[Egab]

Hi guys, I've been researching for days and can't figure this out.

Goal is a trailer for f350 SRW 4x4 extended cab, to tow 9000lb excavator + attachments (1-2000lbs). So I'd be looking at a 16k trailer.

Is this possible, legally? I'd plan to gooseneck, instead of bumper pull.

I see gcwr 20k, but also, I've read threads on here that that is not my legal limit, and can use basically gvwr of f350 + gvwr of trailer, and ad long as that combined is under 26k, I'm legal??

Also, from this thread, only thing limiting f350 bumper tongge weight is the hitch attachment. So if I change that, I can do 13.7k on bumper, which is same as if I did gooseneck. To me it doesn't make sense these are equal, right???

99 f350 crew cab, long bed towing capacity

Gentlemen, I'm the unfortunate owner of a 2008 f250 superduty with the 6.4 diesel. 60,000 miles, 3 radiators, 2-blown turbo gates, exhaust sensor later i've wised up and believe its time to go back to whats been proven and reliable in fords lineup of diesel trucks. I'm looking at buyin a...

www.thedieselstop.com

And link below with these tables (assuming 2000is same as 1999), it's basically saying a DRW is less capable!? I know they are taking gcwr-weight so the dually basically is a penalty... Doesn't make sense

2000-2020 Ford F-350 Towing Capacities

The Ford F-350 is a powerhouse when it comes to towing capacity, but it has evolved over the years to become what it is today.It was interesting to look at the numbers from earlier models

letstowthat.com

So, could someone straighten me out, what I need to do to tow 16k on 99 f350 SRW, gooseneck trailer to maintain some safety/stability, so if I get pulled over I don't get any tickets?

I'm in Michigan btw.

 

[klhansen]

You need to look at your axle load ratings as well as GCWR. In the second chart you linked to, they're reporting trailer weights, and while the SRW and DRW have the same GCWR, the DRW is heavier because of 4 rear wheels and a physically heavier rear axle, so that that subtracts from the load capacity.

That being said, these trucks can be overloaded and still operate somewhat safely. There are tons of them running around that way. As far as being legal, that's another story, but unless you are commercially licensed and required to stop at weigh stations, you're probably not likely to get pulled over. But it varies by state, and how strict the particular LEO might be.

If you want to be strictly within the load limits the factory recommends, you should take it to a scale and weigh each axle.

 

[DENNY]

GVWR takes into account several factors. Brakes/springs/tires/HP/ect, all play a part the it comes to operating a truck trailer at Highway speeds. A DRW truck weighs more than a SRW but the brakes are the same so that is the limiting factor, you have to stop that load. The answer to insure you have no problems if stoped is simple. Sell the truck you have a get one with a higher GVWR. I am sure that is not what you want to hear but it is the straight answer. DENNY

 

[Egab]

Ive got the opportunity to move some equipment between plants for the manufacturing company I work for, about 2.5hrs distance one way, so I guess my question is: Is my legal limit gcwr? Or gvwr truck + gvwr trailer?

Also, if I do anything moving for any profit, my understanding is I would have to get a CDL, class B, for this? (I'm staying under 26k)

Which would make me a "commercially licensed" driver (I'd have to get some sort of insurance, either by myself or through the company I already work for). Therefore I have to pull into truck stops?

And if a LEO sees me pulling equipment such as excavator, mill/lathe, bundles of steel, or even just all this under canvas tarps, does this mean I am likely to be stopped? I guess also at this point, am I supposed to be weighing in?


Denny,
this comes my question, what do I need? Is there data saying I actually need a higher gvwr? 99 f350 SRW and DRW have the same gcwr... Not trying to be a smartass, I'd like to get this more to finite proof with some numbers/data

As much I can figure, I'd have to:
-Weigh out just my vehicle with full tank/me in it, subtract from gvwr to find how much "tongue weight" Im allowed to have to be within gvwr for my 99 f350 SRW.
-Get a scale to measure the tongue weight loaded up.
-Make sure the 2 weights above are under 9900 gvwr of my truck on the door sticker, and that when I weight out (if I have to?) my total weight is under 26k (which it will be).

if I clear out my truck for these rides, and keep the weight down <7500, I have 9900-7500=2400lbs
if I balance out the load on my 16k trailer correctly, I could get down to 15% tongue weight (I understand 15-25% is typical) 16000*.15=2400lbs.



To be clear, if I was going to be moving prefessionally, every day, for sure I would sell and buy a dually. This "job" for my work would be a one time contract for some relocation, I'll do a couple trips/week for the next month or 2, then it's done. After that anything would be local. This job would help me offset the purchase of my trailer, and I would help them by doing the work "cheaper". When I get serious later, I'll likely step up to f350 DRW, or my dream of F450 dually w/4.30 rear end

 

[DENNY]

The data is Ford saying you truck is only good to 20,000 lbs GCWR. If you want more call your insurance and ask if you will be covered in an accident if you are above GCWR, then call the state troopers and ask what the state laws say. If you decide to pull over the GCWR making sure the trailer tongue weight is is correct is very important from both a truck and trailer standpoint. Anyone that has had a tail heavy trailer wag them on the road knows how dangerous it can be, be prepared to stop and shift the load if it is not right. I have pulled over GCWR with my SRW. I made sure trailer load was balanced/good brakes on both truck and trailer /airbags on truck so it sat level and stayed under 55 MPH. Will the truck do it? Should pull fine but you are past the limits the truck was made for slowing down will go a long ways toward keeping you safe. DENNY

 

[Big Horn]

From the below linked article:

“When it comes to negligence or the failure of the driver’s “duty to tow only that which the vehicle is designed to tow,” Dean and other attorneys we spoke with about this issue agree: If there’s an accident and the towing vehicle isn’t properly configured for the trailered weight, the injured person or persons will probably win any ensuing lawsuit.”

