[redtopman]

I have a crank no start condition.


Replaced Fuel Pump and CPS. No Start.


Disconnected the wire from the ICP to see if it would start. It did not. But the disconnect causes Code P1280 which is an ICP low condition so I think this is a no start condition. If I connect the wire back up I can clear the code and does not show up again unless I disconnect.


So I am confused......After many searches disconnecting the ICP is standard in troubleshooting. But if my 2002 trows this code.....how could it start.




I am missing something here. Appreciate any help




(One more thing is I think I will replace it since I have oil present in the connecter)

 

[ArcticDriver]

The truck should still run with a P1280--ICP Circuit Out of Range Low--when the ICP is unplugged.
It is a common diagnostic to unplug the ICP because a default signal is substituted and the truck still runs...I think it was 715 base for me but I think some guys report it defaults to maybe 750.

If the P1280 only comes on when the ICP is disconnected then its not telling you anything, is it?
Seems that if it threw that code with the ICP plugged in then it would be indicating a problem.

If the ICP has oil in the pigtail then the ICP needs replacing and the pigtail is usually found to require replacement as well.
It depends on how long the oil has been in contact with the pigtail. If the wire insulation has any signs of oil penetration and degradation then its a sure bet it needs to be replaced but I found just a small trace of oil in my connector, just enough to give it a sheen under flashlight, and I gave it a spray of electric cleaner, dried it off with air and dabbed some di-electric grease on the purple grommet and have not had problems since replacement of the ICP (Motorcraft ofcourse).

I wonder if you still have the old style ICP design? That is why I replaced the ones in my trucks...they were the old style with an aluminum type mushroom cap. Maryland DieselNick said it is a good practice to just replace those old ones because they will be failing due to age and he was right on the money...as usual.

Do you have a scanner? Even a ScanGauge-II can give you ICP/IPR readings.

No Start:

http://oregonfuelinjection.com/content/uploads/2016/08/ford-7.3-94-03-diagnostic.pdf

.

 

[redtopman]

Thanks Artic driver for the quick response


So to end my confusion when you disconnect the line from the ICP it is normal for it to throw the P1280 code.


Ok the oil in the sensor was very noticeable and also in the harness connection. But I didn't see it going to the valley. I don't know if I have a new or old sensor. Probably original. will attach thumbnail.


I have an old Superchips tuner. I can read diagnostic codes but not things like HPOP pressure.


I need one......Any suggestions.


Oh do you have the PN of the new sensor since I am going to replace it since it is leaking slightly.

 

[greenskeeper79]

Do you have WTS light when keyed to "on" position?

Do you have tach movement when cranking?

Do you have fuel at the bowl?

Do you have oil on the dipstick?

 

[ArcticDriver]

Yep, you still have the earlier version in there and it should be swapped even if it wasn't showing oil...but I think they fail before they leak enough oil to get in the valley.

ICP Motorcraft P/N: F6TZ-9F838-A
And it would be tough to find a better price than Autonation:


ICP sensor, 1997-2003 7.3 (I.C.P.) : AutoNation Ford White Bear Lake | Parts & Accessories


And the one in the link is the new style and it does not require a crows foot to tighten.

.

 

[redtopman]

Do you have WTS light when keyed to "on" position?

Do you have tach movement when cranking?

Do you have fuel at the bowl?

Do you have oil on the dipstick?

No tach movement but that's normal for a 2002


Got fuel in bowl


oil good 1200 miles on it

 

[redtopman]

Yep, you still have the earlier version in there and it should be swapped even if it wasn't showing oil...but I think they fail before they leak enough oil to get in the valley.

ICP Motorcraft P/N: F6TZ-9F838-A
And it would be tough to find a better price than Autonation:


ICP sensor, 1997-2003 7.3 (I.C.P.) : AutoNation Ford White Bear Lake | Parts & Accessories


And the one in the link is the new style and it does not require a crows foot to tighten.

.

Thanks Artic Driver. I am going to order one but I don't think that's the problem. Looking like IPR maybe. I will take the sensor out tomorrow put rags aroung the hole and oil should shoot out if the IPR is working. Checked HPOP level....1 inch from top.


Maybe I can find a good scan tool.

 

[ArcticDriver]

Thanks Artic Driver. I am going to order one but I don't think that's the problem. Looking like IPR maybe. I will take the sensor out tomorrow put rags aroung the hole and oil should shoot out if the IPR is working. Checked HPOP level....1 inch from top.


Maybe I can find a good scan tool.

Testing the IPR using that method does not provide any useful values for diagnosis. It sounds like a good way to make a mess.:surprise:

A cheap but useful gadget is a ScanGauge-2.

It costs about $140 from Advance Auto and you can get 20% by ordering online. I have alot of Scottish blood and am a penny pincher but its worth every cent to me.

You can program it to read live ICP/IPR and several other metrics. Just not ECT and EGT because our 2002s do not have those sensors.

 

[ArcticDriver]

No tach movement but that's normal for a 2002


Got fuel in bowl


oil good 1200 miles on it

A guy just posted last week with a no-start that he had fuel in bowl so crossed fuel issue off the list. After eliminating other possibilities he decided to add a bit more diesel to his tank.

It winds up the pick-up foot in the fuel tank had broken (common issue) and even though he still had a 1/4 tank of fuel, it was too low and not getting picked up by the fuel pump.

So fuel in fuel bowl is not always a good indicator.

 

[redtopman]

Testing the IPR using that method does not provide any useful values for diagnosis. It sounds like a good way to make a mess.:surprise:

A cheap but useful gadget is a ScanGauge-2.

