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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Im doing the ccv mod and i stubled on a catch can thing on ebay. apperently its used in turbo aplications. Would it be a good idea to use this type of thing on a turbo diesel. I dont want to really build a catch can filter deal. it also routs the gasses into the intake like the old deal. i guess its like a filter. Anybody have any thoughts on using something like this? Also its like 15 bucks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Or they have similar things that you dont rout back to the intake but there is a filter on top and it vents to atmosphere. If it would work what would you choose? I guess i could get a hand on one of those pressure gauges (whatever its called) to make sure im not overpressurising the crank case. Anybody know how much pressure is to much?
 

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I just did a CCV Mod. on a 03 E-350 7.3 turbo. I don't know if they are all similar setups but I can tell you what I did. It didn't involve a catch can and it no longer sends the vaporous oil spray back into the intake either. That's Government EPA BS stuff that the manufactures had to comply with. And it may be something YOU have to worry about if you have a STATE or County government sticking it's protective nose into your business. As I have read....The International 444's just do it like they always have in the years gone by. Just route a hose down towards the bottom of the engine somewhere out of the way and let it vent to atmosphere. Your not going to run into over pressurized crankcase issues if you do it like that. You very well could have CC pressure issues if your "catch can" fills up with oil or water or dirt or anything else that might block up the venting of your CC. You also can run into problems if you try to route the hose to the rear of your vehicle and have a high spot either when you first do it or develop later when things bounce around. People have written about how bad it smells. My hose exits right to the rear of my drivers door on the bottom of the vehicle. I have yet to smell it. And yes it DOES have a very foul odor. Maybe more of a concern for those that drive into their garage and close the door. Also....Mine is NOT dripping oil all over the place (so far). It just blows a very slight bit of smoke. The advantage (I) have found is that it's that much easier/quick to take out the intake hose(s). And I expect there to be much less oil on the inside of the hoes''s as well. I can't see any good to having the inside of my intake hose's coated with an oily mess, Can you? I am neither a litter bug or a person that is anti environment. But NO ONE is going to convince me that these small amounts of CCV gases are of such a polluting nature that they need to be recirculated back into the intake air system to make a mess of it.
If you have the little (dog house) shaped thing on the drivers side valve cover (as mine does), you might find it works better if you take it off (2 long screws) and reinstall it so the CCV output nipple is aiming towards the rear. You will also probably want to have on hand some replacement o-rings for it. (1 1/4" ID x 1/8" thick or cross section as they call them). Just look at your local hardware store. They DON'T have to be the "special" Ford OEM "tapered fit" type like the originals. Why they didn't just use standard o-rings is a mystery to me. The 1/8" thick ones work better (IMHO).
Mine has only been done for a few weeks now but I foresee NO problems! Hopefully you can get by without any catch can stuff. It will be that much less complicated & probably a lot less chance of having some blockage build up that WOULD cause problems with pressure. If I could do it...Anyone can! Oh...I forgot to mention what is probably the more important part...Ya gotta block up the intake hole you create when you remove the CCV oil feedback line. I simply cut off the small CCV hose about an inch beyond the "nipple" that sticks into it from the intake side & found a steel plumbing plug that had a nice tight fit into the hose. Naturally I put a clamp on it as well. Used what was left of the OEM hose to reconnect to the "nipple" on the doghouse section and since the hose was already shaped with a pretty sharp corner in it , it served well to start the direction downward. Believe I stuck a 3/4 copper pipe 45 degree fitting as the way to attach some further hose to direct it downward. On mine it's a simple plastic connection piece that joins two sections of the larger intake air hose. This connection piece has the nipple for the CCV sticking out the side of it. It also has a metal bracket/brace that attaches to it that is secured at the other end to one of the valve cover studs with a second nut. I removed the bracket as well. It just seemed to be one more thing in the way and that took up time & effort every time you need to get into this area to service or clean or inspect something. The intake hose's seem thick & rigid enough on their own and seem well secured with the clamp on the turbo, 2 clamps on the plastic connection piece and one last clamp to the air filter housing. Hope this helps you decide what you are going to do. DDT
 

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Pretty much a no nonsense answer. Lol
My choice would be catch can back into the intake.
That ain't a bad price either.
Provent makes them also. But a lot more expensive.

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Make sure the fittings are at least 3/4". Usually those cheaper catch cans have 1/2" ports or something smaller than 3/4".

Here is what I run. Route it back to the intake.

 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks guys for all the info. I have decided to build one anyway out of some old stainless scrap i have. I will post up pictures when its finished. And if It becomes a hassle i will just run the hose under the truck and vent it to atmosphere. Which wont be a problem where i live.
 