Tow Ratings and the Law: Discussing the Limits of Trailer Size

Things to know about a tow rig’s limitations, and how they can affect personal safety and financial well-being. Tow Ratings and the Law.

www.trucktrend.com

 

[Big Horn]

Now, let me ask a rhetorical question, how many of you, if you had a spouse and or children killed in a vehicle collision would not move heaven and hell to put that person behind bars if it was a known fact that the driver at fault had willfully and methodically planned to severely overload and transport on public roads and highways?

 

[Egab]

Denny, big horn, I really appreciate your replies and perspectives. Yes I would be extremely angry if there was ever an accident to a loved one that could have been avoided

Would 16k trailer be ok to pull in a 2000 F350 DRW?

 

[DENNY]

The GCWR for a 2000 is the same as a 99 F350 SRW. Denny

 

[Egab]

The GCWR for a 2000 is the same as a 99 F350 SRW. Denny

Ah yes, but I was asking about a dually this time - 2000 F350 DRW. This one would be crew cab.

I'm guessing this doesn't make a difference? Or, in fact, makes it worse?

 

[Greg03PSD]

From the data I could find, the 2000 DRW has a rated capacity slightly less than the SRW. My guess is that the 300-400 lbs lower rating is due to the higher curb weight of the DRW from the 2 extra wheels/tires and any other differences that cause the DRW to weigh more than an equivalent SRW. The only trucks from the 7.3 era that are rated to legally tow your 16k trailer are the F-450/550. All variations of the F-250/350 come up 2000-3000 lbs short. The engine and transmission are the same across all of the models, so the 7.3 has the engine power to tow it, but the F-450/550 typically comes with higher capacity wheels & tires, and a different rear end with a much lower gear ratio. The trade off with the DRW is that you get a much more stable towing platform with twice the traction on the rear wheels, and any weight on the rear axle is shared by 4 tires instead of 2 (greatly reducing the load on the tires). Even more important than the power to pull the load is the ability to stop that load. The DRW version of the newest models of the Super Duty actually gives you quite a boost in capacity over the SRW model, instead of a loss like the older models.

For any given model, you will lose towing capacity as the truck's weight increases. The GCWR may remain the same, but a 2WD, regular cab, base model truck will be rated to tow more than a 4WD, crew cab, fully loaded truck. You trade towing capacity pound-for-pound when you increase the truck's base weight. Any model of super duty will almost certainly be able to tow that trailer from one point to another, but you'll be overweight in more ways than one (exceeding GCWR, exceeding the truck's GVWR and possibly the rear axle rating and/or tire rating). As some have already mentioned - if you get into an accident you'll almost certainly be held liable.

From some quick searching I did, it looks like the F-350 in standard pickup truck form (excluding chassis cab models) was not rated to tow more than 16k lbs until the later years of the 6.0 liter diesel.

Unfortunately, the official Ford site does not include towing guides for the 7.3 models. This one starts with 2004 (sorry it's no help in this case, but may help someone decide what model is needed to tow a given trailer):
Towing Guides (ford.com)

 

[Big Horn]

Unfortunately, the official Ford site does not include towing guides for the 7.3 models. https://www.fleet.ford.com/towing-guides/

For the OP here is the Ford Motor Company 2002 RV and Trailer Towing Guide,
Scroll down to “What to know before you tow” - then there are two tables, one for conventional towing and one for 5th wheel towing for all light duty truck configurations and engines including the 7.3 PSD which will indeed show Greg’s reference to the tow rating between a standard cab, single rear wheel truck vs. the dual rear wheel. Everything up through the F350 is light duty, stepping up to the F450/550 puts you in the medium duty class trucks. And again as mentioned by Greg, further down the guide it also lists the Chassis Cab F350/450/550 which does show the trailer weights you’re interested in pulling- realizing of course that this is for 2002 model year trucks.

https://www.rvsafety.com/images/pdf/FordTG2002.pdf

 

[FDB]

Wasn't quite legal but I put over 120,000 miles on my e99, F-350, 4x4, DRW, CC, 6spd hauling 2 6200# pulling trucks.
It grossed 27,000#, on a custom 3 axle goose neck with 10,000 on the duels. Had to avoid scales and DOT for over a decade before moving up to a Freightliner and 53' van trailer. Thought that would be a bit of relief, but DOT hassles big trucks too. You might come out ahead leasing a tractor for a couple years for the job your doing.

 

[Egab]

Thanks again everyone for your comments.

I think I was a little confused, and also curious to the legalities / loopholes for GCWR. Reason being, in MI if GCWR is not printed on the vehicle (which the 99 is not), it falls back to GVWR printed on vehicle (so the vehicle + tongue weight, which would be measured just driving the truck only on scale with trailer hanging off behind).

Conclusion I've came to, since this would be a somewhat "professional-ish" endeavor for me, don't F around, and use the worst case / lowest limit (this case GCWR printed in a Ford pamphlet... unfortunately).

I think the trucks are well capable, as proven by others (I've seen on the road), to haul a little over 20k GCWR safely, as long as trailer is balanced and tongue weight keeps you under GVWR of vehicle.

Also I believe going a little over GCWR, reading the best I could into MI law I'm not a lawyer this is not legal advice would be OK at a stop on the side of the road since it legally defaults to GVWR.

If I was doing an odd job local run, say 45min drive, no highway, story would be different.

Also in this situation, cause of how screwed up GCWR and GVWR is, there is no towing capacity advantage for me to go to a dually F350 (which doesn't make sense from a safety+stability standpoint). I would lose towing capacity. Only thing would be to go F450+, which I'd like to do in the future.

So for the moment, I'll keep my GCWR in check and letrr roll 😎