[cyclone3565]

Just finished replacing all 24 Lash Adjusters and Rocker Arms on my 2008 5.4l 3 valve F-250. I decided to do this due to “lifter” noise. As I had mentioned before, truck has always run great.

Well we finished up (certified mechanic did it for me) and it is still making the same lifter noise. Cam Phazer are okay and do not make noise. Lifter noise is appearant at all RPM’s. Truck runs great, idles great, etc.

All Lash Adjusters we removed were seized up, none of them allow for me to push the spring loaded pin down. We were certain this would fix it. Being that they were seized up, what does that do to the operation of the system? Now they are now, spring loaded, what changes in the system. Why is it still making the noise? Is it possible these new ones need breaking in? Being that it had been making the noise for quite some time, is there carbon or something that needs to be worked off, and these new ones will do that with time. Any and all advise, wisdom, thoughts, etc.

 

[jamesrxx951]

The 3V engines are subject to possible upper end failures due to aftermarket oil filters. Some filters would break apart with the higher oil pressures of the 3V engines. What happens is the filter paper get stuck in the lube passage to the heads. This causes oil starvation and upper cylinder damage. If you have low oil pressure going to the heads I suspect the lifters cannot pump up properly. Cam journal damage occurs also that causes even more oil starvation do to the oil leaking out at an unexpected rate. If you have lifter noise an not phaser or chain tensioner noise then I would suspect a possible issue with the heads and oil flow blockage.

 

[cyclone3565]

HI James,

I bought this a few months ago and like I said it runs great. The way the oil pressure sending unit is mounted on this one does not allow me to add my own, more accurate one. All 24 of the Lash Adjusters were seized, absolutely no spring action.

When I bought it, it did have some crappy aftermarket filter on it. I immediately changed to 5w20 and MOFO filters. I have only done the first change on it, planning the next oil change here in the next week or so, 3,000 miles later. The new Lash adjusters/Rocker arms I expect are performing flawlessly. I would have hoped that I get some improvement. Do you think Seafoam in the oil for 30 minutes and driving it then an oil change might help?

 

[jamesrxx951]

never been impressed with Seafoam. I do have an issue with an additive that says it can be added to gas, diesel, engine oil, transmission fluid. How can it be compatible with all those different chemical compounds? Based engine oil pressure test may pick up an issue but not likely. Fully testing the VCT system with IDS should pick up a low oil pressure issue as it would not be able to control properly. Not sure why the adjusters would be seized though as this is something I never heard of. But because it is making noise I would suspect they are not pumping up or the noise is coming from another source. BTW, how did you verify that they are seized?

 

[cyclone3565]

HI James,

The new ones I purchased have the spring loaded pin, for lack of a better term. On the ones we removed the pin was completely frozen, absolutely no movement.

 

[jamesrxx951]

They hydraulically fill with engine oil. It takes a lot of effort to get them to push the oil out. Usually a vise. But it may also damage the adjuster. The only step in the workshop manual for checking them is this "Inspect the hydraulic lash adjuster and roller follower for damage. If any damage is found, inspect the camshaft lobes and valves for damage" If the noise is the same as before replacing the adjusters I suspect you may have an issue else where.

 

[cyclone3565]

Being that we replaced them with new ones, I actually tried to tap it down with a hammer on my workbench to no avail. Is it possible, that even though we soaked them, that we did not get all the air out. When listening to the noise it is most prevalent in the area of the injectors. I do realize that the injectors tick, of course, and when I am hearing is old school lifter noise. The mechanics are at a loss. After tearing into it, with the Lash adjuster looking the way they do, they were certain this would do it. Could it be injector noise????? The lash adjusters we took out were well oiled and there was no sludge. Cam had not appearent damage either.

 

[YT90SC]

Silly question: have you recently replaced the spark plugs? I have seen them mis torqued and cause apparent lifter type noise, and I have seen the electrodes/porcelain come loose on shoddy aftermarket ones making the same noises.

 

[cyclone3565]

I have not. The plugs have been in there since I got the truck. I did change out a few of the COPs.

 

[jimmy]

HLA's are a cylinder with a piston inside and also a return spring. The new HLA's will be springy due to no oil inside but the ones removed are full of oil and will not yield without some force. The HLA has an oil inlet check valve but for it to compress oil has to escape between piston and the HLA bore. This will happen as it should in engine with engine at normal operating temp and oil that is 180+ degrees. Effectively there is no way to hold it in your hand and determine it is bad other than to inspect for wear on the ball end where rocker arm rests.
This is what James was meaning by using vise to see if will compress and oil will escape. You would have to apply pressure, wait, pressure, wait, pressure, wait until the HLA bleeds the oil out and compresses.
Did the rocker arms get inspected for condition of the rollers and tips?

 

[cyclone3565]

Good Morning, we also replaced the rocker arms, everything is new. The Bearings on the old rocker arms are smooth, I did not see any excessive wear anywhere on the arm. The Cam shaft also exhibited no unusual wear. I did not mic it out but appearance was good.

 

[YT90SC]

Cyclone, i think I would still check the plugs. Especially if the noise is towards the upper side of the head. One thing that you could do is check the boots. If any of them are brownish or heat damaged, thats a good indicator of loose/damaged plugs.

 

[cyclone3565]

Good Afternoon,

wow and excellent point. The Cops I removed did have a brownish coating on them and the rubber smelled of exhaust. I have no oil or melted, burnt areas on any of the coils. If indeed they are loose, changing them would be a breeze, would it not. I have been hesitant due to the stories I have heard.

Now, in the old days, a loose plug was leaking oil and affected the performance, i.e. rough idle etc. Different on these engines???

 

[YT90SC]

Loose or damaged plugs generally do not show up as a miss till they pop out in this application.
If they have been changed in the past hopefully they have been antisiezed properly, if not, Lisle makes an excellent tool to remove them if they break. It is not that big a deal really. Frustrating at times, yes, but still not that big a deal.
Proper torque, proper antisieze application and motorcraft plugs.

 

[cyclone3565]

I have picked up (8) of Motorcraft's finest along with a 9/16 socket. On standby also the Lisle 65600 tool, purchased the last one that Oreilly's had!! So I am ready. Will begin in the morning and update as I can. Only thing I have not decided yet is whether I want to bite the bullet and purchase new COP's.

 

[chuckster57]

If your not getting a P03XX code, no need to change them.


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[YT90SC]

Chuckster is right. I'd add that the boots can be replaced without the coil.

 

[cyclone3565]

Well I figured that if I am going to pull them I might as well install new ones, that way I have a nice history. COP's, 2 out of the eight are Motorcraft (I installed them), the other 6 are some aftermarket stuff. I am not popping any codes at all.

 

[cyclone3565]

All 8 plugs came out without any issues, very scary though. 4 of the eight were hand tight only, 2 i needed a bit of ratchet help and 2 were tight. Of the eight plugs, 4 did not have any electrode left. Replaced with brand new SP-515, complete with Anti-seize, torqued to 28 to 30 pounds, replace 5 Coil Packs, now they are all Motorcraft again. Noise is completely gone, quiet as a Church Mouse, absolutely wonderful.

 

[chuckster57]

That's great! Last one I did, 7 of the 8 plugs came apart. Took me about 3-4 hours to change all the plugs.


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