It costs about $140 from Advance Auto and you can get 20% by ordering online. I have alot of Scottish blood and am a penny pincher but its worth every cent to me.

You can program it to read live ICP/IPR and several other metrics. Just not ECT and EGT because our 2002s do not have those sensors.

Thanks I am used to making a mess. But will check that out.

 

[redtopman]

A guy just posted last week with a no-start that he had fuel in bowl so crossed fuel issue off the list. After eliminating other possibilities he decided to add a bit more diesel to his tank.

It winds up the pick-up foot in the fuel tank had broken (common issue) and even though he still had a 1/4 tank of fuel, it was too low and not getting picked up by the fuel pump.

So fuel in fuel bowl is not always a good indicator.

Good Point. Since I am retired and old I may take a few days to think about it. I have a Fuel gage and sensor coming in a couple of days so I will install it to rule out pump and tank issues. Dash mounted gage. I was going to wait until I got it running but based on what you said I will go ahead and install it so I know the tank, pump and lines are ok. With drain valve open it fills my drain pan in nothing flat so I doubt tank and lines is an issue. But to be safe I will make sure I have 45-80psi pressure to the filter.,

 

[ArcticDriver]

Good Point. Since I am retired and old I may take a few days to think about it. I have a Fuel gage and sensor coming in a couple of days so I will install it to rule out pump and tank issues. Dash mounted gage. I was going to wait until I got it running but based on what you said I will go ahead and install it so I know the tank, pump and lines are ok. With drain valve open it fills my drain pan in nothing flat so I doubt tank and lines is an issue. But to be safe I will make sure I have 45-80psi pressure to the filter.,

Its difficult and expensive to troubleshoot a no-start without gauges and a scantool.

I agree its not the ICP but oil in the connector indicates it is money well spent on a replacement. Original fuel pumps can fail in a 2002 without much warning so that was not really a waste of money either but from here on its going to be cheapest to locate a scanner.

Its also common practice to disconnect tuners and such prior to starting the troubleshooting process.

Hopefully Greenskeeper has some more ideas.

.

 

[narmalee]

going off what he's said im betting IPR connector is cracked and coil lead wire has broken off

got fuel in bowl, rpm, pressure on the HPOP and functioning EOT... IPR

also don't just assume the new CPS is faultless, have had plenty of brand new in-the-bag parts be wrong... don't always discredit something because you replaced it

 

[redtopman]

Its difficult and expensive to troubleshoot a no-start without gauges and a scantool.

I agree its not the ICP but oil in the connector indicates it is money well spent on a replacement. Original fuel pumps can fail in a 2002 without much warning so that was not really a waste of money either but from here on its going to be cheapest to locate a scanner.

Its also common practice to disconnect tuners and such prior to starting the troubleshooting process.

Hopefully Greenskeeper has some more ideas.

.

Ok I am convinced. I am getting the scangauge 2. Meantime I will change the fuel filter and inspect inside for blockage. From dieseliq I will look at fuse 22 for the fuel heater since the download says its a no start item. My fuel pressure gauge is coming in tomorrow so I will just go ahead and install it. I will wait to replace the ICP until after I get it running. I don't use the tuner program. I used the tow safe program on my 97 but removed it when I traded. If I start towing again I will use it but not before. In general my engine is in great shape. Just completed a 1200 mile trip and my mileage was 17.9, manual calculation. The truck has been problem free for years so I am not surprised So keep ideas coming and I will close this out when I get it running.

 

[redtopman]

going off what he's said im betting IPR connector is cracked and coil lead wire has broken off

got fuel in bowl, rpm, pressure on the HPOP and functioning EOT... IPR

also don't just assume the new CPS is faultless, have had plenty of brand new in-the-bag parts be wrong... don't always discredit something because you replaced it

RPM..no not on a 2002. My cps I put could be bad...got it. I do have a new old black one I can try. Not there yet. Agree about the IPR but I will wait until I get the scangauge and fuel pressure gauge installed. Thanks keep ideas coming.

 

[redtopman]

Ok Artic Driver .....Advance is now 159.99 but they offer a 25% discount... Going to pick it up.

 

[redtopman]

Ok guys. I got the Scanguage and programmed it for IPR, ICP, and displayed RPM


Prior to start
IPR14.9 (Why not zero??)
ICP 0
RPM


Will recheck setup.


Trying to start
IPR approx. 30
ICP 500-2200
RPM it showed RPM indicating my CPS is good.


Maybe I do have fuel issues!!


Comments Please

 

[Kenny78]

Heres a sheet that may help.

If this isn't ok to post please remove

 

[redtopman]

Heres a sheet that may help.

If this isn't ok to post please remove

Thanks Kenny. So it looks like I have ball park readings for trying to start. Charging batteries today. Tomorrow I will install my fuel pressure gauge and take initial readings. I now feel I have a blockage somewhere. Find out more tomorrow.

 

[Craig9409]

A guy just posted last week with a no-start that he had fuel in bowl so crossed fuel issue off the list. After eliminating other possibilities he decided to add a bit more diesel to his tank.

It winds up the pick-up foot in the fuel tank had broken (common issue) and even though he still had a 1/4 tank of fuel, it was too low and not getting picked up by the fuel pump.

So fuel in fuel bowl is not always a good indicator.

There is a good Youtube video on this very problem, That black pickup foot on the tank sender gets brittle and falls apart, the pickup also has 2 screens inside it that can get totally fouled with biological debris and totally block fuel flow.