[safflowerpower]

There is a trucking company who wants to make their own fuel, but I don't think they will be ready for ASTM standards for quite some time. They know they will have to meet all tax regulations, but what about ASTM. Please help.

 

[h2odrx]

From what i've read if they form a co-op and join with the NBB? the fees are not all that large and you can get a sample to test and meet the ASTM? Contact some co-op they might be able to help. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[DR435rider]

I'm interested in doing the same thing. I have the facilities to filter a lot of veggie. Others sell it for $1 a gallon. Can I sell filtered veggie as just that... 'filtered vegetable oil'? I won't call it a road fuel. It can be used in tractors and other off-road equipment.

Another thought is to let folks know they are buying an untaxed fuel. For them to use it on the highways they would need to pay the appropriate taxes.

I have a couple of fleets interested in buying waste veggie from me and blending their own biodiesel. Again, same questions. Can it be done without getting into hot water with the regulatory folks?

Todd T

 

[Ford_Forgotton]

I dont believe ASTM is a "required" certification. However, its nice to have to show you take pride in your fuel.

There is a guy in seattle selling filtered veggie oil for about 20 cents a gallon I believe.

Remember folks, filtered oil is just that. Filtered oil. Mixing it with diesel does not make it "Bio-Diesel". It just makes it diesel and filtered veggie. Still need to throw a little heat at it in my book.

Bio-diesel must be "made". I have a bad feeling that the media is confusing the two terms and leading people astray.

 

[frobozz]

If this fuel is for their own consumption, then they don't have to meet ASTM standards. They may be risking their engines and injector pumps, mind you, but that's their problem to deal with. And all the ASTM standard does is prove that the fuel was made right, which is important when selling it. If you make it yourself and you know you are doing it properly, actually testing to the standard isn't quite as critical.

Duncan

 

[Lee Haenschen]

If they blend it out so a safe ratio then they will be ok. The diesel fuel will act like a paint thinner and dilute the veggie part of the mix enough to make it safe to run through an injector pump. Once getting through the lines near the engine the heat of the engine will do the rest of the thinning.

 

[jdkline]

Depending on what type of trucks and fuel systems the ASTM standard may not be something they even need to worry about. If you exceed 440 gallons/quarter the taxman is gonna want his, but if you sell "filtered used veggie oil" not as a legal on road motor fuel but just as exactly what it is...filtered used vegoil..how can that be illegal?

 

[frobozz]

[ QUOTE ]
but if you sell "filtered used veggie oil" not as a legal on road motor fuel but just as exactly what it is...filtered used vegoil..how can that be illegal?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you know it's going to be used as an on road motor fuel, that's how! There's actually a catch-all in the motor fuel tax code to cover that. In fact, by one part of the code, B100 should be tax free because it contains no paraffin... but then the catch-all clause gets you, so you owe the tax after all.

Duncan

 

[TDISteve]

You don't need to do the ASTM tests if you are using it yourself. You do need to register with the EPA. Not doing so opens you up to HUGE fines, not somethng a business wants to do. The full battery of ASTM tests costs more than $1,000! Joining the NBB cost a minimum of $2500 but does get you acess to thier tier 1 and tier 2 emmisions data. If you are using the fuel in the comission of your business you can get a .50 per per gallon excise tax credit, $1.00 if you are using it agriculturally.

 

[a94cobra]

Two questions.

1) Where can you send a sample of fuel to get tested for ATSM standards?

2) If you use the WVO or homemaid Biodiesel in your own vehicles and never sell any to anyone, how would one ever know you arn't paying the road tax?

 

[Ford_Forgotton]

[ QUOTE ]
2) If you use the WVO or homemaid Biodiesel in your own vehicles and never sell any to anyone, how would one ever know you arn't paying the road tax?

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats currently kinda a "Dont ask, dont tell" policy. Its not for a lack of trying, some ppl have actually TRIED to pay road tax on their homemade fuel, but the different taxation depts either didnt have the forms, or didnt want to deal with it.

Even the states that claim to go after bio-diesel taxes dont always have the paperwork, the instructions, or the code to enforce it.

As "commercial" fuels approach ever higher costs, You can bet the states are going to stop turning a blind eye to the homebrewers and go after them very soon.

Solution? Tax yourself. Everytime you fill up, put the correct amount of "tax" into a piggybank somewhere and RESIST the urge to raid it. *IF* you ever get dinged, you will have a nice little kitty stashed away to take care of the bill.

 

[frobozz]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
2) If you use the WVO or homemaid Biodiesel in your own vehicles and never sell any to anyone, how would one ever know you arn't paying the road tax?

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats currently kinda a "Dont ask, dont tell" policy. Its not for a lack of trying, some ppl have actually TRIED to pay road tax on their homemade fuel, but the different taxation depts either didnt have the forms, or didnt want to deal with it.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's it precisely.

There was an article a year or two ago where the homebrewing contingent had gotten so large in England (they have a much higher population of diesel vehicles there, remember) that police were actually pulling over and fining drivers whose exhaust smelled too nice! (You can pretty easily tell when someone's running biodiesel.)

Duncan