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Gooseneck livestock trailer weights

26K views 18 replies 12 participants last post by  Garbage_Mechanic 
#1 ·
This is basically a 3/4 ton verse 1 ton question, just my own version.
I'm trying to get an idea what a 4 horse Gooseneck trailer pin weight and total weight would be.
I'm thinking of buying a newer truck and trying to figure out if a 3/4 ton would legally work for me.
I'll probabily never get a big fiver, but I will be towing a featherlight Livestock gooseneck with 4 clydes plus harness and hay (I can deal with the horse and harness, etc. calculations. This is my friend's trailer and It would be a pain to wieght it right now.
thanks


these newer 250/2500 trucks have gvwr's that match or exceed my 95 so why not go to a cheaper truck
 
#2 ·
[ QUOTE ]
I'm trying to get an idea what a 4 horse Gooseneck trailer pin weight and total weight would be.

[/ QUOTE ]

Depends on lots of factors, but here's an educated guess:

http://www.cmtrailers.com/Categories.aspx?Category=9de2903d-3f5f-482a-b9de-d00e643d58d0

That's a 4-horse gooseneck trailer. GAWR is 10,400 pounds, so GVWR should be at least 12,000 pounds. Gooseneck hitch weight is 20 to 24 percent of trailer gross weight, so at 22 percent, hitch weight would be 2,640 pounds.

For a horse trailer, you want a Dooley. You need the stability of the dual rear tires when horses are moving around in the trailer. So forget the SRW. The real question is do you need an F-450 or an F-350 TowBoss instead of an ordinary F-350 DRW?

'05-up F-350 DRW CrewCab 4x4 PSD wet and loaded with full fuel, toolbox, and normal "stuff" will weigh almost 9,000 pounds without the trailer. 9,000 plus 2,640 hitch weight is 11,640 pounds GVW on the truck tires. GVWR is 13,000 pounds, so the '05-up F-350 DRW has enough GVWR for that load.

9,000 plus 12,000 is 21,000 pounds GCW, so well below the 23,500 GCWR of the '05-up F350 DRW. You don't even need the optional TowBoss pkg with 26k GCWR.

So for that load, get the '05-up F-350 DRW. Don't even think about a '99-'04 - they don't have enough GVWR or GCWR for that load.

And that's a different question than your farrier's work truck question. But as I suspected, your farrier work truck will also be used to haul horses, so forget about the lowly pickups with single rear wheels. You need a real truck with dual rear wheels. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/warmsmile.gif

Note that steel horse trailers are a lot heavier than that aluminum CM I linked to. A 4-horse steel trailer probably has two 6,000 pound axles and a GVWR of 14,000 pounds and a wet and loaded hitch weight weight of 3,100 pounds.

9,000 plus 3,100 = 12,100 GVW = still within the GVWR of an '05-up Dooley. 9,000 plus 14,000 = 23,000 GCW = still within the GCWR of an '05-up Dooley. So even with a steel 4-horse slant, the '05-up Dooley should be "enuff truck".

[ QUOTE ]
Mature Clydesdales weigh between 1600 and 2400 pounds...

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Hmmmm. My Grandpa had Clydesdales and Percherons for farm work horses when I was a tyke. Big suckers! Will 4 of them fit into a 4-horse slant? If they will, and assuming they average 2,100 pounds, that's 8,400 pounds of payload not counting the feed and tack. So be careful you don't overload your trailer. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif I would definitely weigh the rig at a CAT scale the first time I had it loaded for the road. NEVER overload the trailer axles, or you'll be very, very sorry. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
 
#3 ·
Smokey,
Thank you! As always, your replies are very informative. I appreaciate you taking the time out of your day. we don't use slant loads for the big horses, his gooseneck is a livestock trailer so 2 in the front, 2 in the rear, next to each other. I don't know about putting light horses next to each other, but for his teams it works.

I shouldn't tell you this, but my friend uses a late 90s GMC 2500 short bed extended cab 4x4 w/ a 350 to tow that gooseneck!! Mostly he stays local with it but I know how dangerous/illegal that is.

Thank you!!
 
#4 ·
My steel 3 horse slant in my pics weighs right at 4060 pounds (without dividers, never use'm) if that gives you any idea. Rule of thumb is supposedly weight on the gooseneck ball is 20%.
[ QUOTE ]
For a horse trailer, you want a Dooley. You need the stability of the dual rear tires when horses are moving around in the trailer.

[/ QUOTE ]
Got to dis-agree with that one. Horses can go absolutely nuts in a trailer and the worst you ever feel is a very slight momentary rocking. I've hauled as many as nine crammed loose in a long gooseneck and you'd never know they're back there. Most all ranchers, rodeo cowboys, etc, myself included, who do a LOT of hauling detest duallys for valid reasons. The exception being the big time PRCA guys with the WAY heavy LQ goosenecks with the axles way in the rear which greatly increases the ball weight. And now most of them are going to the small Peterbilts, etc. Most all duallys I see are the wannabe gentlemen "ranchers" who pull something maybe twice a year.
 
