[rebo10]

2004 350 HD crew
I've replaced the alternator with high output(230) and two new motorcraft batteries and still will get a slow turn over in the morning
once truck is running and the alternator kicks in it pumps 13.5-13.8
I plow with the truck as well as have a big stereo and HID lamps. had no real problem until this year. tough winter in New England and truck had to stay outside the garage.
did a drain test by dis connecting the battery neg cables and did the test light to cable/battery, pulled each fuse one at a time and no diff
checked all cables for wear/bare spots, haven't checked the grounds yet

took out the fuel heater relay to see what if any difference that would make. turned over a little faster than usual
was wondering *** is up with the charging system

 

[03powerstrokeuser]

you may want to remove and inspect the alternator connections/and retighten them...I plow with mine as well...heck of a cold winter this time for sure!!!way hard on the charging system and batts even without using the accessories ...I always recharge mine right after plowing,it is a must do,along with load testing the batts at least 3-times a year...also what weight oil are you using...just an after thought...you may want to make sure that your starter has all the bolts in place...the shock forces through the frame and engine may have left you with one or two missing...b

 

[klhansen]

Don't rule out a problem with the starter. If your batteries are staying charged (as indicated by your 13.8V output from the alternator), but you're still having trouble starting, it could be the starter going bad.

 

[bismic]

Do you see any smoke on start-up? While driving?

Also - Sometmes the AC clutch bearings fail (or the tensioner pulley's bearings) and cause a huge drag.

 

[rebo10]

here's some answers.

replaced alt about month and a half ago, connections are tight on alt
put in HO alt 230 amps, bolt right in, a tad larger, had an international part number, ran welding size cable to slave side battery

no smoke.....ever, well maybe towing and on the floor but usually none
will check the starter for tightness but when plowing don't usually hammer frame....

been running for a couple of days w/o fuel heater relay in.... spins quicker about two revs and it catches, bang and she's off!
but CEL is on, it came on when i did EGR delete and ARP studs
would tech have to rem starter to repl head studs?

also running Edge tuner....any issues from this?

thanks for help.

 

[Mackskibum]

Can't use as test light for testing current drain. There has to be a load there with key off- that's the only way you can drain your batteries. You need an ammeter located in the same place as your test light to measure the drain. You can use a multimeter, but be careful- most of these can only handle 10a draw or you can fry the meter. You are on the right track with the fuses- don't forget any that were added "direct" for yor HID lights and stereo- maybe your amp is still powered with key off?

 

[dikkstarr]

Ive had this problem on two superduties.

It turned out to be the main ground cable off the passenger side battery that goes to the block.

This cable makes a hard turn straight down to the block where the battery acid will build up and corrode this connection.

Both were fixed after grinding off all the crap on the block and cable end and putting electrical grease on the connection.

You can make a 4 ga. jumper you know is good and hot wire it from the ground on the battery to an alt mounting bolt or any good grounding spot on the engine to see if things change.

 

[rebo10]

OK, Yesterday I checked grounds on block, ran an extra ground from alt to neg terminal on battery.
when i was working on i noticed a buzz coming from alternator with nothing on...maybe under hood lamp. unplugged that and still had a buzz in alt much like a recharger for hand powered tools. slight but can hear it Dead as a doornail this morning, seems like whatever is draining is getting more hungry.
also took out the radio main fuse to make sure that wasn't a drain for the memory.
I ran an extra cable from the new alternator to the dr side battery when i installed, thinking the extra output may fry one battery, even though they are linked by the factory wire harness.
don't have a ton of hair to begin with but I'm ready to pull out what i have

 

[obsidian83]

You said you have an aftermarket radio. Check the amp wiring for that or maybe disconnect it and see what happens.

 

[legends13]

i will bet you dollars to donuts, it is the starter. I had the same issue with my 7.3. it would not start in the morning without a jump. thought it was batteries, but they tested perfect. knew is wasn't the alternator as it would start fine after it was warmed up.

