigger engine than the L10.
The L10 and 3306 are sort of light weights for a heavy truck.
The truck with the 3406 is going to have significant more TARE weight
than an L10 powered one.
It is a matter of preference: some people want the lightest weight truck possible so they can haul more, and others want a truck that goes like H--- and can't be broken.
If you build a truck with an L10, and light running gear and suspension you have saved a lot of weight which means you can haul a lot more before you have to pay to pass the scales.
If you go weigh the truck with the L10 or 3306 compared to the 3406 you will likely find a couple thousand lbs difference in tare weight.
The 3406 has always been on the heavy side and likely weighs 500 lbs
more than the L10 or 3306---but then its torque was so high for its day that you will find heavier everything else along with a bigger radiator.
Personally, I'm no fan of a flimsy truck just so it will haul more,
particularly in the old second hand market but there are trade offs to be made.
Zrtman,
We also have a couple 3406's in our fleet, all in Ford L9000's. A couple B's, a C and 1 E which I do not care for. Yes they are a whole different breed. Much more power and torque. That engine no matter the rating will pull an 8 spd with ease. Just depends on the application. If you are just after a 8 yrd or so truck and have no intentions of pulling a trailer, the mid range diesels are fine and will serve you well. Otherwise opt for the big blocks. Just keep in mind that the bigger power will cost you more than just fuel. Clutch, which although you can find a mid with a 15.5 which is a must! - most are 14 in the lower HP ratings, transmission, shafts and axles are all much more money.
Also a lot of transit mixers out there from 10+ years ago ran mostly L10 and M11 engines, so they are up to the task.
As for the injection pumps, there is no need to go to Cat for a rebuild. Many reputable rebuilders will take care of the job, but they are very expensive. The plus is they seldom fail.
We also have a couple 3406's in our fleet, all in Ford L9000's. A couple B's, a C and 1 E which I do not care for. Yes they are a whole different breed. Much more power and torque. That engine no matter the rating will pull an 8 spd with ease. Just depends on the application. If you are just after a 8 yrd or so truck and have no intentions of pulling a trailer, the mid range diesels are fine and will serve you well. Otherwise opt for the big blocks. Just keep in mind that the bigger power will cost you more than just fuel. Clutch, which although you can find a mid with a 15.5 which is a must! - most are 14 in the lower HP ratings, transmission, shafts and axles are all much more money.
Also a lot of transit mixers out there from 10+ years ago ran mostly L10 and M11 engines, so they are up to the task.
As for the injection pumps, there is no need to go to Cat for a rebuild. Many reputable rebuilders will take care of the job, but they are very expensive. The plus is they seldom fail.
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1,053 Posts
The 3406 will obviously have more power. It's a bigger engine with more displacement.
The 3306 is one of the most durable engines CAT ever made. I wouldn't have any reservations buying one of them.
The L10 is better than the engine that replaced it (M11), but I'd still get the CAT motor.
The 3306 is one of the most durable engines CAT ever made. I wouldn't have any reservations buying one of them.
The L10 is better than the engine that replaced it (M11), but I'd still get the CAT motor.
I'd run with the Cat too. Seems to me that the more equipment of the same brand you have, the lesser it will be when it comes time for repairs & maintenance, especially if you have a good dealer and you are in good standing with them.
The biggest plus for Cats here is that there is a Cat dealer 6 miles down the road, while the nearest Cummins dealer is a good 20 miles. Comes in handy when you're doing your own repairs.
Don't know much about the 33/3406 myself, our largest truck runs a 3208, but I'm sure the 3406 would be more satisfying to drive down the road knowing you can pull that next hill without downshifting 2 gears.
The biggest plus for Cats here is that there is a Cat dealer 6 miles down the road, while the nearest Cummins dealer is a good 20 miles. Comes in handy when you're doing your own repairs.
Don't know much about the 33/3406 myself, our largest truck runs a 3208, but I'm sure the 3406 would be more satisfying to drive down the road knowing you can pull that next hill without downshifting 2 gears.
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Don't know much about the 33/3406 myself, our largest truck runs a 3208, but I'm sure the 3406 would be more satisfying to drive down the road knowing you can pull that next hill without downshifting 2 gears.
