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Discussion Starter #1
Hi I’m new here and am really enjoying learning from your forums. I’m currently looking at purchasing a 2007 Ford F350. I am getting familiar with the upgrades and cost of doing a Bullet proof package. There is a shop nearby (Lewisville, TX) that specializes in doing their version of that upgrade called the Earthquake Package. I was wondering if anyone could tell me how that compares with the Bullet proof package (equal, less than, or like they claim-better).

In his website he lists the stage 3 earthquake package as:


  • EGR Delete or Bulletproof EGR (I still haven’t sorted out the difference and its importance)
  • ARP Head Studs
  • Blue Spring Upgrade
  • New Head Gaskets
  • New injector O rings
  • Replace Dummy Plugs
  • New Stand Pipes
  • New 6.4 Banjo Bolts
  • Coolant Filtration System
  • New high pressure pump STC fittings
  • Resurface and rebuild cylinder heads
  • Rocker Carrier gaskets
  • Steam intake
  • Split and clean turbo cases
  • New Oil cooler
My questions are:


  1. How does the earthquake package compare to the bulletproof upgrade? Is it equal, worse than, or superior to the bullet proof package?
  2. Stage 4 and 5 earthquake packages include turbo-back exhaust, and S&B cold air intake. How important are these upgrades for performance? The Craigslist ad says the truck has "Banks Custom Exhaust" and "Banks Custom Intake."
  3. The Craigslist ad for the truck mentions most of the upgrades from the earthquake package except for: New 6.4 Banjo Bolts, Coolant Filtration System, New high pressure pump STC fittings, Resurface and rebuild cylinder heads, and Rocker Carrier gaskets, but it does say the work on the truck included intake gaskets, rebuilt high pressure pump, machined cylinder heads and valves. Am I missing anything important from the earthquake package?
  4. The dealer said something about "programming" the engine for the best performance. What do I need for this?
I can post a link to the dealer's website describing the earthquake packages if it would help.

Thanks for your help!
 

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What are they charging for the package you are looking at? An EGR Delete removes the EGR Cooler from the motor and uses a bypass for coolant flow to be maintained. A Bulletproof EGR is an actual upgraded EGR Cooler from a company called Bulletproof Diesel (BPD). They are much more stout and reliable but with this setup you still have exhaust gasses flowing back through your intake.
 

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The earthquake package just sounds like it's just a different name for bullet proofed. From my understanding bulletproofed just means you fixed the most common problems with the engine.

Cold air intakes are garbage and they don't filter air very well. The stock air filter is good till 500hp and if you want to drop the air intake temps do the free Zoodad mod.

To program the engine you need an SCT programer and I highly recommend custom tunes.

The turbo back exhaust helps reduces back pressure.

If you have the OEM oil cooler I would recommend a coolant filter because it from clogging.

For the EGR delete or Bulletproofed EGR if you live in an emissions exempt part of the country I would delete it but if you don't just have your tuner keep it closed.

I hope that helps you.
 

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6.4 banjos are a bad idea. The 6.0 and 6.4 fuel systems are totally different. The 6.0 banjos have a check valve to prevent reversion pressure waves from traveling up stream in the fuel system and causing damage. The 6.4 banjos don't have these. There is no proven performance gain for the risk.

If you do decide to run a CAI then the S&B one is the only one I would run, but as stated they are worthless power wise below 500HP.
 

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6.4 banjos are a bad idea. The 6.0 and 6.4 fuel systems are totally different. The 6.0 banjos have a check valve to prevent reversion pressure waves from traveling up stream in the fuel system and causing damage. The 6.4 banjos don't have these. There is no proven performance gain for the risk.

If you do decide to run a CAI then the S&B one is the only one I would run, but as stated they are worthless power wise below 500HP.

Works great for me running roughly 620hp to fly wheel and ~ 495-500 to wheels


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Works great for me running roughly 620hp to fly wheel and ~ 495-500 to wheels


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What size injectors are you running?
 

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How much do they want for this "earthqake" upgrade? I went to a shop with my 2006 and they wanted $8000! I think I am going to adhere to the if it isn't broke don't fix it mindset. Unless you are pulling a 40' fifthwheel at 80miles an hour then I wouldn't worry about it. IMHO I think this is why most guys are pulling the studs out of their heads.
 

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Stock head fasteners are bolts, and that's part of the problem. The 6.0 head fastening system is a perfect storm of failure. There are only 10 head bolts per side, which has been an issue on every engine that has ever been built with that configuration trying to run forced induction (SBF, LS1, etc.) and those were gas engines with much lower cylinder pressures. Second, the TTY fasteners are basically pre-failed from the factory. A TTY bolt has been permanently distorted during installation. I could go into a three page dissertation on metallurgy here, or you could take my word for it that essentially damaging a fastener like this greatly reduces its fatigue life and ensures that it will fail in markedly fewer cycles than a bolt that hasn't been pre-stressed this way. Third, IH only planned on the 6.0 making about 250HP. This wasn't good enough for Ford, so they basically hot rodded the tune from the factory and added another 75HP. The engine's service life was designed around the lower power rating. E-series vans run tuning much closer to what IH wanted, and you'll notice very few failures on those engines, certainly exponentially lower than F-series trucks. All in all, every 6.0 out there is going to kick a HG at some point, when is anyone's guess. I've seen them go anywhere from 40k to 220k, but bottom line, they all fail eventually.

