[Mooman333]

I have been running the W85 and W80 for about 1000-1500 miles now. I had a diesel fuel pump right before the LP and it has already stopped working.

My issue is that the stock lift pump works fine on D2, but will not pull W85 or W80 through my 2 micron filter on my WMO aux tank.

I tried searching and it seems no one else has this issue? I saw one person reference an autozone part number E 8012 S, but i could not find it on there website.

Does anyone have a suggestion for a good inline fuel pump to use for W85 / W80 ?

Can you ruin these electric pumps from them getting to hot? I had it right near engine and my return fuel line T's into the incomming line right before the electric pump, so it sees a lot of hot fuel.

Thanks for the help guys.

 

[IDIABUSE]

I was planning on bying a better pump, but when I switched to W85 the holley blue I have been using worked better with the W85 better than with D2.
I did completely revamp my whole fuel system with large #10 line from the tanks to the pump and #8 from the pump to the engine and return.
The pump was modified by deactivating the bypass, a small transmission steel ball does the job after you remove the spring.
I use a Mallory 4309 bypass regulator at the filter head.

With the W85 it works great, no more rough idle when running low on fuel like it did with D2 and using a pressure gauge helps me know what is going on. I pump the pressure about 6/8 psi


Javier

 

[kerrynzl]

Holley Blue and Pro-Comp pumps are a waste of time.

My Theory was to mount a 14psi pump at the rear then use a Regulator after the filter to bring the pressure down to about 5-7 psi at the "banjo" of a Bosch VE pump [ with internal rotary vane lift pump ]

I bought both the Holley Blue and Pro-Comp pumps to test. The problem with them is they are high speed rotary vane pumps which work great on D2 or Gasoline!
Chuck a bit of W85 in it [ I used WATF90 ] and it will cavitate and free rev after about 15 - 20 seconds.
I pulled both pumps appart and cleaned them out, reassembled them and they were fine on D2 and Gasoline again, I retested with WATF90 and it cavitated again.

What you need is a slow positive displacement pump.
A Mallory is a gear pump which is more promising but I never tested one!

The Holley and Pro-Comp Regulators have a tiny little hole with a spring loaded ball-bearing to control pressure, once a thicker fluid gets under it , it can't regulate pressure properly.

The pump I would recommend is a Walbro FRB-5 , it is a reciprocating piston pump [ like a facet ] but has a 3/4" piston, Continous Duty and the pump cycles only when fuel is demanded.
And 11psi [ this alone would extend filter life ]

I was talking to the Chief technician for Bosch Diesel in NZ about a week ago! He claimed that all pumps are set up on a test bench with 5 psi pressure at the banjo, but in a vehicle they have to pull a vacuum.

He also said that with 11 psi at the IP you would notice the difference on the dyno, His pump of choice was the good old USA made Walbro.[ unfortunately I can only borrow one in NZ ]

Note: I have a NZ made reciprocating piston pump on my vehicle, it will push WATF90 through the filter even when cold.
My NZ made pump was given to me "free" for R & D so I tested it back to back with the "borrowed" Walbro using a Tee fitting and a vacuum / pressure guage while driving [ the Walbro is actually better ]

 

[slowdiesel16]

I have put around 9,000 mile and not one problem with my pump have 1/2 from my 1/2 pick up 35 pre pump filter then a 2 post pump filter, its easyer for the pump to push then pull

 

[Jeffrey S Brooks]

I have been running the W85 and W80 for about 1000-1500 miles now. I had a diesel fuel pump right before the LP and it has already stopped working.

My issue is that the stock lift pump works fine on D2, but will not pull W85 or W80 through my 2 micron filter on my WMO aux tank....

Thanks for the help guys.

Shouldn't you be considering there is a problem with your process, or your blend, or your aux. setup if your lift pump will pull D2 but not your blend through the fuel filter?

 

[IDIABUSE]

Holley Blue and Pro-Comp pumps are a waste of time.

My Theory was to mount a 14psi pump at the rear then use a Regulator after the filter to bring the pressure down to about 5-7 psi at the "banjo" of a Bosch VE pump [ with internal rotary vane lift pump ]

I bought both the Holley Blue and Pro-Comp pumps to test. The problem with them is they are high speed rotary vane pumps which work great on D2 or Gasoline!
Chuck a bit of W85 in it [ I used WATF90 ] and it will cavitate and free rev after about 15 - 20 seconds.
I pulled both pumps appart and cleaned them out, reassembled them and they were fine on D2 and Gasoline again, I retested with WATF90 and it cavitated again.

What you need is a slow positive displacement pump.
A Mallory is a gear pump which is more promising but I never tested one!

The Holley and Pro-Comp Regulators have a tiny little hole with a spring loaded ball-bearing to control pressure, once a thicker fluid gets under it , it can't regulate pressure properly.

The pump I would recommend is a Walbro FRB-5 , it is a reciprocating piston pump [ like a facet ] but has a 3/4" piston, Continous Duty and the pump cycles only when fuel is demanded.
And 11psi [ this alone would extend filter life ]

I was talking to the Chief technician for Bosch Diesel in NZ about a week ago! He claimed that all pumps are set up on a test bench with 5 psi pressure at the banjo, but in a vehicle they have to pull a vacuum.

