[F250_Lab_Taxi]

Hey all. I have a 2004 6.0L and had an issue driving home from work last week. starting from a dead stop at a stop light (100+ degrees outside; dont know if that matters) my truck started sputtering as if it were going to die and white smoke came out of the engine compartment. After letting it sit for about 10 minutes all was fine and I drove it home. A friend said that the white smoke could be indicative of air is the gas. Well, im not even sure if this could be related but I thought I had better give the back story. On to the warranty issue:

My air filter housing and the hose/pipe that comes off the back (side closest to air filter monitor), the one that back towards the turbo, do not match up correctly. There appears to be at least a 0.5 inch gap on the inner side of the housing. I took it to ford and was told that this gap is normal. Actually, the service advisor snapped back with "If the gap isnt at least .63 inches, then we cant repair it." That .63 seemed so random and that is why i think they were trying to get out of a repair. Again, Im not sure, but being how hot it was and that the AC was on high I figured the truck would be sucking air like crazy and maybe that gap led to some malfunction where air was able to get into the fuel system.

Sorry this is so long, but I wasn't sure how else to explain it. Any advice/knowledge would be greatly appreciated. Oh, and we dont baby the truck. She tows quite often ;-)

 

[cmirabile]

I am kind of confused here, mabey it is just me.

There should be NO gaps in the air intake tubes. It needs to be completely sealed from the filter to the turbo. If it isn't, then it is letting in contaiminants. I'm not sure if this is what your talking about, so if you can, take some pictures. Sounds like you need a new dealer.

 

[texasrick]

There is a "gap" and I'm using this term loosely, between the plastic pieces of the air filter housing. The gasket still maintains a proper seal, but if you were to visually look at it, you'd think the housing mating surfaces may be out of line. From other posts regarding this, it seems to be part of the housing design and is considered normal.

 

[RoyC]

The following service message was sent out by FMC back in 2003 about your air filter.....

6.0 Air Cleaner Housing Appears Warped/Misaligned:
The appearance of a misaligned sealing surface between the air cleaner and mass air flow sensor is due to the design of the air induction system and the positioning of the clamps. The air cleaner should be sealed providing the gap is not greater than 16mm (5/8"). If the gap is greater than these measurments, attempt to reseat the air cleaner to the mass air flow sensor. If the gap is still too wide, replace the air filter element only.
Broadcast Message 0925, 1581, 3388


The reference to the MAF sensor is talking about the rear closure which has the MAF sensor mounted on it.

RoyC

 

[firesoutmatt]

[ QUOTE ]
"If the gap isnt at least .63 inches, then we cant repair it." That .63 seemed so random and that is why i think they were trying to get out of a repair. Again, Im not sure, but being how hot it was and that the AC was on high I figured the truck would be sucking air like crazy and maybe that gap led to some malfunction where air was able to get into the fuel system.

Sorry this is so long, but I wasn't sure how else to explain it. Any advice/knowledge would be greatly appreciated. Oh, and we dont baby the truck. She tows quite often ;-)

[/ QUOTE ]

I took me 3 times to read what you wrote and I think your not understanding how the fuel and air systems work on your truck. There is no way for air to be sucked into the fuel system by the air intake . The two systems are totaly differnt and how they work. Look over the 6.0 bible and this should help you understand how they work. The gap in the air filter housing should be like the others have posted and is considered normal as long as the filter is seated right. You have a differnt problem and isn't related to the air filter. I don't know who told you this but I would think the dealer whould have explained this you or maybe you didn't understand . /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shrug.gif Sounds like you may have a problem with the EGR valve instead. I would look for another dealer anyways because it seems they didn't know or didn't want to explain the differance.

 

[GrampyJim]

In addition to what others have replied.... you have misunderstood the context of what you have been told.... If the gap is less than 16mm, there is nothing that can be done under warranty. The condition is (as long as there are no tattletales inside the intake tube) normal.

I don't see white smoke being indicative of "air in the gas" though there will be lot's of running concerns. I'm assuming that you went to the dealer and requested a particular operation to be performed. I would suggest that you refrain from this practice and simply give a detailed account of the concern and any special circumstances that will help the tech recreate the concern easily.

 

[FMTRVT]

.... If the gap is less than 16mm, there is nothing that can be done under warranty. .......