Plenty of guys run the 6.4 banjos without issue, or so they think. Its like the guy I knew who had a stock trans in his 5.0 running 10s. Did it hold up? Sure, for a while, but eventually it spit teeth like a 98lb hockey player. Play Russian roulette with your engine if you want. I won't, nor will I advise anyone else do it. The facts are out there if you look for them. When the injectors fire they create pressure waves in the fuel in the rails. The check valves in the 6.0 banjos are there to prevent these waves from flowing backwards in the system and stressing the pump. Low fuel pressure will wipe a set of injectors in literally seconds. So now you're looking at a fuel pump and a set of injectors to run a part that's never been proven to help the engine in any way, nor produce any additional power. Simply put, not worth the risk. If you want to modify the fuel system then return regulation is the way to go. Its overkill for stock injectors, but overkill is underrated.

Oh, and if you're running bigger injectors read the fine print in every injector shop's warranty for 6.0 injectors, you must convert to a return regulated fuel system, or when the injectors fail its on you. You might get away with it with 155s, but with anything bigger its a big no no.
 

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I wouldn't install an EGR delete at all. The Bulletproof Diesel EGR Cooler costs about the same and it keeps your truck legal. In California it is $2,500 a pop for deletes (and the same fine for DPF deletes as well).
 

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Good to know, but CA is also the only state I know of that would know that an EGR delete has been done. Few states smog check Diesels, and for those that do and EGFR delete wouldn't cause it to fail smog anyway. The EGR is not active at idle, which is where all the tests are done. Pre '06 you won't get a CEL with a delete, post you can can tune the CEL away. The only way to know there's an EGR delete would be a visual inspection, and thus far the only state I'd worry about that in is CA. No other state has techs trained enough to spot an EGR cooler.

Deleting the EGR cooler is about removing a potential failure point. The entire EGR system can cause problems on the 6.0, not just the cooler. A stuck valve can cause issues for example.

I too struggle with removing an emissions device designed to protect the environment, but the OEMs should have designed a system that wasn't so failure prone that it necessitates removal to have a reliable truck. Sadly when the realist and the idealist in me come to blows the realist wins more times than not. Unfortunately I take the world as it is, not how I'd like it to be.
 

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Good to know, but CA is also the only state I know of that would know that an EGR delete has been done. Few states smog check Diesels, and for those that do and EGFR delete wouldn't cause it to fail smog anyway. The EGR is not active at idle, which is where all the tests are done. Pre '06 you won't get a CEL with a delete, post you can can tune the CEL away. The only way to know there's an EGR delete would be a visual inspection, and thus far the only state I'd worry about that in is CA. No other state has techs trained enough to spot an EGR cooler.

Deleting the EGR cooler is about removing a potential failure point. The entire EGR system can cause problems on the 6.0, not just the cooler. A stuck valve can cause issues for example.

I too struggle with removing an emissions device designed to protect the environment, but the OEMs should have designed a system that wasn't so failure prone that it necessitates removal to have a reliable truck. Sadly when the realist and the idealist in me come to blows the realist wins more times than not. Unfortunately I take the world as it is, not how I'd like it to be.
I live in NV and we have visual inspection, along with dyno testing for emissions. They literally put the truck on a roller dyno with some sort of reader plugged into the OBD2. I can't remember if they actually hooked a sniffer up to the exhaust or not though. I'm pretty sure they did though and looked for exhaust opacity. It's definitely not as stringent as California, but close.
 

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Yesterday I took my Ex to a state approved inspection station. 15 min later I walked out after paying $7.50 for a safety inspection only. Thats all required for a diesel. My registration was $67. God Bless Texas!
 

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I live in NV and we have visual inspection, along with dyno testing for emissions. They literally put the truck on a roller dyno with some sort of reader plugged into the OBD2. I can't remember if they actually hooked a sniffer up to the exhaust or not though. I'm pretty sure they did though and looked for exhaust opacity. It's definitely not as stringent as California, but close.
Interesting, how do they test AWD vehicles?

Also, do you have an EGR cooler, and could they tell, or were they just looking for a cat and to see if there was anything obvious done under the hood?
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Thank you for all your replies. In answer to your questions: I'm not sure of the exact cost as it is wrapped into the purchase price of the vehicle. From the ad, they advertise from $3K to $5K depending on what level of earthquake package you get.