He also said that with 11 psi at the IP you would notice the difference on the dyno, His pump of choice was the good old USA made Walbro.[ unfortunately I can only borrow one in NZ ]

Note: I have a NZ made reciprocating piston pump on my vehicle, it will push WATF90 through the filter even when cold.
My NZ made pump was given to me "free" for R & D so I tested it back to back with the "borrowed" Walbro using a Tee fitting and a vacuum / pressure guage while driving [ the Walbro is actually better ]

Well I cant disagree with you on the waste of time part.
If you need vacuum to get fuel to the pump then you
are needing a different style of pump.
I modified my truck so that I have GRAVITY FED pump
wich makes the performance of the pump what it is supposed
to be.
If you read in the directions that come with a HOLLEY pump
It clearly states the pump needs to be GRAVITY FED.

So to try and suck fuel to a HOLLEY/PRO COMP pump Yes it
is a waste of time...


Javier

 

[Mooman333]

Shouldn't you be considering there is a problem with your process, or your blend, or your aux. setup if your lift pump will pull D2 but not your blend through the fuel filter?

When running D2, it only goes through the stock Mercedes fuel filter system. When I engage the solenoids, it swithes to the aux tank. There is a Davco 380 fuel/water sepearator with a 2 micron filter in it right at the aux tank, and the stock fuel filter system is bypassed. THe way that the Davco filter system is operated, it has to be pulled through the Davco, not pushed through. That is how it separates emuslified water, by the vaccume created turbulance inside the Davco housing.

So it sounds like I need a Walbro FRB-5 for my electric pump.

 

[kiarasue]

If you have too pumps, put one at the tank as a pusher. I use a Walbro lift that can run 150 psi all day long. My pusher is a Carter 4070. The least amount of suction the less air in the fuel plus the 7psi the pusher puts out shows up in the front side. I also put a external fuel reg. Its set to 105psi. The higher pressure kills the vapors

 

[kerrynzl]

Well I cant disagree with you on the waste of time part.
If you need vacuum to get fuel to the pump then you
are needing a different style of pump.
I modified my truck so that I have GRAVITY FED pump
wich makes the performance of the pump what it is supposed
to be.
If you read in the directions that come with a HOLLEY pump
It clearly states the pump needs to be GRAVITY FED.

So to try and suck fuel to a HOLLEY/PRO COMP pump Yes it
is a waste of time...


Javier

Hey mate, I've had many years experience with "Dry-sump" systems on a race car [ the problems are very similar and failure is very expensive ]

All pumps need to suck fuel to the head, even when you mount a Holley below the tank the fuel feed is usually through the top [ for manufacturers safety ] Once the pump actually syphons it becomes gravity fed.

The two pumps I tested were Brand-new Holley Blue and a Procomp [ both rated at 14psi so they would need a regulator ]
I bench tested them with different fuels.[ I never mounted them in the vehicle ]

My Truck uses a Zexel IP [ Bosch VE ] which has a rotary vane lift pump integral with the IP. When I mounted a guage between the fuel filter and IP it pulls a vacuum.
The Bosch Tech I talked to said they bench test them with 5 psi ,but in the real world they actually pull a vacuum.

With my present truck the Zexel is very sensitive to fuel filter restrictions [ after 1000kms the truck showed symptoms of blocked filters] I never had this issue with other vehicles on WMO
I sent a filter back to the manufactuer to analyze it, it was OK and could've been re-used [ if they didn't cut it open ] A pusher pump at the back has extended filter life and increased performance substantially.

The problem with Rotary Vane pumps [ Bosch and Holley and Procomp ] is they are very viscousity sensitive and work better with lower speeds in higher viscousity liquids.
On a Bosch VE it turns at 1/2 engine speed [ approx 1500rpm ] but the small diameter vane in a Holley spins 2x that.

On a dry-sump system you would never see a vane pump, they are always Gear pumps or Gerotor Pumps.
A Mallory is a gear pump [ they are very good also ] but heat will kill them.

A Walbro FRB-5 is what I recommend as a pusher [ helper] pump at the back pre filter for a VE pump [ you lose approx 5 psi across the filter head ], They are US Coast Guard approved.

 

[rsr911]

I admittedly have not read the whole thread but I have posted in this forum previously about poor experiences with the Holley pump as well as a Hummer H1 style pump, both in a gravity fed setup (well at least below the tank). On blends I could not get good pressure and the pumps did not last. The BEST pump I have found for the IDI is simply the stock pump which happens to be a diaphragm style.

 

[Mooman333]

Kerry,

you are recommending the Walbro as a good assistant pusher pump. My problem is that i don't think i can push fuel through the Davco 380 becasue it is made to operate with a vaccume pulling fuel through. It cleans and dewaters fuel by the vaccume creating a turbulance inside the housing. THerefore i need a good suction pump. This one i use now is just a generic D2 pump from O'reillys auto parts (which stopped working after 1000-1500 miles).

Thanks for the good info so far.

 

[IDIABUSE]

The Holley and Pro-Comp Regulators have a tiny little hole with a spring loaded ball-bearing to control pressure, once a thicker fluid gets under it , it can't regulate pressure properly

yea that is the downfall of that pump.
I used to hate that pump for drag cars, many holed pistons from lack of fuel on the top end.
I never had the holed pistons, but all my buddies did, I learned from their mistakes.
My holley on my diesel truck was a throw away it was brand new but hurricane Katrina rusted the bypass shut so I liked it, and took it for free, maybe that is why it has been working so good since 2005>> :jester:

After 9 years in my Ranchero I never burnt a spark plug or holed a piston, I did finally split the block.
180 hp NOS with a 351W and automatic AOD best run 6.7 @107mph 1/8 mile
220 GPH Barry Grant fuel pump with #10 feed and return using the stock fuel tank.