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This was a "Ford Q & A" that was recently released and posted by a Ford diesel tech on another site.




6.0L & 6.4L Power Stroke Diesel
Super Duty and Excursion Air Filtration Q&A



Q : Don't all filters stop the same amount of contaminants from getting into the engine and turbo?


A: Absolutely not! The 6.0L and 6.4L OE filters, produced by Donaldson Company, Inc., stop 99.99% of contaminants the size of one micron or larger. Some aftermarket filters trap only 95%. What does this mean to an owner? Driven in the same conditions, a 95% filter would pass 50 grams of contaminant through to the engine that would be trapped by the OE filters! Even a 99.00% filter would pass 10 grams of contaminant. This could mean an early end to your engine or turbo.



Q: Won't aftermarket airbox modifications, which use a lower priced filter, save me money?


A: Don't be fooled by aftermarket tactics of comparing the cost of one filter because you also need to know how often you'll need to change filters. The 6.0L and 6.4L OE filters hold more than three pounds of dust, dirt and soot. The aftermarket kits tested by Donaldson Company, Inc. held about half this amount. And don't forget, if these aftermarket replacement filters are less than 99.99% efficient, they pass some contaminant through to the engine that the OE filter would have stopped!



Q: How frequently do the 6.0L and 6.4L OE air filters need to be changed?


A: Everybody's driving habits and environments are different. Owners/Dealers should check the air filter restriction gauge (located on the upper housing of the air cleaner assembly) at each oil change interval to determine when the filter needs to be changed. Some vehicles also have a dash light that will illuminate when the filter needs to be changed. No replacement is necessary until the filter minder (or dash light) gives indication.



Q: My filter minder doesn't seem to move, so shouldn't I check or change the filter to be safe?


A: The filter minder is a gauge that starts registering only after the filter reaches a certain point of being filled. This is why owners do not see it consistently move (like a gas gauge). Rest assured, the filter minder works and there is no reason to check on the filter by removing the airbox cover, thereby increasing the risk of contaminants entering the air intake system. Remember, the 6.0L and 6.4L OE air filters hold more than three pounds of contaminant – so it will take some time to fill!



Q: I want maximum airflow through the system to provide more power. Don't some aftermarket filters provide more airflow than the 6.0L or 6.4L OE air filters?


A: Airflow should not be the determining factor in buying a filter. Think about it: would you ever operate without a filter in place even though you'd get maximum air flow? High airflow generally means the filter is less efficient at stopping contaminants, too. Owners should instead look for the combination of three factors: airflow, how small of contaminant the filter will stop, and how much contaminant the filter will hold. The 6.0L and 6.4L OE filtration systems provide a great combination and it comes standard on all Super Duty and Excursion trucks!



Q: If the 6.0L and 6.4L OE filtration systems are so effective and efficient, why would anybody pay to modify them?


A: Excellent question. It makes no sense to pay hard earned money to go backwards in technology – especially considering that such modifications may even put future warranty repairs in jeopardy. You invested in your 6.0L or 6.4L Power Stroke Diesel truck to provide years of dependable service. Ford engineered it with a great filtration. So just why would anyone pay to modify it?
 

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<sarcasm>

That's impossible. Everything supplied by the OEM is substandard and cheapened by the evil "bean counters" of the world. There's no way an OEM would supply superior components that they've verified will benefit their product over the long term.

There's absolutely nothing that the aftermarket can't do better.

</sarcasm>

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

- Jay
 

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I'm about as cynical as they come about the motivations and methods of auto manufacturers... but in the case of the Donaldson filters, I think they really did hit a home run. (They even offer them as a retrofit kit on the 7.3L Superduties, BTW). Sure, the housing cosmetics suck on the 6.0L but functionally I don't see how you could possibly surpass this thing. Sorry for the aftermarket filter guys, but they should stop trying to con people into giving up their OEM filters (and hard earned cash!) on the 6.0L and 6.4L Powerstroke trucks.

Duncan
 

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[ QUOTE ]
I'm about as cynical as they come about the motivations and methods of auto manufacturers... but in the case of the Donaldson filters, I think they really did hit a home run. (They even offer them as a retrofit kit on the 7.3L Superduties, BTW). Sure, the housing cosmetics suck on the 6.0L but functionally I don't see how you could possibly surpass this thing. Sorry for the aftermarket filter guys, but they should stop trying to con people into giving up their OEM filters (and hard earned cash!) on the 6.0L and 6.4L Powerstroke trucks.

Duncan

[/ QUOTE ]

BRAVO!!

Very well put.
 

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Sounds like Donaldson is trying to sell more filters. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

In reality, an air filter doesn't need to be 99.99% efficient to 1 micron. Soot particles produced during combustion can be larger than that...
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Sounds like Donaldson is trying to sell more filters. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

In reality, an air filter doesn't need to be 99.99% efficient to 1 micron. Soot particles produced during combustion can be larger than that...

[/ QUOTE ]

I suspect it's more about the turbo(s) than the cylinders...

Duncan
 

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Indeed.... My open weave filter is the best thing since sliced bread....