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Well, I'm driving a 3406B set at 425. what makes sense is really
how much load you put on it. If you aren't going to pull a trailer
is is sort of overkill. Recently I ventured out trying out Oregon's 'log truck doubles' --- a stinger steered western log trailer, followed by a 4 wheel wagon. The length is astonishing (you are allowed 68feet from the front bunk to the back of the 2nd trailer) with a gross to 105.5k.
With the stinger steering combination handles well and tracks nicely even down a crooked county road, but it really craps out on the hills.
You are down to 22 MPH on a 6% grade. --- about where L10's end up
with 80k. thish is 5-6 mph less than I can get with loads under 90k.
Don't know much about the 33/3406 myself, our largest truck runs a 3208, but I'm sure the 3406 would be more satisfying to drive down the road knowing you can pull that next hill without downshifting 2 gears.
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Well, I'm driving a 3406B set at 425. what makes sense is really
how much load you put on it. If you aren't going to pull a trailer
is is sort of overkill. Recently I ventured out trying out Oregon's 'log truck doubles' --- a stinger steered western log trailer, followed by a 4 wheel wagon. The length is astonishing (you are allowed 68feet from the front bunk to the back of the 2nd trailer) with a gross to 105.5k.
With the stinger steering combination handles well and tracks nicely even down a crooked county road, but it really craps out on the hills.
You are down to 22 MPH on a 6% grade. --- about where L10's end up
with 80k. thish is 5-6 mph less than I can get with loads under 90k.
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179 Posts
Our local Cat dealer Milton Cat is awesome. I am just a little part timer, and they treat me like I spend millions with them. I asked why the take the time with little guys like me... they say lots of little guys become big guys. It nice that they realize that fact.
Most of the trucks I look at have 5.29? gears.
It funny - I look at newer dumps and they are into 400+ hp. But even the late 90's mixer chassis still only have 300hp. Any idea why?
Ok one more question - are 44k rears much different than 46k rears?
Sorry hungry for knowledge!
Most of the trucks I look at have 5.29? gears.
It funny - I look at newer dumps and they are into 400+ hp. But even the late 90's mixer chassis still only have 300hp. Any idea why?
Ok one more question - are 44k rears much different than 46k rears?
Sorry hungry for knowledge!
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6,940 Posts
A lot of mixers and off road dumps have low horsepower engines so the drivers won't tear them up so bad when they go into the rough stuff.
Birken
Birken
[ QUOTE ]
Our local Cat dealer Milton Cat is awesome. I am just a little part timer, and they treat me like I spend millions with them. I asked why the take the time with little guys like me... they say lots of little guys become big guys. It nice that they realize that fact.
Most of the trucks I look at have 5.29? gears.
It funny - I look at newer dumps and they are into 400+ hp. But even the late 90's mixer chassis still only have 300hp. Any idea why?
Ok one more question - are 44k rears much different than 46k rears?
Sorry hungry for knowledge!
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I would assign 2 reasons:
a) Fleet mentality. Trucks purchased to be driven by someone else always look different from owner operator trucks. A mixer truck isn't going to deliver any more loads of mix in a day with 400 hp than 300 hp so why spend the extra $$$ just to have a truck that won't haul as much concrete because it is heavier?
b) mixer trucks don't drag trailers. Most dump trucks these days are equipped to pull a pup or transfer trailer or at the least,
an equipment trailer. --- and there are a lot of owner operators
of dump trucks.
Our local Cat dealer Milton Cat is awesome. I am just a little part timer, and they treat me like I spend millions with them. I asked why the take the time with little guys like me... they say lots of little guys become big guys. It nice that they realize that fact.
Most of the trucks I look at have 5.29? gears.
It funny - I look at newer dumps and they are into 400+ hp. But even the late 90's mixer chassis still only have 300hp. Any idea why?
Ok one more question - are 44k rears much different than 46k rears?
Sorry hungry for knowledge!