Here is the link Used 2007 Ford F-350 Super Duty King Ranch for sale in Lewisville, TX | Unique Motorsports to the truck I ended up purchasing it. (They are fixing up a few things-I pick it up next week:eek:hyeah:) They describe what's been done but it doesn't look like the entire bullet proofing or is it? I'd just like to make sure what's necessary is done.:thup:

A Bulletproof EGR is an actual upgraded EGR Cooler from a company called Bulletproof Diesel (BPD). They are much more stout and reliable but with this setup you still have exhaust gasses flowing back through your intake.
How can I tell which has been used? Do I need to worry about the exhaust gas back flow with this setup?

if you want to drop the air intake temps do the free Zoodad mod.
To program the engine you need an SCT programer and I highly recommend custom tunes.
The turbo back exhaust helps reduces back pressure.
If you have the OEM oil cooler I would recommend a coolant filter because it from clogging.
again-will I be able to see this from a visual inspection?I'm not familiar with a zoodad mod-what is this?

To program the engine you need an SCT programer and I highly recommend custom tunes]
Is this something anyone can do or only experienced mechanics?

What is the importance of CAI temps and what is S&B?

Again, totally a nooby, but very willing to learn. :read:Thanks again for your help.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Does anyone know of a good diesel mechanic in the Mckinney/Richardson area of Texas-especially one who works with bulletproofed engines?
 

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Thank you for all your replies. In answer to your questions: I'm not sure of the exact cost as it is wrapped into the purchase price of the vehicle. From the ad, they advertise from $3K to $5K depending on what level of earthquake package you get.

Here is the link Used 2007 Ford F-350 Super Duty King Ranch for sale in Lewisville, TX | Unique Motorsports to the truck I ended up purchasing it. (They are fixing up a few things-I pick it up next week:eek:hyeah:) They describe what's been done but it doesn't look like the entire bullet proofing or is it? I'd just like to make sure what's necessary is done.:thup:

How can I tell which has been used? Do I need to worry about the exhaust gas back flow with this setup?

again-will I be able to see this from a visual inspection?I'm not familiar with a zoodad mod-what is this?

Is this something anyone can do or only experienced mechanics?

What is the importance of CAI temps and what is S&B?

Again, totally a nooby, but very willing
learn. :read:Thanks again for your help.[/wow

Wow nice truck!!! I do think my 6.0 is much louder than 7.3 tho. S&b is a brand of cai's. Cai temps need to be worried about when you are putting down some decent numbers for hp (375+). It helps fuel economy, sound of engine, air flow , and overall performance. Any one can tune a vehicle but not every one can make the tunes. Look up on id YouTube channel sct and you will figure it all out. Custom tuning is basically what you want. Can tunes are peppy but custom is just right for you, your truck, and purpose along with upgrades done. I run quick tricks looney wild tune. It amazing I gain around 190rwhp and 290 lbs of torque. Cost me around 70$. But they are tons out there to choose from! Also recommend a coolant filter or a spare oem oc. Recommend muffler delete and ficm tuning also. Atlas 40 should do you right. Any other q's???



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Few states smog check Diesels, and for those that do and EGFR delete wouldn't cause it to fail smog anyway. The EGR is not active at idle, which is where all the tests are done. Pre '06 you won't get a CEL with a delete, post you can can tune the CEL away. The only way to know there's an EGR delete would be a visual inspection, and thus far the only state I'd worry about that in is CA. No other state has techs trained enough to spot an EGR cooler.
Um.. not attempting to be negative here, just stating first hand knowledge.
I have an early 05 with a deleted EGR that threw a code (CEL). Cleared it with SCT tunes. No codes for 6+ years now.

3 years ago, moved from NH to NJ, then last year moved to CT. CT does a "dyno emmissions" on diesels. Had to have mine done to get plates. They put my truck on rollers and stepped on it. I was behind the window, so no clue on RPMs or particulars. As mentioned, I have the EGR Delete and the SCT tuner, so I was concerned, but all is well, it passed. NH only does the idle emission test. Never changed my plates in NJ, so don't have first hand experience there.
 

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Its possible that the strategy in your truck was updated and caused it to throw a code. General consensus is that '05s won't throw a CEL with an EGR delete. Again, just general guidelines, even mass produced trucks have variances that they shouldn't. My '06 had 18mm head dowels despite every indication that they would be 20mm. I'm the original owner, so it isn't like someone before me did something I don't known about.
 

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Good to know, but CA is also the only state I know of that would know that an EGR delete has been done. Few states smog check Diesels, and for those that do and EGFR delete wouldn't cause it to fail smog anyway. The EGR is not active at idle, which is where all the tests are done. Pre '06 you won't get a CEL with a delete, post you can can tune the CEL away. The only way to know there's an EGR delete would be a visual inspection, and thus far the only state I'd worry about that in is CA. No other state has techs trained enough to spot an EGR cooler.

Deleting the EGR cooler is about removing a potential failure point. The entire EGR system can cause problems on the 6.0, not just the cooler. A stuck valve can cause issues for example.

I too struggle with removing an emissions device designed to protect the environment, but the OEMs should have designed a system that wasn't so failure prone that it necessitates removal to have a reliable truck. Sadly when the realist and the idealist in me come to blows the realist wins more times than not. Unfortunately I take the world as it is, not how I'd like it to be.
Nevada is one of the states that requires an annual SMOG check when renewing your registration.
 
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