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Not to sound like an environmental EPA Nightmare here.... But I thought the whole
purpose of doing CCV mods was to eliminate the feedback into the intake system
with the accompanying oil saturation and mess it makes?
Is the modification Justin shows above a means to eliminate the oil mess while
still being EPA friendly by rerouting the OEM output CCV via longer hose's to a
catch can (of whatever design) & then back UP to the OEM intake air to be burned
off in the combustion cycle?
I guess that's good for the environment and all but it seems to defeat the (reason)
I believe most guys are doing a CCV "Mods". And (maybe it's just me), but that's to get
the stuff out of the way OR should I say, permanently disconnected from the OEM
feedback and allow for ease of access and less time taking stuff apart & putting it back together.
Again, please don't get me wrong.....That looks like a real nice system Justin has designed. DDT
Guess you have to drain the catch can periodically into a "suitable" container & "properly"
dispose of the waste oil.
I guess my mind set is to REMOVE as much (stuff) as I can. Only ADD stuff if it makes
a needed or significant improvement. (coolant filters, trans. fluid filters, better trans. coolers...).
But that's just me.
 

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Because many times just doing a rdt leads to crankcase pressure.
Yes, they do have to be drained periodically. Some have been setup to actually drain back to the pan.

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Not to sound like an environmental EPA Nightmare here.... But I thought the whole
purpose of doing CCV mods was to eliminate the feedback into the intake system
with the accompanying oil saturation and mess it makes?
Is the modification Justin shows above a means to eliminate the oil mess while
still being EPA friendly by rerouting the OEM output CCV via longer hose's to a
catch can (of whatever design) & then back UP to the OEM intake air to be burned
off in the combustion cycle?
I guess that's good for the environment and all but it seems to defeat the (reason)
I believe most guys are doing a CCV "Mods". And (maybe it's just me), but that's to get
the stuff out of the way OR should I say, permanently disconnected from the OEM
feedback and allow for ease of access and less time taking stuff apart & putting it back together.
Again, please don't get me wrong.....That looks like a real nice system Justin has designed. DDT
Guess you have to drain the catch can periodically into a "suitable" container & "properly"
dispose of the waste oil.
I guess my mind set is to REMOVE as much (stuff) as I can. Only ADD stuff if it makes
a needed or significant improvement. (coolant filters, trans. fluid filters, better trans. coolers...).
But that's just me.
The catch can I run is a Mann Hummel Provent 200. It is a commercially produced CCV filtration system. Oily air enters the can, oil is caught by the filer, and the resulting dry air is returned back to the intake. You then just drain the can at normal intervals. This eliminates the oily mess normally found in the intake, and it keeps the CCV vapor/fumes from being dumped into atmosphere (this stuff stinks, and it is visible to the naked eye).
 

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Jasper.....What does rdt stand for? And why does it (many times) lead to crank case pressure? (an amount that I assume would be more than usual and cause leaks where you don't want them).
Justin.....Like I said....It looks like a real nice system. It's pretty obvious what it does/how it works.
And you are certainly correct....The crankcase fumes ARE smelly. Have you driven be a cow or pig farm recently or in the past?
Ever been within 4000 miles of a major volcanic eruption? There are LOTS more examples I could give but I think the point is made. There are all sorts of things (even naturally produced by mother earth) IN fact, MOST naturally produced by Mother Earth. And they are all Smelly & visible to the naked eye.
Again.....REAL NICE SYSTEM!
It's good that there are people to buy those systems and send the smelly gas back into the intake (presumably helping out the atmosphere). What comes out the tail pipe on that rig? Does it smell like Jasmin & fresh rose pedals in a flower garden?
Or is it kinda smelly like every diesel exhaust I have ever had the displeasure to stand next to? LOL
Hope you are taking this in the HUMOROUS nature I intend it to be taken. We all do what makes us feel good & sleep well at night. OR whatever we are FORCED to do to get by intrusive Govt. inspections/regulations.
As for me.....My next project is to figure out a way to make the end of that CCV hose position adjustable. So the next time I am out driving around, I can direct it into the 20 peoples open windows that are driving around with their heads up their........Looking down at their cell phones! Or maybe I can just make up some kind of James Bond 007 device that will spray used motor oil all over them when I move in front of them. LOL
I wouldn't have to write this obnoxious stuff it the things I said were not true. LOL...NOT! DDT
 

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Road draft tube. (The open ccv hose you talk about)
And yes, stock setup will create a just slight negative crankcase pressure. If you have a positive crankcase pressure, you will push oil out the crank seals, possibly oil pan.
Now this doesn't always happen. But that's a risk you take doing a ccv dump/rdt.

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Dont Knock my tig welding but heres the progress so far. I have got the breather bung welded in and the other end capped off. Now i just need to go find a drain plug and a 3/4 inlet. I plan on tapping an oil pan plug into the bottom.
 