The guy that sold it to me promised me that it wouldn't void my warranty (but he did forget to sign the waiver that they would replace my turbo or engine if it dusted). Still, he's a likeable chap and did point out that his system was much more attractive and had better "tone" than the stock set-up.... After all, these are the important features, right?

Now, there's a real a$$hole at our local dealer.... He told me that the lack of power and the high oil consumption was because my filter passed too much dirt. What does he know???? He had the balls to tell me that a properly serviced stock filter was all I would ever need. I think Ford is passing the buck....
 

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I suspect it's more about the turbo(s) than the cylinders...

Duncan

[/ QUOTE ]

What's produced in the cylinders goes through the turbo.

[/ QUOTE ]

The backside, yes.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I suspect it's more about the turbo(s) than the cylinders...

Duncan

[/ QUOTE ]

What's produced in the cylinders goes through the turbo.

[/ QUOTE ]

The backside, yes.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly, I meant the clean air side of the turbos, where you have those vanishingly small clearances.

Plus even if we're talking the cylinders, isn't soot fairly "soft" while dirt and sand and stuff is pretty abrasive, even for an equal particle size?

Duncan
 

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Duncan -- Your question is obviously rhetorical. Any dirt getting into the intake past the filter can cause dusting of the turbo and cylinder wall scoring, if in sufficient quantities. Here's my rhetorical question -- Why would anyone risk damage to a $13K engine that will not be covered by warranty for using an inferior after market filtration system? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Duncan -- Your question is obviously rhetorical. Any dirt getting into the intake past the filter can cause dusting of the turbo and cylinder wall scoring, if in sufficient quantities.

[/ QUOTE ]

It wasn't completely rhetorical. He was asking why bother filter to that small a particle size, when the soot particles generated inside the engine are already bigger than that. My initial thought was that the turbo has tighter clearances than the cylinders... but then it also occurred to me that all tiny particles are not created the same, and the external ones could be much more abrasive than the soot ones.


[ QUOTE ]
Here's my rhetorical question -- Why would anyone risk damage to a $13K engine that will not be covered by warranty for using an inferior after market filtration system? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

To gain "20 HP" and because the aftermarket companies swear there's no risk? Has anyone anywhere ever heard of an aftermarket company standing behind a customer who dusts their turbo/engine and gets warranty coverage denied? Ever? Even once?

Duncan
 

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Just out of curiosity, what's the maximum CFM of the stock airfilter?

I know most of the mod guys claim to need more airflow, but at what point do you need more air. I know the stock filter seems to be all you will ever need unless you have a tuner, but how much tuning before you start to pull more air than the stock filter will allow?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Just out of curiosity, what's the maximum CFM of the stock airfilter?

I know most of the mod guys claim to need more airflow, but at what point do you need more air. I know the stock filter seems to be all you will ever need unless you have a tuner, but how much tuning before you start to pull more air than the stock filter will allow?

[/ QUOTE ]

I previously did the math for the 6.0L, which basically illustrates that even an aftermarket air filter with zero restriction would provide virtually no gain. Those aftermarket websites promoting such-and-such HP gains need a thorough review by the FTC. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Though there's no data to back it up, you'll find all kinds of folks who will claim "faster spoolup" [whatever that is?], lower EGT's, more power, more mileage, increased virility, extra chest hair, etc. due to the installation of an aftermarket air filter. People have a pretty strong desire to reinforce their purchasing decisions by advocating some sort of perceived benefit. I mean, heck, if you drop $300+ on a chrome mount and a K&N air filter, you want to think you got something for it, right? That's just human nature. But, it doesn't mean that there's any measureable gain to be had, other than to the vendor's wallet.

If I didn't have a conscience, I'd invent another air filter doo-hicky with "extra HP," or some other nonsense. If folks don't want to believe the reality of it, I might as well make money too! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

- Jay
 

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So Jay if what your saying is true(and I don't doubt your word) Then why are the Diesel publications(mags) conducting tests on various brands over the last couple of years, showing decent gains in torque and HP and endorsing these products?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Then why are the Diesel publications(mags) conducting tests on various brands over the last couple of years, showing decent gains in torque and HP and endorsing these products?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't read any of the mags, but I know the OEM's [Ford & Nav] tested all of them for the 6.0L and couldn't find a lick of performance gain. In fact, most every one caused problems in some other ways.

I do recall discussion about one of the mags testing intakes on a stock Cummins and reporting no gains. They did say the EGT's dropped, but I've yet to see those kinds of tests done with professional grade thermocouples that capture data for later review. If they were just watching an EGT guage on the dash, that's hardly scientific.

But, if someone can point me to a test with good data on a stock truck that shows some sort of measurable gains, I'm all ears.

- Jay
 

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Six years ago when I was still driving a Dmax one of the other site's supporters ran a Dmax on a dyno with the air filter box completely removed and the hood open, air box installed filter removed and with the element installed. Absolutely no measureable difference between any of the three.
Why mess with a system that was designed to handle the Alberta oil sand country? (talking about the last two generation Fords, not the GM)
I run a home made Tymar because it was a cheap alternative to the really crappy air box on the 99s. The big round filter won't leak around the edges. It is noisy and that bugs me. I'm seriously considering putting in the Ford/Donaldson re-engineered air box for this year model.
 
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