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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, first I’ma new member on this site so I apologize if this thread isn’t where it’ssupposed to be. Second thank you for all the help on this site, it has beenvery helpful to me.



I haverecently bought a 4 horse trailer off a friend of mine. My truck has hauled itbefore fully loaded with no problems so I thought it would be fine. I just recentlythought of looking at the actual weights of both truck and trailer. (I shouldhave done this before but didn’t think of it.) I am wondering if it is safe tocontinue to haul with it. I also do not know what the GCWR, GAWR mean. Thespecs of both truck and trailer are below. I have a 2001 F250 Super Duty XLT7.3L Engine Super Cab. Also I live in Phoenix AZ so there are no real hills toworry about. I keep my truck up to date on anything it needs I am just afraidof hurting the undercarriage or my truck with too much weight. I wouldappreciate any advice on this matter. Thanks



My Ford Booksays - -

Rear axle ratio4.10, Maximum GCWR-20,000, Maximum Trailer Weight – 10,000


I justbought this - -

1997 CM 4horse -
GrossTrailer Weight 12,500
Max VertTongue Load at ball 1,875
GVWR – 8112
GCWR – 12500
GAWR FT5200, REAR 5200
 

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"Hauling" usually means what you put in the bed. A trailer is "towing".

GCWR = Gross Combined Weight Rating
GAWR = Gross Axle Weight Rating
T = Trailer
V = the towing Vehicle
For more, read Automotive Terms & Abbreviations.

The most the truck can tow is its GCWR minus its own actual curb weight. If you want to know its actual weight, find some scales you can drive it across. If you tell the weighmaster before you go on that you DON'T need a weight ticket, he probably won't charge you anything, but he may want you to wait for a break in paying customers. I did this at a local scrapyard when no one else was there, so they let me get all 3 weights.



There's a formula in the owner's manual for back-calculating an approximate curb weight from the GVWR minus the axle reserves. If you don't have the manual, download it free from Ford.



It also explains how to calculate the GTW from the GCWR & GVWR, and the considerations for trailer balance, tongue weight, and GAWR.




Of course, all of that is academic. Just because Ford says the truck can handle 25,000 lbs, that doesn't mean it CAN'T handle 26,000 if you drive more conservatively, or that ANYONE can hop in it and tow any-size any-shape 25,000-lb trailer safely at any speed in any weather on any road in any traffic.
 

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If it's a 4 horse aluminum gooseneck you should be OK. Plus a V-nose makes a huge difference when pulling at highway speeds. Also, how heavy are your horses? Mine have weighed all the way from 900 to 1200 so that can enter into it to a lesser degree. Best thing is get an actual empty trailer weight and then go from there. Mine is a 3 horse slant load steel spec'd with a real small tack room, but a LOT of my friends and others are pulling heavier 4 horse's with Dodge and Ford 3/4 tons with no problem.
Might add it also depends on trailer design. Years ago I got stuck with hauling a display trailer from a cowhorse event. It was a fancy Sooner, really long with extensive living quarters and the tandem axles were at the very rear where it only held 2 horses side by side like an old 2 horse. The weight on my gooseneck hitch was way overloaded. The fenders probably rusted off before anyone was stupid enough to buy the ill-designed thing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
Thanks I'll take it down to be weighed this weekend. The trailer is a CM 1997 4 horse. Not sure how to post a photo of it but it is a bumper pull. I do beleive it's a steel one. The horses I haul are mainly 900 - 1100lbs each.
 

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I don't mean to be negative, but you'll sure have to be careful pulling a 4-horse if it's a bumper pull. I assumed it was a gooseneck like most 4-horses. A gooseneck is just about impossible to get to fishtail, but that's sure not the case with bumper pull trailers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thank you both for your help I appreciate it. If this works the trailer I bought is below. The front half is set up like a 2 horse straight load, it has a divider behind those horses and the back half is an open area so anything can be hauled in that half. LMJD thank you for your honesty it’s not negative to me. Fish tailing and jack knifing are always a concern when pulling a bumper pull and I’m always extra cautious for those reasons as well.

From what I have been researching and told I know not to drive up big or long hills and also to be cautious of the weather as we get high heat here and don’t want to ruin any tires. On the plus side I have had to change trailer tire fully loaded before so that’s not an issue, I’m just not sure about the truck tire while loaded.
 

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Decades ago back in the old 2 horse bumper pull trailer days (glad those days are over), it was common to run Bandag recaps on many vehicles especially local logging trucks which speaks well for Bandag's quality. Coming down through steep mountain country I exploded the sidewall on a Bandag recap on the rear axle of my pickup. The noise about gave me a heart attack not to mention the swerving all over the 2 lane hwy. I decided the cap may be high quality but a person doesn't have a clue how abused the used carcass is that the cap goes on. It was new Mitchelins or Mitchelin quality all the way around from then on. :)
 

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Rose_v73 said:
I also do not know what the GCWR, GAWR mean.
GCWR = gross vehicle weight rating. That's the most that the wet and loaded combined tow vehicle (TV) and trailer can weigh on a CAT scale without overheating anything in the drivetrain, and without your being the slowpoke holding up traffic on steep grades.

GAWR = gross axle weight rating. That's the most weight that can be on that axle without being overloaded. fGAWR is front axle weight rating, and rGAWR is rear axle weight rating.

You cannot add the fGARW and rGAWR and know anything. It is certainly not the GVWR of the TV. For example, on my current F-150 my fGAWR is 3750 and my rGAWR is 3850, which totals to 7,600 pounds. But my GVWR is only 7,100 pounds.

On a trailer, the combined GAWR is what matters. If you don't exceed the combined GAWR of the trailer axle(s), then your trailer won't be overloaded.

On a certified automated truck (CAT) scale, you will get three weights. Compare the front axle weight to the fGAWR. Compare the rear axle weight to the rGAWR. Add the weights on the front and rear axles and compare to the GVWR of the TV. Compare the weight on the trailer axles to the combined GAWR of the trailer. Then compare the gross weight of the rig to the GCWR of the TV.


I justbought this - -

1997 CM 4horse -
GrossTrailer Weight 12,500
Max VertTongue Load at ball 1,875
GVWR – 8112
GCWR – 12500
GAWR FT 5200, REAR 5200

Most of that makes sense, but some of it doesn't.

Your trailer has two 5,200 pound axles for a combined GAWR of 10,400 pounds.

Add 1,875 max tongue weight and the total is 12,275. So the GVWR of the trailer should be 12,275. I don't have a clue as to what that 8,112 means, but it's not the GVWR of the trailer.


And trailers don't have GCWR - only tow vehicles have GCWR, So I suspect they intended for the 12,500 to be the GVWR of the trailer. But with combined GAWR of 10,400, that means max tongue weight could be as much as 2,100 pounds. So that would be more than the 1,875 max tongue weight per the specs. And it would be 16.8% of gross trailer weight, when 15% is the max. Confusing.

CM is a quality producer of trailers, so I suspect you simply wrote down some wrong info.
 
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