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Thanks Jasper, That one (rdt) is not quite as common as the others we usually see on here.
I'm not arguing with you on the point but I have a hard time to believe a (short) run of open
tube from the CCV, as you refer to it a rdt, is going to ever (under normal circumstances) be the cause of positive CC pressure enough to ever cause leaks out crank seals or anywhere else.
I also must remember to take everything I read on here with a certain skepticism
Not saying you are ,but, you could be a full blown tree hugger...LOL.
But I will concede this point. Having now had the rdt for about 3 weeks, I have had a a few chances
to catch a whiff of it AND see the visible smoke. I'm not sure I want to go the whole catch can route
back to the intake. Maybe a catch can and a further extension out the back end of the vehicle might be in order. Now in that situation (long hose routing) I could see a possible over pressure issue. DDT
 

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More explanation.
You have yours ran straight down the side of the engine?

To avoid the smell, people will run them towards the back of the truck. Sometimes creating a low spot in the hose.
What happens is oil vapor will pool and cause a blockage.
Or moisture in there can freeze in winter time.

I'm not arguing anything in favor of the epa/environment. I drive a tuned vw. :flipa

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Ezactly Jasper:...I have read those same posts/CCV Mod design flaws. And I can see very easy how
people would do that and never think of what you described happening. It's also why I made mine
(for the time being), exit in a place it really should not (just rear of the drivers door). It's not just straight
down from the engine as I figured the smell would rise and find it's way into the cab. So I very cautiously
extended the hose towards the rear & out the side. Not wanting a long run to the rear of the vehicle for
the reasons you mention. Though I believe I will need to do something of that nature in the future as
there is no denying it is a very smelly vapor and does produce a visible smoke. I think a good design might be
to use maybe a PCV type pipe for the run to the rear of the vehicle BUT NOT have a tight (leak proof)
type connection up towards the front where you make the 90 degree turn. That way if (for whatever reason)
the long run of pipe to the rear should become clogged, There will still be a (release point) at the loose/open connection.
Hopefully when driving there would be created a rearward flow (maybe a low pressure area at the end of the tube) that
would draw the gas flow to the rear exit point & not tend to escape through the front open connection area?
That would solve for the clogged hose problem some must have run into. Or even a catch can much like Justin has shown
but on the output side have a 10" or so, pipe with a downward angle & then attach (if you want a sealed/clamped connection there)
and it can continue to the rear. BUT the can is not a filter and is open inside with small hole(s) drilled in the bottom as the "safety" to a
possibly clogged hose run to the rear. At which time it would essentially revert to being a rdt.
I only bother to mention these things because as I said before. I (think) most guys are doing a CCV Mod. to eliminate the
connections back to the air intake and the extra space that the hoses in that UPPER part of the engine bay occupy. That has
been what (I) have appreciated the most since disconnecting it. Now, pulling the big air intake tubing between the air filter housing
and the turbo is a quick & easy job. Of course I also did the resonator delete and removed a bracket. That was (my) reasons.
I hope Justin has not taken offense at my previous post. I was just fooling around and as I said.....I like that set-up he has. It's
just not for me or what I was looking to accomplish.
Also I write further on this subject because of (mis information) that is perceived when reading some of the short (not further explained) but well intention ed posts. Unfortunately, such is the case with one of (our) WELL RESPECTED sponsors/aftermarket sellers, on just this subject, CCV Mod. He has written in his advertisement/instructions for the CCV mod. An INCORRECTLY worded (or not explained correctly), sentence that leaves one thinking that if you do not route the disconnected CCV hose to "the rear" or a catch can as further described in his instructions...As you can read in the quote below, (pressurized & engine seal leakage will occur)...
"The 'doghouse' is the valve cover fitting that Ford uses to vent the engine gases to the intake. Even though the air intake fitting has been eliminated, the gasses from this fitting must be redirected to the rear of the truck otherwise the engine will become pressurized and will cause engine seal leakage".

Everyone should be let to understand that (IF YOU CHOOSE TO), a rdt (road draft tube), Straight down with no "high spots" will NOT cause over pressure in the Crank Case. And in fact is the LEAST LIKELY CCV Mod. to cause any CC pressure issues.
Not meaning to pick nits here BUT for those of us that are NOT diesel or even engine experts with years of experience, Little details like this are what lead people to do just the WRONG designs. It is NOT the above referenced persons design that is "wrong". Just a sentence in his instructions that perpetuate this MYTH that disconnecting the OEM CCV from it's OEM intake air port and blocking the INTAKE AIR port is going to cause CC pressure issues & oil leaks out of seals.
Smelly gas to atmosphere.....Yep.
A bit of oil that drips out the end of the tube.....Sure.
CC over- pressurization... Not a chance that I can see.
Now I suppose we are going to start to talk about Mud Dauber Bees or frozen snow drifts? LOL DDT
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
So you guys were talking about 3/4 heater hose. Is that 3/4 ID or OD?
 

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Generally hose is sold I.D.

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Alrighty thanks.
 

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Make sure the fittings are at least 3/4". Usually those cheaper catch cans have 1/2" ports or something smaller than 3/4".

Here is what I run. Route it back to the intake.

DP-Tuner...I have the same setup but I mounted mine inside the engine compartment. Is there room to change your filter or do you drop the whole thing to do it? And how often are you changing the filter?

Griz
 
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