Well, maybe not under warranty, but I don't trust that gap.

http://community.webshots.com/myphotos?a...security=rWfhsL

 

[Sydwaiz]

Gap looks to be around .725. Make em fix it.

 

[F250_Lab_Taxi]

FMTRVT: My Gap is about that size too.

Well, I guess I am confused. I was just trying to liken it to my dirt bike. I know a little about those but not to much about the big engines. I just figured if there was a gap sucking to much air will send the gas/air ratio out of wack, but Im thinking that isn't how diesel's work. Thanks for all the replies. I had never seen that 2003 message about the 16mm. I feel like a 'butt' now. I called and made a little stink about where the service manager got the .63 inches; Well .63 inches is 16mm. :-X Eh, oh well.

Thanks again! This community always has answers to my stupid problems. I think I am going to go read the 6.0 bible now! I will be prepared on the next one.

 

[F250_Lab_Taxi]

I pretty much just went in and told them about the stalling problem, but also noted the air filter gap and that it might be relative.

You are right though, too much info is never good. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[FamilyRide]

The "gap" makes it look like there really is a "gap" but when/if you can look close, or check it, it's sealed inside. The tolerance that Ford uses is the point when the seal could actually not be sealed against the housing.

If you pull it off, you shouldbe able to tell if any air is being sucked in at that joint.

Regardless, that's not related to this issue. As was said, air and fuel are not related until they mix in the intake. White smoke is odd too...

 

[F250_Lab_Taxi]

Ok, so, I have been reading the bible and what my friend said was right. On page 79:

"Air in the fuel supply can cause rough run, white smoke and loss power"

Those were the exact systems exhibited by my truck. Now, how does air get in the fuel (since I know know it doesnt get in from air filter gaps, lol Thanks all).

I should have studied something other than rocks in school /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[jas10]

Air in the fuel comes from a leak in the fuel supply and or return system. Most likely on a newer vehicle the culprit is a bad seal at one of the fuel filters. Could also be a hole in a line somewhere or a leak at one of the fittings.
-john

 

[freddyfast9]

www.gotgripe.com

 

[F250_Lab_Taxi]

[ QUOTE ]
Air in the fuel comes from a leak in the fuel supply and or return system. Most likely on a newer vehicle the culprit is a bad seal at one of the fuel filters. Could also be a hole in a line somewhere or a leak at one of the fittings.
-john

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks! Im about due for a fuel filter change so that could be it (or i hope so). As un-mechanically inclined as I may sound, I am going to attempt that and the oil change myself. lol..hopefully I wont create more air in the fuel system.

 

[grounder]

Well I am willing to bet the 6.0 fuel system is Injesting air like the 7.3 did.Just because of the quick connects in the system .I have a Airdog that I never Installed on the old tk.I plan to put it on this one.I have turned on the key and slid under tk and listend to the HFCM running.And you can tell by the little surge in the pumps sound that it is air going through it, Not steady but A little chug now and then.I know it isnt just mine because I have done this on several tks.Just someting to think about.

 

[jas10]

I looked at those quick disconnect's today. They look like a better design than what's on the 7.3. Not saying they won't leak - they still might, but I'm content to leave mine alone.
-john

 

[firesoutmatt]

I did the pre-pump mod and fuel tank mod on my 01 and was told that they "fixed" that problem on the newer ones. I guess I could try the clear tubing trick and see if any air is getting in. That would be the only way to know for sure. I havn't heard of this being a problem before this post ? If anybody finds out I'm sure they will make a mod kit that will address the problem like the older oned have.

 

[FamilyRide]

[ QUOTE ]
Ok, so, I have been reading the bible and what my friend said was right. On page 79:

"Air in the fuel supply can cause rough run, white smoke and loss power"

Those were the exact systems exhibited by my truck. Now, how does air get in the fuel (since I know know it doesnt get in from air filter gaps, lol Thanks all).

I should have studied something other than rocks in school /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

But didn't you say the smoke came from under the hood (not the exhaust)? Guess I should go back and read it to make sure I'm not halucinating. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[lawrencekm]

Rough running and white smoke can also be caused by low oil levels. Had this happen on a few diesels , 7.3's and on a few dumptrucks