[erik49051]

I'm curious what other people have done. I replaced the injection pump a little while ago and was told to set it advanced a little to make up for wear, I have 270,000 on the engine I have the mark about .030 advanced. Having done a valve job recently do I still need to advance the timing? I still have wear on the lifters, cam, and gears, right?

I have also read that the marks are scribed after assembly so unless I reuse the original pump the lines may not be accurate? Is this right?

What have you guys done and just how close does the timing have to be?

 

[trailscout]

I'm new and know absolutely nothing. That said, I've been reading a lot trying to solve a different problem and have read several places that the marks on the IP are just there for getting the engine started up where a dynamic timing can be done. All say that static timing will not produce a good running engine.

 

[erik49051]

Thats the impression im getting from reading the different post but wnat to get everyones opinion in one post.

Thanks,

 

[LMJD]

I'm new and know absolutely nothing.

Some people aren't new and they still know absolutely nothing.:lol: You should have two sets of marks on your IP and gear housing. The ones at 12:00 position are the static marks. The second set, dynamic correct factory timing with the original IP are in about the 3 o'clock position. My dynamic marks have been lined up mark to mark since '91 when I bought the truck new. Had the original pump overhauled and calibrated years ago and I lined them up as they were before. At almost 1/4 million miles it still runs just like the day I bought it new.

I still have wear on the lifters, cam, and gears, right?

Nothing that's going to really effect injection timing. In all breeds of heavy truck diesel engines I've torn down over the years I never found one with excessive backlash (wear) in any timing gears. Timing chains in gas engines are another story, that's their major internal weak point that wears out first.

 

[erik49051]

so since I put a different pump on I should have it dynamically timed, right?

 

[LMJD]

I would, maybe there's an authorized Stanadyne dealer near you? They might be your best bet.

 

[chuckster57]

Timing chains in gas engines are another story, that's their major internal weak point that wears out first.

Specially when it's a SBC that uses the plastic teeth

 

[NH2112]

The GM 6.2l and 6.5l diesels used a timing chain and to compensate for chain wear you had to advance injection timing a couple degrees every 50K or so. One of mine wouldn't run well unless it was at 14 BTDC, and obviously that meant injection was taking place closer and closer to a time when the intake valve was still open.

With our gear-driven IPs, the only wear you'll see is internal wear in the pump. Get it rebuilt or replace it when hot starts become difficult and you'll never have to mess with timing just to make it run smoothly, as long as it's properly dynamically timed.

 

[LMJD]

Specially when it's a SBC that uses the plastic teeth

Holy Moley, I forgot about the plastic teeth era. Small block Fords too. Didn't the long lasting Ford 300 sixes use an oddball brown fiber teeth cam gear IIRC? Engine would last forever but when you drained the oil and found little fiber fragments that was a clue it was timing gear time.

 

[erik49051]

I worked at an autoparts store in the early 80's. We sold lots of timing chains and gears, but mostly for Pontiac's from what I remember, that had plastic gears. I seem to remember that the replacement was plastic too?

 

[Bill1013]

Since you have an N/A IDI, the timing should be set at 8.5 to 9.5 BTDC with the pulse timing method, like a Ferrett timing pickup. The timing is set at 2000 RPM. If a luminosity/pulse probe is used, then it's done with a 20* offset. You also have to have a good digital timing light. Timing is done on #1 or #4 cylinder. The line on the damper has to line up with the 0 on the timing plate.

 

[LMJD]

I worked at an autoparts store in the early 80's. We sold lots of timing chains and gears, but mostly for Pontiac's from what I remember, that had plastic gears. I seem to remember that the replacement was plastic too?

Right, but I think aftermarket offered steel cam gears and HD chains if you wanted them. Years ago a horse trainer I ran around with would always buy 3-4 quarts of oil and add along with ever tank of gas in his badly abused Chevy 350 without even checking the level first. I finally checked it out and his timing chain had gotten so worn and sloppy it had actually worn a small hole through one side of the timing cover, that was where the oil was going. His idea of mechanical preventive maintanance never went beyond Ivermectin Horse Wormer.:lol:

 

[erik49051]

Bill1013, how much did the equipment cost to check the timing? Ford wants $288 to check and adjust.

 

[drinkypoo]

Nissan KA24E has plastic timing chain guides and when they fail the timing chain will saw through various parts softer than it is if they are not replaced. But the timing chain is not considered a service item...

 

[chuckster57]

Since we're getting off the topic, Fords V8's with the two timing chains have four guides that are some sort of plastic and make a mess of things when the chains stretch. Seen it twice in the last 6 months.

 

[drinkypoo]

The timing is set at 2000 RPM. If a luminosity/pulse probe is used, then it's done with a 20* offset. You also have to have a good digital timing light. Timing is done on #1 or #4 cylinder. The line on the damper has to line up with the 0 on the timing plate.

Are the marks for van and truck different, or do you just time to a different spec?

I read somewhere that for luminosity it's 0 ATDC, is that ever true or did I just misunderstand what I read? I'm planning to check where my timing is now before I make any changes; I got a luminosity probe cheap and my understanding is that they work fine provided you come up with the right setting. I have a fancy schmancy adjustable digital timing light.

 

[Bill1013]

Don't know much about luminosity timing, but the instructions should be with the timing unit on how to operate it. There is a line on the damper, there is a plate fastened to the engine, it has a O with a line on it, the two has to line up no matter what method you time with.

 

[Bill1013]

Bill1013, how much did the equipment cost to check the timing? Ford wants $288 to check and adjust.

http://www.tooldiscounter.com/ItemDi...kup=FERV765-01

You can get the Ferrett there. They also sell timing lites. Got my Acutron at Azone $99. Most Ford dealers, there mechanic's don't know how to time an IDI unless there is an old timer there. Ask them how they are going to time it and with what method they use and at what degree they set the timing at. Should be 8.5 to 9.5 degrees. Before I spend that money to a dealer I would just get my own, then charge your buddies for timing. $50 a crack.

 

[chuckster57]

Firing order is 1-2-7-3-4-5-6-8.
So it follows that 1 and 4 are in the same position on the crankshaft as far as rotation..My guess is that #1 cylinder is less accessible than the #4 cylinder in the van.

I have no idea but that's my theory :read:

 

[Bill1013]

Firing order is 1-2-7-3-4-5-6-8.
So it follows that 1 and 4 are in the same position on the crankshaft as far as rotation..My guess is that #1 cylinder is less accessible than the #4 cylinder in the van.

I have no idea but that's my theory :read:

That's correct. Use #4.