[mobius i]

Bought a 2005 6.0 about a year ago that needed work. HPOP, alternator, batteries, and about a hundred other little things, and I have it running and almost ready to sell. I can't tell you how this forum has saved me more than once! Thanks, guys.

I cleaned the turbo according to the DTS article that describes the procedure, and then went on a trip through southern Kentucky and on across Missouri. The first 800 miles the truck ran flawlessly, and with every mile, my chest got more an more puffed up with pride that she was running so well.

After leaving Kansas City to head north into Iowa, my truck died on me while going up the interstate. 75mph in the passing lane, and everything shut down - steering, breaks, everything. I shifted to neutral, coasted to the side and let her sit for a minute before firing her back up and heading on my way. This wasn't the first time this had happened, but since then I'd done a little search on TDS and found that fuel filters not being changed can cause this, and I changed them. Since then about a thousand miles had gone by and no problems. This happened twice more on my trip to Iowa, and the first chance I got to get a diagnostic computer on it, I did. They tell me the FICM is bad. They pulled a couple of low fuel codes, a "FICM software incompatible code" and a "turbo underboost" code. They want 1000 dollars for a new FICM (or more) and I ask them where I can get it flashed. FICM is a 2004 in a 2005 pickup and I figure it's just a software issue that can be fixed with a flash.

I went to a guy who flashed the FICM - no problems, but we couldn't figure out what the turbo underboost thing was - which is my question. The turbo is only getting to about 10 psi and just won't go any higher. Needless to say my high end power is really left wanting. We checked for cracks in the pipes or holes in the blue collars (recently replaced) and nothing.

He said to try the MAP sensor - he's seen it do some funny things. I got a new one at my local dealer (horribly overpriced, BTW) and no dice. So, today, I set aside the whole day, and take the turbo off and clean out again. Nothing inside would indicate that it was sticking - the vanes move smoothly and everything looks good - but I cleaned it anyway. I put it all back together and still nothing.

Does the turbo have any relationship to the FICM? I've tried the "03 turbo learn reprogram thingy" (found in THIS thread) to no avail, and am at my whits end with this stupid thing. I've had the turbo out three times now (twice to clean it) and it canNOT get above 10 PSI.

I could really use some suggestions - preferably ones that don't involve me throwing a lot of money at it.

I would think that I had done something to it when I cleaned the turbo the first time, but since it ran so well for over 800 miles in a week, I can't figure it out. When the FICM hiccupped, would it have caused some sort of "fail safe" mode for the turbo to enter into?

timeline:
last week of June - changed fuel filters and blue collars on turbo intake
first week of July - cleaned turbo and ran for 800 miles in about 4 days (ran great)
4th of July - FICM problems caused me to lose power while going down road, and Turbo underboost codes appear.
5th of July - Flashed the FICM at a different place, and checked the usual suspects for problems.
9th of July - pulled the turbo to clean again with no positive results

 

[OT]

Welcome M.

For starters (maybe long shot) if not done do this test cause I don't think a reflash will fix faulty/low voltage output. 6L FICM Testing/Removal (tks 2S) If it checks out ok then update & look for updates. Good luck!

 

[paintingman]

Look hear for a FICM some may say not eBay but i got a good deal on a new one and have no problem with it.

I'm not sure about the low boost but have you checked fuel pressure it should be 65+psi under 45psi is harmful to injectors and the FICM controls the injectors

ford 6.0 ficm | eBay

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=powerstroke+6.0+ficm&_sacat=0&_odkw=ford+6.0+ficm&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313

 

[ford_doctor]

I doubt that your turbo is the problem and since you went 800 miles after cleaning it the first time without issues that confirms this to me. An under-boost DTC can occur for many reasons and does not necessarily mean there is a problem with the turbo itself. For a turbo diesel to produce boost, everything else needs to be in proper working order. Your post suggests an intermittent issue.

Do you know exactly what codes were in the PCM?

When you say your truck died, did it slowly lose power and stall or did it shut off suddenly without warning?

 

[mobius i]

Thank ya'll for replying.

It died all of a sudden. Surprised the pants off of me.

Fuel pressure tests all come back good.

U0105 - Lost Communication with FICM
P0299 - Turbo Underboost
U0306 - Software Incompatible with FICM
P0460 - Fuel Level Sensor
P0463 - Fuel Level Sensor

 

[mobius i]

any other insight on this guys?

Just took it to a diesel injector shop, and they said that it's probably a bad turbo (talked about the small parts you don't get when you do the DIY cleaning). Can't tell if this is a turbo salesman telling me I need a new turbo, or if it's a guy who knows 6 liters that's telling me I need a new turbo.

 

[patrickrc51]

Your truck wont shut down on a bad turbo. The worst it will do is go into a low power mode until you restart it. Check your ground on the FICM.
P

 

[dieselmac]

I agree that the turbo is probably not your problem. Since the FICM replacement was the last thing done to the truck before the problem started, look there.

Have you checked your FICM voltage?

Check the 3 connectors on the bottom of the FICM. Pull them off and check for bent pins. When inserting them, make sure they are square and both sides click in. You wouldn't be the first who had gremlins caused by a connection problem.