#5 ·
I'm with LMJD here. It's ridiculous to think that you need a duallie to haul four horses. The only time you're going to have a lot of movement in the trailer is if you only have one horse in the trailer. You're supposed to pack livestock into those trailers where they have little room to move about. It keeps them from freaking out, and makes the ride a lot smoother. If you've got one horse in your trailer and don't close the mid-trailer gate, of course he's gonna run around in there! But you should move him up front, and if possible, place a restraining gate (or two) lengthwise in the front compartment to stop his side-ways movement.

The OP shouldn't be the least concerned with hauling those horses on an F250 unless they are some REALLY huge Clydesdales. I've pulled plenty of similar livestock with mine and can attest that for a 2002 F250 4x4, it's no problem.

BTW, that was with a steel trailer, not an aluminum, so even more weight.
 
#6 ·
[ QUOTE ]
The OP shouldn't be the least concerned with hauling those horses on an F250 unless they are some REALLY huge Clydesdales. I've pulled plenty of similar livestock with mine and can attest that for a 2002 F250 4x4, it's no problem.

[/ QUOTE ]We haul heavy warmbloods (in fact both horse and rider are heavier this year, go figure). A trailer built for such animals weighs nearly 10K# empty! If the OP is hauling all the tack for driving such animals and the coach, a dually might be the best recommendation based on the axle ratings.
 
#8 ·
I can't say anything to the weight of the coach and associated tack (a saddle, few different bits, reigns, blanker, girth, and halter don't weigh that much) if it's for a team of horses tied to a coach. I'm just stating that the weight for four average horses and trailer for them isn't too much for an F250 or F350 SRW to handle.
 
#9 ·
Couldn't agree more, holy crap, it's not like horses have a rodeo or run around in a trailer, For one reason or another at different times I've hauled one, two or three (or crammed in four) in my trailer totally untied, no dividers, and they stand there like they're in a small pen as you're going down the road. It appears some people on this site assume because you've loaded stock in a trailer (including cattle) they automatically lose their minds??

To correct myself, when I was younger and dumber a few neighbors who found out starting a horse isn't quite the same as house-breaking a puppy had unbroke, untrained, untrailer-broke, un-ridable spoiled "pasture ornaments" would con me into hauling their horse to wherever to get rid of it, but that's a different situation entirely and an exception to the rule. Even those would haul good but of course they tried to kick the sides out of the trailer in route.
 
#10 ·
Sounds like you are hauling quarterhorses. Try thoroughbreds. LOL. Have Craig Sappington tell you some of his horror stories. I have had a horse in a partitioned stall in a slant load trailer somehow hang a leg not over the divider as you might expect but out the window. Broke the wimpy bars, screen and drop down window. Unfortunately, he sliced his leg up good but we noticed it before he lost the leg. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif
 
#11 ·
[ QUOTE ]
Sounds like you are hauling quarterhorses.

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Yessir that's all I have but not all my friends, and none of us use dividers. Going to team ropings, ranch cowboying, and formerly cuttings, my horses, or friends, get jumped into mine or another guys trailer all the time tied or untied next to horses they've never seen before and all of ours learn early in life that's the way it is and they better get along in the trailer or else. A guy I cowboy with a lot does have a tall black Thorobred and he's one of the most quiet-minded horses I've ever been around (excluding that embarassing incident at the last branding we were at). I may leave the house with only my horse, unload at a ranch, we all move cows for some miles on horseback, then all of us load our horses in the rancher's big stock trailer go somewhere else, unload, trail more cattle, etc, or whatever, so they all have to get along which includes paints, Appys, draft crosses, a few mustangs, you name it. It's not the breed, it's how they've been trained. There's been times there were too many horses for the size trailer so we'd load them head to tail in order for them all to fit.
 
#12 ·
Bah, I've got that beat. Most of the horses we've had were 1st generation Mustangs caught in Montana or Wyoming by the government. Talk about unbroke! I have divided those up before, 'cause some of those horses were just plain crazy. As for horses going crazy, I had an Apaloosa stud kick through the 2x8 boards on the floor while going down the highway. Talk about a heart attack! Had to move him to the back of the trailer while on the side of the highway and doctor him up back home.
 
#13 ·
[ QUOTE ]
It's not the breed, it's how they've been trained.

[/ QUOTE ]Well I believe that! Our draft crosses are extremely well trained (or colt was loading on his one month birthday, LOL) but some of those thoroughbreds are so hot I think the owners are afraid to work with them on the ground.
 