Think about this:

simple electonics tells us that V/R=I (V=Voltage, R=Resitance, I=Current) If the starter requires 12V (typical center of the range for all vehicle electronics. the battery voltage will actually fluctuate from about 13.6 down to 11.1 before it is unusable) and and you have a 1600Amp battery (about what you have with both batteries) that gives you an internal resistance on the starter of .0075 ohms. Now, obviously your battery is not changing, so stick with 1600Amps. If the internal resistance in the starter goes up to even .0085, it now takes 13.6V to turn the starter, as opposed to 12V. (1600*.0085=13.6) Overnight, the battery is not being charged, and is sitting in cold weather. This causes voltage to drop. This is why you can start after running but not after an overnight. Overnight the battery voltage is lowest, AND the engine is hardest to start. This means the already weak starter that now needs 13.6V, is only able to get 12V, and doesn't perform.

Anyway, long story short, get your starter tested or just replace it.

 

[rebo10]

OK so i have a starter to put in but would like to be sure that IS the problem.
truck sat for two days and needed a jump to start. the interior lights, etc look regular......

when i key up and wait for glow plugs i hear some static over the radio/speakers (radio is off!!) then it's very slow kicking over the engine, if at all.

could there be a short in the glow plug system????

 

[legends13]

not sure about a short, but, if you want to test the old starter, here is what I did when mine went.

Take the starter to Autozone/advance, etc... and have them put it on the tester. most likely it will test "ok" BUT, have them test a new starter, and you will be able to here/see the difference in how fast the starter turns. I did this, and couldn't believe the difference, even when my old starter was "ok" per the test.

Good Luck!

 

[kvnmckillop]

dont mean to point out the obvios but i had the same problem and found out it was the little light mounted to the hood that turns on when you open it was staying on even with the hood shut

 

[rebo10]

funny thing.....i didn't have a lamp under the hood for the longest time, and just put one in the socket about a month ago.....had the drain problem before, but hadn't thought about the lamp.
i'll try anything.
thanks for the input.
the strange thing for me is the fact that i can hear a drain in the alt when sitting and all is quiet. slight buzz. alt is new.:thumbsup:

 

[rebo10]

lengends, did the truck start like it was a dead batt before, and did it die if you didn't "catch" it on the first try?

 

[legends13]

yes. When I would go outside first thing in the morning, the truck would turn over real slow, like it had a dead battery. In fact, if it was cool out (not even cold, but less then 55-60) i would have to put the battery charger on it for a bit before it would start. Of course, this lead me to believe the batteries were dead. I had them checked at autozone, as they were under warranty there, and they both tested good. Even after that, i still thought it was the batteries. My thought was that they lost charge overnight and wouldn't start well, but after the alternator ran for a bit, it boosted the charge enough to get the batteries to pass the test.

Funny thing is, I was part correct. As I said above, the issue was indeed the lower voltage of the batteries, but even at 12V it should have been enough to start the truck, but it wasn't until the batteries were pushing over 13V at a full charge that the starter had enough juice to turn the engine. Of course, the other part was the cold engine is much harder to turn over than a warm one.

I don't blame you for not wanting to buy a new starter and have it be wrong. i highly recommend the side by side test. Take the starter out of the truck and go to autozone/ advance, etc, and have them test it. Also test a new starter. if yours is bad, you WILL see a difference.

 

[rebo10]

Still having problem with batteries draining....slow start after one or two days. No start after three days.
makes a funny noise waiting for glow plugs when the batteries are low. Like static from glow plugs or some where in that electrical system.
could the glow plug system have a stuck relay or?????

 

[rcgreg]

So let's look at this logically.

You say It turns over slow in morning, how does it turn over when warm?

Think it isd the batteries? Find our for sure - you MUST measure the draw on the starter with a meter. Clamp on ammeters may work - no connections need be removed or replaced.

You MUST measure the current draw when the truck is off. There should be a small draw, if it is a large one then you need to start measuring as you pull our the fuses one at a time - to see what part of the electrical system is responsible.

Right now it sounds like you are just guessing - and that means less hair ! Not good
Take some time, think about how the electrical system works and be methodical in your diagnosis procedure.

Good Luck !!!