Have you cleaned the EP sensor tube?

 

[speedrcr78]

For what is worth every time my truck has just shut off like someone flipped a switch, it was due to something electrical. For example I had a wire for the crank sensor chafing against the alternator.

 

[mobius i]

Fwiw, I really think the FICM flash/update fixed my dying problem. Thats not really what I'm concerned with. I only mention that because my turbo problems seemed to show up at the same time as the FICM problems.

My problem is turbo underboost. The problem doesn't seem mechanical, as I've torn it apart twice now to clean it and it seems solid. The problem seems electronic, almost like an electronic "limiter" or limp mode. I was wondering if this could be done by the FICM.

Eta: technician just came in and told me the FICM was completely up to date and showed no problems. Test driving it now. I'll keep you all posted for those who are invested here.

 

[TDIDog]

Speaking in a general manner here, the turbo vanes are moved by a hydraulic acturator and the actuator is controlled by a valve. If boost is actually low (has this been verified) then can the experienced guys pipe up about what goes into testing that side of the turbo actuator system?

 

[ford_doctor]

Experienced guy here... The VGT can be tested with accuracy with the IDS scan tool, the VMM and an position sensor that is installed onto the turbocharger. I use it regularly and it pretty much leaves no question as to whether the turbo is good or not.

 

[mobius i]

Alright guys: thank you all for the input, but I don't think I'm done here.

They test drove it with their computer hooked up and tried manually opening and closing the veins. They could only get them to max out at 13psi. Their diagnosis: turbo shot. Needs a new one. Of course they want me to dump 1600+ into it and they can work me in tomorrow to put one in that they have on hand. No sir.

They said something about the little linkage and the actuator arm and the solenoid.

Ive had this turbo out a lot, and feel I could get it out blindfolded. Do y'all think I can replace actuator arm, solenoid and any small parts myself? I can't seem to find a blown-up diagram to be able to judge for myself - nor directions on how to dig deeper into the turbo.

Advice oh wise and experienced ones?

 

[TDIDog]

It's odd that they are only telling you the amount of boost. I wouldn't be happy with just that information and I am far from wise or experienced with these engines. As the Dr. said, the turbo has a feed back sensor so the computer knows the position of the vanes. It also knows how much it is requesting of those vanes. If it's only requesting 13 PSI boost because of bad input from a sensor, then installing a turbo would be a waste.

Are you still getting the turbo underboost code?

 

[ford_doctor]

As the Dr. said, the turbo has a feed back sensor so the computer knows the position of the vanes

I really need to clarify this so that you all don't think that your turbos actually have this sensor installed on them. They do not. This is a sensor that is temporarily installed on the turbo and it is connected to our IDS computers. It is for testing only and is an essential service tool for diesel certified dealerships. Perhaps I need to write an article on this. I did a series of photos for a write up... I just never got around to writing the article.

To the OP: Boost is a product of everything that happens before the turbocharger and even after it. Anything that affects airflow or combustion from the intake, EGR, injection system, the electronics, fuel quality and the integrity of the exhaust between the cylinders and the turbo needs to be working properly. A restriction in the exhaust like a clogged or broken catalytic converter or bent pipe can cause low boost. I am not saying your turbo is good, or your turbo is bad. I simply mentioned the IDS VVT and boost tests as they will provide a reasonably accurate answer to that question before moving beyond the turbo or removing it for inspection or replacing any part of it. I suspect that this diagnostic sensor and the tests are grossly overlooked or ignored by technicians across the land.

 

[dieselmac]

I'm guessing they're talking about the pin or cam (or both) is worn. Do you remember what the slot looked like that the pin rides in? If it's worn you can definitely have problems. It should have straight, parallel sides. If it looks like a peanut, it's shot.

Not much in the turbo is individually serviceable. Off the top of my head you can get a unison ring, bearing assembly (I think), and Center Rotating Housing Assembly (CRHA). There may be something else I'm forgetting. But I'm pretty sure the pin is not individually serviceable.

And, IMO, there's a reason, even under warranty, Ford just replaces the entire turbo. Breaking one of these open and successfully rebuilding it is tough. They are sophisticated, very precise machines. When something spins 115,000+ RPM's, thousandths of an inch and proper balancing matter.

May be time to look at a PowerMax upgrade. $1250 and is a direct replacement for the stock.

 

[ford_doctor]

You are correct Sir, the cam is not serviceable.

 

[TDIDog]

I really need to clarify this so that you all don't think that your turbos actually have this sensor installed on them. They do not. This is a sensor that is temporarily installed on the turbo and it is connected to our IDS computers. It is for testing only and is an essential service tool for diesel certified dealerships. Perhaps I need to write an article on this. I did a series of photos for a write up... I just never got around to writing the article.

I stand corrected. (Well, actually, I'm sitting but -- well, nevermind.)

I bet if I had taken the time to figure out the acronyms, I wouldn't have jumped in so rashly.

Knowing how a good technician tests the turbo would be great knowledge, even for doggies that can't read. I look forward to hearing from you.

 

[dsltek]

Well put ford doctor well put...i agree...ive used it a few times n deffinantely helped with FIRTFT!