#14 ·
I will tolerate some partially PITA behavior out of a horse. Thrashing and kicking around in my trailer isn't one of them. My better half had an appendix gelding that was kicking in my trailer i still have a mark on my shin to prove how displeased i was at that. I forgot how tall that SOB was.

The only "problem horse" we had was a 16 year old gelding that had won the NRHA derby and pretty much anything else we entered it in from the Roping to the cow horse to the western riding. He would kick like a SOB in the trailer the second it stopped. Hobbles and a kicking chains stopped that.


Back to the original topic i haul 50,000 miles a year, i have a dualie. My only reason for that is if i blow a rear tire half asleep at 3 AM I'm way less likely to have a disaster. The dualie is more stable and just handles the bigger pin weights better. I'm smart enough not to try and take it where i wish i would have bought a 4x4 or an SRW. My 2 x 4 DRW and big 6 horse handle snow and freezing rain pretty well with the truck shod in Michelin LTX M/S tires. Dad sold the 330 Pete because it was too much of a PITA when we got where we were going to take into town or to the hotels but it pulled like a freight train.
 
#15 ·
I've been called a lot of things in my day, but "gentleman rancher" takes the cake (that'll make my wife smile!)

I haul four horses, and I haul them a lot. I did it mostly with a 3/4 ton until my left rear tire blew at 70 mph while fully loaded.

I've been driving duelies since.
 
#16 ·
Smokey, you linked to our trailer, or close to it! Ours has a stainless nose, otherwise, its a match. I forget what GAWR means. That said, my dry, empty trailer weight [4 horse slant load, all aluminum] is real close to 5k. Loaded with luggage, cooler, tools, fuel, tack, two stout 15.1 QH geldings, the lovely, svelte spouse, and Max the wonderpuppy [70 lbs+ of lab/chow mix], with my SRW 2wd 2000 F250, the CAT scale told me:
4000 front [steer] axle
4860 rear [drive] axle - so more than 8800 GVWR, with only two QHs
6200 on the trailer axles

My empty 2wd F250 Supercab weighs less than 7k, so you can see that my pin weight is in the range of 1,500 or higher [remember, full fuel tank, tools, wife, dog, etc. in the cab when on the CAT scale], consistent with Smokey's pin weight estimate.

Total combined: 15,060 lbs. Add two more QHs, plus tack, would put me at close to 17,500 and up that pin weight a few clicks. Note that with just 2 horses, in an all aluminum trailer, I'm over Ford's 8800 gvwr for the F250 [I think I have that right ...], but well under the GCWR? and my trailer's axle ratings, even loaded with 4 QHs. And the SRW truck, chipped, with a good brake controller, handles the weight great! If the younger, spunkier gelding starts dancing around back there, I barely feel it.

My experience and research tells me that a SRW PSD of my era [2000] will pull a basic all aluminum 4 horse, like I own and Smokey links, loaded with modestly sized horses [not those big workhorses or warmbloods]. If you go to a steel 4h goose, add on living quarters, or haul real big horses, you may need a dooley.

LMJD, true westerner that he is, won't coddle the hayburners like us easterners. I like the slant load and dividers; my buddy who used to cowboy out in Wyoming doesn't think twice about squeezing 6-8+ horses into a steel livestock trailer untied and hauling 'em cross country.
 
#18 ·
Other than long grades, I'd rather pull a heavy horse trailer than a camper any day of the week - they're WAY more stable. The center of gravity is way lower, they normally have more curves to them keeping the wind from buffetting you around so much, and a gooseneck hitch is 12-15" lower in the bed, giving the trailer less leverage to shove the pickup around on a curve. The extra sidewalls are nice if you have a blowout, but if you're within your rear tire ratings loaded with a SRW, you shouldn't have to worry. But I use the pickup for things other than a trailer-motor on pavement, or I'd probably have a dually as well.
 
#19 ·
Boy does that sound like the old days back home! We have the same 16 foot Hanover steel gooseneck stock trailer we got in 1971. 9 cows is pretty tight, 6 horses once (had to tie up the sturrups for that one) Started off pulling it with a new 1971 Chevy 1/2 ton, then a 72 3/4 ton (after we got rid of the 24 ft and kept the newer of the trucks), then and 85 1 ton all 4x4 of course. A few times we pulled it with the ole 61 1/2 ton ranch truck....had to plan your stopping with that one. Never came close to a problem with any of them.

Now I am as safety minded as most, in fact I live safety professionally every work day (fleet manager). But sometimes what people think you HAVE to have is silly.

However, 4 draft horses and the carriage gear is a lot. It has a lot to do with how much you do it as well. You can be more relaxed with a bigger tow rig. The comment on blowing a rear tire W/ SRW is valid, BUT I have blown virtually every tire on the rig at one time or another and never did more than pull over.

I don't like duallys but I need my trucks to work off road and duals $uck off road. I always run 35 psi in the duals so they flex a little.
 
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