[/ QUOTE ]
I would assign 2 reasons:
a) Fleet mentality. Trucks purchased to be driven by someone else always look different from owner operator trucks. A mixer truck isn't going to deliver any more loads of mix in a day with 400 hp than 300 hp so why spend the extra $$$ just to have a truck that won't haul as much concrete because it is heavier?
b) mixer trucks don't drag trailers. Most dump trucks these days are equipped to pull a pup or transfer trailer or at the least,
an equipment trailer. --- and there are a lot of owner operators
of dump trucks.
[ QUOTE ]
Our local Cat dealer Milton Cat is awesome. I am just a little part timer, and they treat me like I spend millions with them. I asked why the take the time with little guys like me... they say lots of little guys become big guys. It nice that they realize that fact.
[/ QUOTE ]
Shortly after i bought an old Kenworth with a 1693 cat in it ( yea that was a few years back
I stopped in a cat dealer for a few parts. The service manager took me aside and asked if it was my first cat, when I told him yes, the guy took about 45 minuits out of his day ( and i had not bought the thing from them, I didn't even live anywhere near them ) and went over the thing with me pointing out all the things to take care of and how and exactly how to run the thing to keep from tearing it up. He said he didn't mind selling me parts, but he dang sure didn't like selling them before they should be needed. Incredable service, I found that at other cat dealers as well. That engine went over a million miles.
That said, the early L10 was no powerhouse, but I hauled steel in the mountains for awhile with one, first time I took it out, after a day running around, I put it in the shop because I thought the fuel gauge was broken, it wasn't, the thing just got great fuel milage
--------Robert
Our local Cat dealer Milton Cat is awesome. I am just a little part timer, and they treat me like I spend millions with them. I asked why the take the time with little guys like me... they say lots of little guys become big guys. It nice that they realize that fact.
[/ QUOTE ]
Shortly after i bought an old Kenworth with a 1693 cat in it ( yea that was a few years back
I stopped in a cat dealer for a few parts. The service manager took me aside and asked if it was my first cat, when I told him yes, the guy took about 45 minuits out of his day ( and i had not bought the thing from them, I didn't even live anywhere near them ) and went over the thing with me pointing out all the things to take care of and how and exactly how to run the thing to keep from tearing it up. He said he didn't mind selling me parts, but he dang sure didn't like selling them before they should be needed. Incredable service, I found that at other cat dealers as well. That engine went over a million miles.That said, the early L10 was no powerhouse, but I hauled steel in the mountains for awhile with one, first time I took it out, after a day running around, I put it in the shop because I thought the fuel gauge was broken, it wasn't, the thing just got great fuel milage
--------Robert
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I run a very high mileage 3306 in a single axle western star plow truck. Its been VERY reliable!! Smooth running, not much turbo lag, EGTS don't sky rocket even though it smokes quite a bit when its beign lugged at all....
It has a 10 speed behind it and its never the first to the top of the hill but it always gets there, loaded or otherwise. We use Howes for lubricity and have never had injection pump issues with it yet.
We have a couple L10's and N-14's that spend much more time in the shop than the 3306.
We also have 4, DT446 IH motors that have been bulletproof!
It has a 10 speed behind it and its never the first to the top of the hill but it always gets there, loaded or otherwise. We use Howes for lubricity and have never had injection pump issues with it yet.
We have a couple L10's and N-14's that spend much more time in the shop than the 3306.
We also have 4, DT446 IH motors that have been bulletproof!
3306 cat
mine in my work truck has just over a million miles and takes an ass kicking well in an over the road truck its in a 98 peterbilt 320 vac truck and somehow keeps going...although till that turbo hits in it has no low end power hooked to an 8 speed...but for what it does it works good....probbably a better motor for a dozer or farm equipment where you can keep it dialed up all day....my next truck is gonna be a mack terapro with the mack mp8 motor
mine in my work truck has just over a million miles and takes an ass kicking well in an over the road truck its in a 98 peterbilt 320 vac truck and somehow keeps going...although till that turbo hits in it has no low end power hooked to an 8 speed...but for what it does it works good....probbably a better motor for a dozer or farm equipment where you can keep it dialed up all day....my next truck is gonna be a mack terapro with the mack mp8 motor
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